Date: 1/21/20 3:22 pm From: Dennis Forsythe (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Re: Scissor-tailed Flycatcher, Johns Island, SC - birders welcome on that road???
I had the same experience on Sunday and I turned around and did not enter Jenkins Farm Road
Dennis
On Tue, Jan 21, 2020 at 5:39 PM Nate Dias <carolinabirds...> wrote:
> When I led fall bird walks at Legare Farms (next to there along > Hanscombe Point Road), for a couple of years they were leasing some > fields along Jenkins Farm Road. We could bird the fields, but Helen > or Thomas would first let the property owners know we would be coming. > > So yes, I think unannounced birders roaming Jenkins Farm Road might be > a problem - particularly with no bird walks taking place at present. > > It would be a shame if the combination of eBird and overzealous > listers were to cost us another birding area in Charleston County. > > Nathan Dias - Charleston, SC > > -- > flickr.com/photos/offshorebirder2/ > > "These days I prefer to hunt with a camera. A good photograph demands > more skill from the hunter, better nerves and more patience than the > rifle shot." -- Bror Blixen > > On Tue, Jan 21, 2020 at 5:04 PM Ann Truesdale <carolinabirds...> > wrote: > > > > I went to the STFC site this afternoon and found "Private Property" > > signs on posts on either side of Jenkins Farm Rd. The posts were not new > > but the signs looked new -- and that made me wonder if they were put up > > within the past 48 hours in response to birders looking for the bird. > > This road appears to be a county-maintained unpaved road, but I don't > > think that's the same thing as a *public* county road. > > > > Here's a photo of the sign: > > > https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.flickr.com_photos_131359902-40N08_49421254156_in_dateposted-2Dpublic_&d=DwICaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=unHrdQ7f15KVYgP85aHlWUSdSEdiqyFbzbVAySZc4gI&s=0IXz9jk-EjN_YGtR9GHYBUPqrDrEoSFSR9MDZc3WCF0&e= > > > > I turned around there because I definitely don't want to be birding > > where I'm not welcome, and I wondered if these signs translated to > > "Birders Not Welcome Here." > > > > Some input from the people who were there over the weekend might clarify > > whether or not the property owners along this road are OK with having > > birders driving there. > > > > > > Ann Truesdale > > Meggett, SC > > <anntrue...> > > > > -- > flickr.com/photos/offshorebirder2/ > > > "These days I prefer to hunt with a camera. A good photograph demands > more skill from the hunter, better nerves and more patience than the > rifle shot." -- Bror Blixen > -- Dennis M. Forsythe PhD South Carolina Christmas Bird Count Editor South Carolina Ebutterfly Reviewer Emeritus Professor of Biology The Citadel 171 Moultrie St, Charleston, SC 29409 843.795.3996-home 843.953.7264-fax 843.708.1605-cell <dennis.forsythe...>
Date: 1/21/20 2:44 pm From: Robert Lewis (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Re: [External] Ash-throated Flycatcher ARWR
I birded Alligator River from December 28-30. I was aware of the previous report of Rough-leg and did not see it. The 30th was the Christmas Count. I went with Jeff Lewis and another man whose name I've forgotten (sorry). Early on we saw a hawk pretty far out in one of the grassy fields to the east of Miltail Road. At first we all thought it was a Rough-leg. But it turned out to be a Red-tail with a very white breast and a well-defined dark belly band maybe a bit lower on the stomach than usual. I got some photos from a great distance and it's clearly a Red-tail in flight. I'll post them on the Carolina Birds photo page.
Just a head's up.
Bob Lewis
Sleepy Hollow NY
On Tuesday, January 21, 2020, 9:45:32 AM EST, Corey, Ed <ed.corey...> wrote:
It looks like there may have been a sighting of the Rough-legged Hawk yesterday morning. This bird in particular has been notoriously difficult to find this year, with people taking 5-6 visits before finally seeing it. The same may very well be true of the Golden Eagle.
I haven’t been paying attention to the patterns all that long, but previous Swainson’s and Rough-legged Hawks, as well as Golden Eagles, that have shown up at Alligator River seem to stick around until at least February, barring some major storm event. Hopefully this will hold true for this year’s visitors.
Ed Corey
Inventory Biologist, NC Division of Parks and Recreation
NC Dept. of Natural and Cultural Resources
919 841 4037 Office
919 208 7864 Mobile
<Ed.Corey...>
12700 Bayleaf Church Road | Raleigh, North Carolina 27614
Email correspondence to and from this address is subject to the North Carolina Public Records Law and may be disclosed to third parties.
From: <carolinabirds-request...> <carolinabirds-request...> On Behalf Of mtove
Sent: Monday, January 20, 2020 3:17 PM
To: <carolinabirds...>
Subject: [External] Ash-throated Flycatcher ARWR
CAUTION: External email. Do not click links or open attachments unless you verify. Send all suspicious email as an attachment to <report.spam...>
I spent Sunday and Monday (today) searching Alligator River Refuge for the Rough-legged Hawk and Golden Eagle reported earlier this month without success. My guess is they’ve both moved on.
On Monday, I ran into the Wake Audubon group and tagged along for a bit when they discovered an Ash-throated Flycatcher between the last two large flooded fields off Sawyer Lake Road before Buffalo City Road. The bird was along the edge on the north side of the road where there are woods on both sides of the road.
Date: 1/21/20 2:39 pm From: Nate Dias (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Re: Scissor-tailed Flycatcher, Johns Island, SC - birders welcome on that road???
When I led fall bird walks at Legare Farms (next to there along Hanscombe Point Road), for a couple of years they were leasing some fields along Jenkins Farm Road. We could bird the fields, but Helen or Thomas would first let the property owners know we would be coming.
So yes, I think unannounced birders roaming Jenkins Farm Road might be a problem - particularly with no bird walks taking place at present.
It would be a shame if the combination of eBird and overzealous listers were to cost us another birding area in Charleston County.
Nathan Dias - Charleston, SC
-- flickr.com/photos/offshorebirder2/
"These days I prefer to hunt with a camera. A good photograph demands more skill from the hunter, better nerves and more patience than the rifle shot." -- Bror Blixen
"These days I prefer to hunt with a camera. A good photograph demands more skill from the hunter, better nerves and more patience than the rifle shot." -- Bror Blixen
Date: 1/21/20 2:04 pm From: Ann Truesdale (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Scissor-tailed Flycatcher, Johns Island, SC - birders welcome on that road???
I went to the STFC site this afternoon and found "Private Property" signs on posts on either side of Jenkins Farm Rd. The posts were not new but the signs looked new -- and that made me wonder if they were put up within the past 48 hours in response to birders looking for the bird. This road appears to be a county-maintained unpaved road, but I don't think that's the same thing as a *public* county road.
I turned around there because I definitely don't want to be birding where I'm not welcome, and I wondered if these signs translated to "Birders Not Welcome Here."
Some input from the people who were there over the weekend might clarify whether or not the property owners along this road are OK with having birders driving there.
Ed is right. It seems part of the problem is actually how prolific of a hunter the Roughie is. He will come up and hunt/hover for a bit and then drop onto a kill, where he seems to stay for significant amounts of time without rising back into view. This, coupled with the sheer amount of habitat at AR, makes the bird really difficult to find reliably.
Ryan Justice
Sent from my iPhone
> On Jan 21, 2020, at 9:44 AM, Corey, Ed <ed.corey...> wrote:
>
> It looks like there may have been a sighting of the Rough-legged Hawk yesterday morning. This bird in particular has been notoriously difficult to find this year, with people taking 5-6 visits before finally seeing it. The same may very well be true of the Golden Eagle.
>
> I haven’t been paying attention to the patterns all that long, but previous Swainson’s and Rough-legged Hawks, as well as Golden Eagles, that have shown up at Alligator River seem to stick around until at least February, barring some major storm event. Hopefully this will hold true for this year’s visitors.
>
> Ed Corey
> Inventory Biologist, NC Division of Parks and Recreation
> NC Dept. of Natural and Cultural Resources
> 919 841 4037 Office
> 919 208 7864 Mobile
> <Ed.Corey...>
>
> 12700 Bayleaf Church Road | Raleigh, North Carolina 27614
>
> Email correspondence to and from this address is subject to the North Carolina Public Records Law and may be disclosed to third parties.
>
> From: <carolinabirds-request...> <carolinabirds-request...> On Behalf Of mtove
> Sent: Monday, January 20, 2020 3:17 PM
> To: <carolinabirds...>
> Subject: [External] Ash-throated Flycatcher ARWR
>
> CAUTION: External email. Do not click links or open attachments unless you verify. Send all suspicious email as an attachment to <report.spam...>
>
> I spent Sunday and Monday (today) searching Alligator River Refuge for the Rough-legged Hawk and Golden Eagle reported earlier this month without success. My guess is they’ve both moved on.
>
> On Monday, I ran into the Wake Audubon group and tagged along for a bit when they discovered an Ash-throated Flycatcher between the last two large flooded fields off Sawyer Lake Road before Buffalo City Road. The bird was along the edge on the north side of the road where there are woods on both sides of the road.
>
> Mike Tove
> Cary, NC
Date: 1/21/20 8:06 am From: ann maddock (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Re: Watch Those Hummingbird Feeders.
Just returned home and thanks to excellent care by Marcia Lyons, we observed more than 18 individually identifiable ruby-throated hummingbirds in the yard today
Two are banded adult males, and one banded female in the mix
On Sun, Jan 19, 2020 at 11:52 AM Dwayne Martin <carolinabirds...> wrote:
Date: 1/21/20 6:45 am From: Corey, Ed <ed.corey...> Subject: RE: [External] Ash-throated Flycatcher ARWR
It looks like there may have been a sighting of the Rough-legged Hawk yesterday morning. This bird in particular has been notoriously difficult to find this year, with people taking 5-6 visits before finally seeing it. The same may very well be true of the Golden Eagle.
I haven't been paying attention to the patterns all that long, but previous Swainson's and Rough-legged Hawks, as well as Golden Eagles, that have shown up at Alligator River seem to stick around until at least February, barring some major storm event. Hopefully this will hold true for this year's visitors.
Ed Corey
Inventory Biologist, NC Division of Parks and Recreation
NC Dept. of Natural and Cultural Resources
919 841 4037 Office
919 208 7864 Mobile
<Ed.Corey...><mailto:<Ed.Corey...>
12700 Bayleaf Church Road | Raleigh, North Carolina 27614
Email correspondence to and from this address is subject to the North Carolina Public Records Law and may be disclosed to third parties.
From: <carolinabirds-request...> <carolinabirds-request...> On Behalf Of mtove
Sent: Monday, January 20, 2020 3:17 PM
To: <carolinabirds...>
Subject: [External] Ash-throated Flycatcher ARWR
CAUTION: External email. Do not click links or open attachments unless you verify. Send all suspicious email as an attachment to <report.spam...><mailto:<report.spam...>
I spent Sunday and Monday (today) searching Alligator River Refuge for the Rough-legged Hawk and Golden Eagle reported earlier this month without success. My guess is they've both moved on.
On Monday, I ran into the Wake Audubon group and tagged along for a bit when they discovered an Ash-throated Flycatcher between the last two large flooded fields off Sawyer Lake Road before Buffalo City Road. The bird was along the edge on the north side of the road where there are woods on both sides of the road.
Date: 1/21/20 5:43 am From: Ron Clark <waxwing...> Subject: AT Flycatcher/Eider. OBX
No luck with the Ash-throated Flycatcher at Alligator River NWR this morning. Common Eider still at Jeannette’s Pier yesterday at 4:00. It was the only thing on the water.
Date: 1/20/20 4:31 pm From: Jan Fowler (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Re: contact with bird scientists in Bahamas?
Hi Helen,
Birds Caribbean is a great organization at www.birdscaribbean.org.
Jan Fowler Concord, NC
On Mon, Jan 20, 2020 at 2:22 PM ann maddock <carolinabirds...> wrote:
> I just replied in a separate email > > > On Mon, Jan 20, 2020 at 12:39 PM Helen Kalevas <carolinabirds...> > wrote: > >> Does anyone know any bird biologists in the Bahamas? I'm a retired >> professional ornithologist that will be visiting Green Turtle Cay, Abacos >> (Bahamas) in late March. As you know, Hurricane Dorian flattened the Abacos >> last fall so I'm wondering if I can do some bird counts that could shed >> light on numbers and species diversity (I have a good bird book for the >> region). There are (hopefully) several endangered species in that region so >> hoping I can help look for them. I contacted the Bahama National Trust but >> didn't hear back them. Does anyone have some contact info? >> Thanks, Helen Kalevas >> > -- > Ask me about my upcoming book - a photo essay of North American and > Caribbean Hummingbirds! > > > Inline image > > Ann Maddock > <am.hummingbird.photos...> > Hatteras Island, NC >
The New Hope Audubon Society, representing Chatham, Durham, and Orange Counties in NC, found the Ash-throated Flycatcher.
tom driscoll
chapel hill, nc usa
<spttdrdshnk...>
Do something nice for Earth today and every day!
On Monday, January 20, 2020, 3:16:31 PM EST, mtove <carolinabirds...> wrote:
I spent Sunday and Monday (today) searching Alligator River Refuge for the Rough-legged Hawk and Golden Eagle reported earlier this month without success. My guess is they’ve both moved on.
On Monday, I ran into the Wake Audubon group and tagged along for a bit when they discovered an Ash-throated Flycatcher between the last two large flooded fields off Sawyer Lake Road before Buffalo City Road. The bird was along the edge on the north side of the road where there are woods on both sides of the road.
Date: 1/20/20 12:28 pm From: Sherry Lane (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Carolina Bird Club Bonus Trip to Costa Rica in April 2020
Dear Birders,
The Carolina Bird Club is sponsoring a great bonus trip to Costa Rica on 4/11-4/21/20. We will be birding some of the best areas of Costa Rica, from the Pacific lowlands of Carara National Park to the highlands of Savegre Valley and finishing with the Caribbean rainforest of La Selva Biological Station. On our last similar trip to these areas we saw 374 species of birds including the stunning Resplendent Quetzal!
I spent Sunday and Monday (today) searching Alligator River Refuge for the Rough-legged Hawk and Golden Eagle reported earlier this month without success. My guess is they've both moved on.
On Monday, I ran into the Wake Audubon group and tagged along for a bit when they discovered an Ash-throated Flycatcher between the last two large flooded fields off Sawyer Lake Road before Buffalo City Road. The bird was along the edge on the north side of the road where there are woods on both sides of the road.
Date: 1/20/20 11:22 am From: ann maddock (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Re: contact with bird scientists in Bahamas?
I just replied in a separate email
On Mon, Jan 20, 2020 at 12:39 PM Helen Kalevas <carolinabirds...> wrote:
> Does anyone know any bird biologists in the Bahamas? I'm a retired > professional ornithologist that will be visiting Green Turtle Cay, Abacos > (Bahamas) in late March. As you know, Hurricane Dorian flattened the Abacos > last fall so I'm wondering if I can do some bird counts that could shed > light on numbers and species diversity (I have a good bird book for the > region). There are (hopefully) several endangered species in that region so > hoping I can help look for them. I contacted the Bahama National Trust but > didn't hear back them. Does anyone have some contact info? > Thanks, Helen Kalevas > -- Ask me about my upcoming book - a photo essay of North American and Caribbean Hummingbirds!
Inline image
Ann Maddock <am.hummingbird.photos...> Hatteras Island, NC
Date: 1/20/20 9:57 am From: David McLean (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Chased, and missed, Scissor-tailed Flycatcher on Johns Island
M 20 Jan 2020
All,
I just chased, and missed, the Scissor-tailed Flycatcher that was reported from John’s Island yesterday. I was out this morning from about 10 to noon. Bumped into Jake Zadik and a car full of Kiawah naturalists and into Dave Eslinger. Hope someone relocates the STFL.
Date: 1/20/20 9:39 am From: Helen Kalevas (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: contact with bird scientists in Bahamas?
Does anyone know any bird biologists in the Bahamas? I'm a retired professional ornithologist that will be visiting Green Turtle Cay, Abacos (Bahamas) in late March. As you know, Hurricane Dorian flattened the Abacos last fall so I'm wondering if I can do some bird counts that could shed light on numbers and species diversity (I have a good bird book for the region). There are (hopefully) several endangered species in that region so hoping I can help look for them. I contacted the Bahama National Trust but didn't hear back them. Does anyone have some contact info? Thanks, Helen Kalevas
Date: 1/20/20 3:42 am From: neilowens (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Re: Secondhand report of black guillemot at Huntington Beach SP, SC
That's a great point Harry. I check the CBC Sightings page multiple times a day. I also have the ebird Rate Bird Alert setup to email me hourly for rare birds in my county and surrounding counties. And when traveling I setup the alerts for those areas too. When I was in St. Clair, Michigan over Christmas, it enabled me to locate Harlequin Ducks, that I wouldn't even have been looking for.As for the Black Guillemot, just pure luck found me on the Jetty Saturday afternoon. My wife, son and I came down for a long holiday weekend and we decided to stop at HBSP before heading up to Myrtle to check in. We were stepping onto the jetty when I began to hear the chatter about the bird. I decided to stick around a little longer while my wife and son walked the beach, and sure enough Paul Laurent relocated the bird. Several more us us were able to see it as it was heading back out toward open ocean. I even got a view poor quality photos. Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone
-------- Original message --------From: "Harry LeGrand(via carolinabirds Mailing List)" <carolinabirds...> Date: 1/19/20 17:25 (GMT-05:00) To: Stu <sgibeau...> Cc: <Carolinabirds...> Subject: Re: Secondhand report of black guillemot at Huntington Beach SP, SC The report of Black Guillemot WAS mentioned yesterday around 11am if not before, on the CBC Sightings list. It thus allowed some down there to see it that afternoon. Once again, check the CBC Sightings. I already knew by 9 or 10 am it was not seen this morning; the Sightings list had nothing on it, and I figured 50 or more folks must have been on the jetty by 7 am looking for it. As I and some others keep telling folks on this listserve — check the Sightings listing on the Carolina Bird Club website. Harry LeGrandSitting in my easy chair in Raleigh keeping track of rare bird sightings on my iPhone and computer — like a Scissor-tailed Flycatcher found and photographed today down the coast at Johns Island, SC. How many of you heard about that one? It’s all there, even with some EBird photos. Sent from my iPhone> On Jan 19, 2020, at 4:45 PM, Stu <sgibeau...> wrote:> > Sadly the bird wasn’t there today. > > Stu Gibeau > >> On Jan 19, 2020, at 3:04 PM, <badgerboy...> wrote:>> > > I was with Matt Johnson's trip at HBSP yesterday during the CBC meeting when another group told us they found a Black Guillemot along the jetty, close in, yesterday morning. They showed us a picture of a winter plumage bird. Please excuse if already mentioned but I didn't see it.> > Guy McGrane, Deep Gap, NC> > >
Date: 1/20/20 3:41 am From: neilowens (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Re: Secondhand report of black guillemot at Huntington Beach SP, SC
That's a great point Harry. I check the CBC Sightings page multiple times a day. I also have the ebird Rate Bird Alert setup to email me hourly for rare birds in my county and surrounding counties. And when traveling I setup the alerts for those areas too. When I was in St. Clair, Michigan over Christmas, it enabled me to locate Harlequin Ducks, that I wouldn't even have been looking for.As for the Black Guillemot, just pure luck found me on the Jetty Saturday afternoon. My wife, son and I came down for a long holiday weekend and we decided to stop at HBSP before heading up to Myrtle to check in. We were stepping onto the jetty when I began to hear the chatter about the bird. I decided to stick around a little longer while my wife and son walked the beach, and sure enough Paul Laurent relocated the bird. Several more us us were able to see it as it was heading back out toward open ocean. I even got a view poor quality photos. Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone
-------- Original message --------From: "Harry LeGrand(via carolinabirds Mailing List)" <carolinabirds...> Date: 1/19/20 17:25 (GMT-05:00) To: Stu <sgibeau...> Cc: <Carolinabirds...> Subject: Re: Secondhand report of black guillemot at Huntington Beach SP, SC The report of Black Guillemot WAS mentioned yesterday around 11am if not before, on the CBC Sightings list. It thus allowed some down there to see it that afternoon. Once again, check the CBC Sightings. I already knew by 9 or 10 am it was not seen this morning; the Sightings list had nothing on it, and I figured 50 or more folks must have been on the jetty by 7 am looking for it. As I and some others keep telling folks on this listserve — check the Sightings listing on the Carolina Bird Club website. Harry LeGrandSitting in my easy chair in Raleigh keeping track of rare bird sightings on my iPhone and computer — like a Scissor-tailed Flycatcher found and photographed today down the coast at Johns Island, SC. How many of you heard about that one? It’s all there, even with some EBird photos. Sent from my iPhone> On Jan 19, 2020, at 4:45 PM, Stu <sgibeau...> wrote:> > Sadly the bird wasn’t there today. > > Stu Gibeau > >> On Jan 19, 2020, at 3:04 PM, <badgerboy...> wrote:>> > > I was with Matt Johnson's trip at HBSP yesterday during the CBC meeting when another group told us they found a Black Guillemot along the jetty, close in, yesterday morning. They showed us a picture of a winter plumage bird. Please excuse if already mentioned but I didn't see it.> > Guy McGrane, Deep Gap, NC> > >
Date: 1/19/20 2:25 pm From: Harry LeGrand (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Re: Secondhand report of black guillemot at Huntington Beach SP, SC
The report of Black Guillemot WAS mentioned yesterday around 11am if not before, on the CBC Sightings list. It thus allowed some down there to see it that afternoon.
Once again, check the CBC Sightings. I already knew by 9 or 10 am it was not seen this morning; the Sightings list had nothing on it, and I figured 50 or more folks must have been on the jetty by 7 am looking for it.
As I and some others keep telling folks on this listserve — check the Sightings listing on the Carolina Bird Club website.
Harry LeGrand
Sitting in my easy chair in Raleigh keeping track of rare bird sightings on my iPhone and computer — like a Scissor-tailed Flycatcher found and photographed today down the coast at Johns Island, SC. How many of you heard about that one? It’s all there, even with some EBird photos.
Sent from my iPhone
> On Jan 19, 2020, at 4:45 PM, Stu <sgibeau...> wrote:
>
> Sadly the bird wasn’t there today.
>
> Stu Gibeau
>
>> On Jan 19, 2020, at 3:04 PM, <badgerboy...> wrote:
>>
>
> I was with Matt Johnson's trip at HBSP yesterday during the CBC meeting when another group told us they found a Black Guillemot along the jetty, close in, yesterday morning. They showed us a picture of a winter plumage bird. Please excuse if already mentioned but I didn't see it.
>
> Guy McGrane, Deep Gap, NC
>
>
>
Date: 1/19/20 1:47 pm From: Stu <sgibeau...> Subject: Re: Secondhand report of black guillemot at Huntington Beach SP, SC
Sadly the bird wasn’t there today.
Stu Gibeau
> On Jan 19, 2020, at 3:04 PM, <badgerboy...> wrote:
>
I was with Matt Johnson's trip at HBSP yesterday during the CBC meeting when another group told us they found a Black Guillemot along the jetty, close in, yesterday morning. They showed us a picture of a winter plumage bird. Please excuse if already mentioned but I didn't see it.
Date: 1/19/20 12:04 pm From: <badgerboy...> Subject: Secondhand report of black guillemot at Huntington Beach SP, SC
I was with Matt Johnson's trip at HBSP yesterday during the CBC meeting when another group told us they found a Black Guillemot along the jetty, close in, yesterday morning. They showed us a picture of a winter plumage bird. Please excuse if already mentioned but I didn't see it.
Date: 1/19/20 9:15 am From: Michael Cheves (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Wood Stork, New Bern, NC
I birded Lawson Creek Park this morning and was ecstatic to find a Wood Stork flying overhead. At about 11:30 AM, it flew into a roost site, and as of the time of this writing, it is still present, clearly visible from the north side of Lawson Creek Park Drive. I will add photos to the CBC gallery tonight. Michael Cheves New Bern, NC
Date: 1/19/20 8:52 am From: Dwayne Martin (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Watch Those Hummingbird Feeders.
Susan Campbell is out of town, but wanted me to remind everyone that still has a hummingbird feeder up to pay close attention this week with the cold air coming in. There are still new reports of hummingbirds showing up now.
Dwayne ************* J. Dwayne Martin Hickory, NC <redxbill...>
I just returned from a wonderful winter meeting in South Carolina. I always enjoy meeting new birders.
Thank you also to Mae Howell for sharing your time share.
On coming home at the first rest stop in NC there were a half dozen Chipping Sparrows in the landscaping around the area. There were a couple of white throats as well.
Happy to be home in the rolling hills of Durham.
Edith Tatum
Durham, NC
Date: 1/19/20 6:59 am From: Dennis Forsythe (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Rusty Blackbird on James Is, SC
All,
We had a single Rusty Blackbird in a large American Robin flock this morning while we walked Charlie in Eastwood or James Is, SC neigborhood. This is our 219 neigborhpood bird.
Dennis
-- Dennis M. Forsythe PhD South Carolina Christmas Bird Count Editor South Carolina Ebutterfly Reviewer Emeritus Professor of Biology The Citadel 171 Moultrie St, Charleston, SC 29409 843.795.3996-home 843.953.7264-fax 843.708.1605-cell <dennis.forsythe...>
Date: 1/19/20 4:01 am From: Parkin Hunter (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Re: Hunting on federal public lands
I am in my house at Garden City/Murrells Inlet, SC listening to the gun shots. This is hardly off the beaten path in an essentially urban watershed. There should be no hunting here. DNR needs to be here checking what is shot.
Parkin Hunter
Garden City, Ridgeway and Columbia
Sent from my iPhone
> On Jan 17, 2020, at 11:10 PM, Clyde Sorenson <sorenson...> wrote:
>
>
> Hunting waterfowl anywhere in NC, public or private, is currently illegal on Sundays.
>
> The waterfowl impoundments were largely paid for by duck stamp and other hunter tariffs. Not saying that gives them priority, but...
>
> Most of the state impoundments are only hunted at most three days a week- an attempt to keep from completely running the birds off. If my memory serves, the Jordan Lake impoundments, for example, are Monday- Wednesday- Saturday, and the Falls impoundments (and gamelands in general) are Tuesday- Thursday-Saturday. Waterfowl hunting can't occur on the off days. The days other impoundments are open to hunting are listed in the regs books; many may be hunted by special permit only, and by limited numbers of hunters on any given day. Most also forbid hunting in the afternoon (or did... I haven't drawn in several years). My suspicion is that even if Sunday hunting on public lands becomes legal, AND waterfowl hunting on Sundays becomes legal, most state impoundments will continue to be restricted to only a few days a week, again, to try and keep the birds in the area.
>
> My biggest complaint with waterfowl management on the state level is that they maintain very few exclusive, perrmanent refuge areas, i.e., in and around the big Triangle lakes. In Missouri, the state wildlife management areas had blocks and impoundments that were never hunted and served as permanent refuges, which served to keep larger numbers of waterfowl in the area for both hunters and birders. Some of these had observation platforms for birders, as at Mattamuskeet. I suspect the WRC simply doesn't have the resources to do this around the Triangle lakes.
>
> Many of the gamelands in the state are currently only three days a week for ANY hunting; again, in the regs book; these may be available for non-consumptive use on the other days (although some are closed to the public on non-hunting days, I think).
>
> Most of the National Forest gamelands are not restricted to three days a week because of their massive expanse and the supposed dilution of hunters across a much wider area.
>
> Sorry to keep this thread going...
>
> Take care,
>
> Clyde Sorenson
> Clayton and Raleigh, NC
>
> p.s. I have been an avid birder for near 45 years now, and an avid duck hunter for almost the same amount of time. Both of these activities have been central to my existence and have helped defined who I am. However, the last two years I have basically quit hunting- not because of lack of will or interest, but because of lack of opportunity. This has diminished my quality of life some, I must admit. Hunter numbers in NC and the nation are steadily falling, and this is due in large part to ever diminishing access to land one can hunt on. While there may be something of an adversarial relationship between wildlife recreation communities, it is hard to ignore that hunters (and to a degree anglers) have carried much of the freight for protecting wildlife habitat in this country (even if the reason is somewhat avaricious), and if the current hunter number trends continue, we will have to come up with a new model for protecting wildlands, and soon.
>
>> On Fri, Jan 17, 2020 at 10:30 PM Harry LeGrand <hlegrandjr...> wrote:
>> I think most hikers and birders see the problem differently than Clyde, who is a hunter and also a birder. The problem is that 1) hunters have guns, and 2) hunters arrive at their parking area by dawn, usually. Birders and hikers AVOID vehicles that are hunter’s or likely are hunter’s, and have to go elsewhere. That avoids conflict, but it leaves the non-hunters excluded from going to a place they were hoping to visit, such as a waterfowl impoundment. Think of it as hunters being Alpha males, and non hunters as Beta males, having to go somewhere else.
>>
>> I have dealt with this issue dozens of times and I know many of you birders have also — “The hunters got there first”. Conflict avoided, but that still leaves a bitter taste in the mouth. This can now happen often on Sundays, where it had never happened before.
>>
>> Harry LeGrand
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>>> On Jan 17, 2020, at 8:54 PM, Clyde Sorenson <sorenson...> wrote:
>>>
>>> Actually, the mandate for the national forests is expressly multiple use- forestry, water protection, fishing, hunting, birding and other recreation. According to this mandate, hunting is just as legitimate a use as any other of these, so long as safety allows. Safety zones where hunting is not allowed are generally established on gamelands where congestion, other user activities, or proximity to structures or facilities mandates.
>>>
>>> Frankly, I think the concern over sharing these lands with hunters is way overblown, as experience in most other states would indicate. Most hunting takes place much farther off the beaten path than birding. In my many decades of hunting on public lands in three states (mostly waterfowl and upland birds) the number of birders I encountered in the places I was going would not fill up one hand. In my many decades of birding on these same lands, I have never been threatened, or felt threatened, by hunters. Just my experience.
>>>
>>> Take care,
>>>
>>> Clyde Sorenson
>>> Clayton and Raleigh, NC
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>> On Fri, Jan 17, 2020 at 8:37 PM Harry LeGrand <carolinabirds...> wrote:
>>>> That still does not clarify whether hunting would be allowed on Sunday on US Forest Service lands. These lands are not “of the State managed for hunting”. They are managed for timber as well as hiking, and many other activities, and not for hunting per se. I figure with all of the wilderness groups and hiking groups and conservation groups in the mountains, WRC would have a huge fight on its hands if all those hundreds of thousands of acres in Pisgah and Nantahala NF were open to hunting all 7 days a week for much of the year.
>>>>
>>>> And, this “only have one day a week for hunting”(Saturday) if you work Monday thru Friday ALSO works AGAINST that idea, as all of the people who want to hike and do birding and other non-hunting activities in peace and quiet would now lose Sunday and have NO potential day in the week to walk in the forests without fear of hunters also being out there. Hunting also disturbs and flushes waterfowl from lakes. That is why some bird counts strongly desire to hold them on a Sunday—. Free from shotgun blasts.
>>>>
>>>> Harry LeGrand
>>>>
>>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>>
>>>>> On Jan 17, 2020, at 4:01 PM, Derb Carter <derbc...> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> I think most National Forest lands are also registered North Carolina Game Lands. National Forests generally only require compliance with state game regulations (seasons, time, days, bag limits, etc) to hunt on National Forest lands. Some National Widllife Refuges also allow hunting (e.g., Mattamuskeet, Alligator River). Refuges that allow hunting usually have their own Refuge specific regulations that in most cases limit hunting significantly more than state regulations, which also apply.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Derb Carter
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
Date: 1/18/20 6:05 pm From: Corey, Ed <ed.corey...> Subject: New Hanover Birds - Wood Storks, Common Eider, Black-headed Gull -- Logistics update
Taking advantage of the weather, I drove down to the Wilmington area this morning, with a goal of getting my 200th species for New Hanover. A stop at the Laurel Lea subdivision pond, near Figure 8 Island, netted several year birds, including 2 immature Wood Storks foraging around the northwest end of the pond, and at least 4 Anhinga among the 35 Black-crowned Night Herons and dozens of Double-crested Cormorants. From there, I headed to Masonboro Inlet, picking up the continuing Common Eider drifting around on the leeward side of the north jetty. After lunch, I checked the flock of gulls at Carolina Beach Lake and found the 1st cycle Black-headed Gull that's been hanging around for a few weeks. At one point, I was able to photograph the gull in the same view as a Little Blue Heron, which surely hasn't happened too often, considering their disparate ranges! Heading south, I decided to avoid the crowds at Fort Fisher Historic Site* and head for the Basin Trail, where I picked up a cooperative Orange-crowned Warbler (New Hanover #200!) in the songbird flocks along the trail. One final stop at Federal Point/Battery Buchanan** to scan the rocks for American Oystercatcher and Marbled Godwit, and it was time to head home. Not a bad day for leisurely birding the southeastern coast, with 89 species for the trip!
*Fort Fisher Historic Site is celebrating its 155th anniversary this weekend (this was news to me). There were cards from the Air Force facility to Loggerhead Road at Fort Fisher State Recreation Area. They're also doing reenactments, complete with artillery rounds. Today, those started around 1pm, and I believe the plan is to have the same schedule tomorrow. If you're heading down, please plan accordingly.
**The Fort Fisher to Southport Ferry is NOT running, from now until April, for ramp repairs. If you do make the trip, you may appreciate this tidbit of information.
Good birding!
Ed Corey
Inventory Biologist, NC Division of Parks and Recreation
NC Dept. of Natural and Cultural Resources
919 841 4037 Office
919 208 7864 Mobile
<Ed.Corey...><mailto:<Ed.Corey...>
12700 Bayleaf Church Road | Raleigh, North Carolina 27614
Email correspondence to and from this address is subject to the North Carolina Public Records Law and may be disclosed to third parties.
I was birding on the north side of Greenfield Lake this morning when I encountered Alex Worm, who showed me a Wood Stork he had located a short time before. It was roosting in a cypress tree a few hundred feet east of the viewing shelter with the short boardwalk to it, between the paddleboat dock and the long footbridge. It is an immature, with partially feathered head and yellow bill.
Other birds seen included a Black-and-white Warbler and a Blue-headed Vireo in a large flock of Titmice, Chickadees, and Ruby-crowned Kinglets.
Date: 1/18/20 8:47 am From: Rob Van Epps (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Lark Sparrow still at Ezell, Mecklenburg Co
The Lark Sparrow at Ezell Farm Community Park in Mecklenburg County is still hanging out with a group of 30 or so Savannah Sparrows. I had the flock in the field near the community garden this morning.
Date: 1/17/20 8:10 pm From: Clyde Sorenson <sorenson...> Subject: Re: Hunting on federal public lands
Hunting waterfowl anywhere in NC, public or private, is currently illegal
on Sundays.
The waterfowl impoundments were largely paid for by duck stamp and other
hunter tariffs. Not saying that gives them priority, but...
Most of the state impoundments are only hunted at most three days a week-
an attempt to keep from completely running the birds off. If my memory
serves, the Jordan Lake impoundments, for example, are Monday- Wednesday-
Saturday, and the Falls impoundments (and gamelands in general) are
Tuesday- Thursday-Saturday. Waterfowl hunting can't occur on the off days.
The days other impoundments are open to hunting are listed in the regs
books; many may be hunted by special permit only, and by limited numbers of
hunters on any given day. Most also forbid hunting in the afternoon (or
did... I haven't drawn in several years). My suspicion is that even if
Sunday hunting on public lands becomes legal, AND waterfowl hunting on
Sundays becomes legal, most state impoundments will continue to be
restricted to only a few days a week, again, to try and keep the birds in
the area.
My biggest complaint with waterfowl management on the state level is that
they maintain very few exclusive, perrmanent refuge areas, i.e., in and
around the big Triangle lakes. In Missouri, the state wildlife management
areas had blocks and impoundments that were never hunted and served as
permanent refuges, which served to keep larger numbers of waterfowl in the
area for both hunters and birders. Some of these had observation platforms
for birders, as at Mattamuskeet. I suspect the WRC simply doesn't have the
resources to do this around the Triangle lakes.
Many of the gamelands in the state are currently only three days a week for
ANY hunting; again, in the regs book; these may be available for
non-consumptive use on the other days (although some are closed to the
public on non-hunting days, I think).
Most of the National Forest gamelands are not restricted to three days a
week because of their massive expanse and the supposed dilution of hunters
across a much wider area.
Sorry to keep this thread going...
Take care,
Clyde Sorenson
Clayton and Raleigh, NC
p.s. I have been an avid birder for near 45 years now, and an avid duck
hunter for almost the same amount of time. Both of these activities have
been central to my existence and have helped defined who I am. However, the
last two years I have basically quit hunting- not because of lack of will
or interest, but because of lack of opportunity. This has diminished my
quality of life some, I must admit. Hunter numbers in NC and the nation are
steadily falling, and this is due in large part to ever diminishing access
to land one can hunt on. While there may be something of an adversarial
relationship between wildlife recreation communities, it is hard to ignore
that hunters (and to a degree anglers) have carried much of the freight for
protecting wildlife habitat in this country (even if the reason is somewhat
avaricious), and if the current hunter number trends continue, we will have
to come up with a new model for protecting wildlands, and soon.
On Fri, Jan 17, 2020 at 10:30 PM Harry LeGrand <hlegrandjr...> wrote:
> I think most hikers and birders see the problem differently than Clyde,
> who is a hunter and also a birder. The problem is that 1) hunters have
> guns, and 2) hunters arrive at their parking area by dawn, usually. Birders
> and hikers AVOID vehicles that are hunter’s or likely are hunter’s, and
> have to go elsewhere. That avoids conflict, but it leaves the non-hunters
> excluded from going to a place they were hoping to visit, such as a
> waterfowl impoundment. Think of it as hunters being Alpha males, and non
> hunters as Beta males, having to go somewhere else.
>
> I have dealt with this issue dozens of times and I know many of you
> birders have also — “The hunters got there first”. Conflict avoided, but
> that still leaves a bitter taste in the mouth. This can now happen often on
> Sundays, where it had never happened before.
>
> Harry LeGrand
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Jan 17, 2020, at 8:54 PM, Clyde Sorenson <sorenson...> wrote:
>
> Actually, the mandate for the national forests is expressly multiple use-
> forestry, water protection, fishing, hunting, birding and other recreation.
> According to this mandate, hunting is just as legitimate a use as any other
> of these, so long as safety allows. Safety zones where hunting is not
> allowed are generally established on gamelands where congestion, other user
> activities, or proximity to structures or facilities mandates.
>
> Frankly, I think the concern over sharing these lands with hunters is way
> overblown, as experience in most other states would indicate. Most hunting
> takes place much farther off the beaten path than birding. In my many
> decades of hunting on public lands in three states (mostly waterfowl and
> upland birds) the number of birders I encountered in the places I was going
> would not fill up one hand. In my many decades of birding on these same
> lands, I have never been threatened, or felt threatened, by hunters. Just
> my experience.
>
> Take care,
>
> Clyde Sorenson
> Clayton and Raleigh, NC
>
>
>
> On Fri, Jan 17, 2020 at 8:37 PM Harry LeGrand <carolinabirds...>
> wrote:
>
>> That still does not clarify whether hunting would be allowed on Sunday on
>> US Forest Service lands. These lands are not “of the State managed for
>> hunting”. They are managed for timber as well as hiking, and many other
>> activities, and not for hunting per se. I figure with all of the wilderness
>> groups and hiking groups and conservation groups in the mountains, WRC
>> would have a huge fight on its hands if all those hundreds of thousands of
>> acres in Pisgah and Nantahala NF were open to hunting all 7 days a week for
>> much of the year.
>>
>> And, this “only have one day a week for hunting”(Saturday) if you work
>> Monday thru Friday ALSO works AGAINST that idea, as all of the people who
>> want to hike and do birding and other non-hunting activities in peace and
>> quiet would now lose Sunday and have NO potential day in the week to walk
>> in the forests without fear of hunters also being out there. Hunting also
>> disturbs and flushes waterfowl from lakes. That is why some bird counts
>> strongly desire to hold them on a Sunday—. Free from shotgun blasts.
>>
>> Harry LeGrand
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>> On Jan 17, 2020, at 4:01 PM, Derb Carter <derbc...> wrote:
>>
>> I think most National Forest lands are also registered North Carolina
>> Game Lands. National Forests generally only require compliance with state
>> game regulations (seasons, time, days, bag limits, etc) to hunt on National
>> Forest lands. Some National Widllife Refuges also allow hunting (e.g.,
>> Mattamuskeet, Alligator River). Refuges that allow hunting usually have
>> their own Refuge specific regulations that in most cases limit hunting
>> significantly more than state regulations, which also apply.
>>
>>
>>
>> Derb Carter
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
Date: 1/17/20 7:31 pm From: Harry LeGrand (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Re: Hunting on federal public lands
I think most hikers and birders see the problem differently than Clyde, who is a hunter and also a birder. The problem is that 1) hunters have guns, and 2) hunters arrive at their parking area by dawn, usually. Birders and hikers AVOID vehicles that are hunter’s or likely are hunter’s, and have to go elsewhere. That avoids conflict, but it leaves the non-hunters excluded from going to a place they were hoping to visit, such as a waterfowl impoundment. Think of it as hunters being Alpha males, and non hunters as Beta males, having to go somewhere else.
I have dealt with this issue dozens of times and I know many of you birders have also — “The hunters got there first”. Conflict avoided, but that still leaves a bitter taste in the mouth. This can now happen often on Sundays, where it had never happened before.
Harry LeGrand
Sent from my iPhone
> On Jan 17, 2020, at 8:54 PM, Clyde Sorenson <sorenson...> wrote:
>
> Actually, the mandate for the national forests is expressly multiple use- forestry, water protection, fishing, hunting, birding and other recreation. According to this mandate, hunting is just as legitimate a use as any other of these, so long as safety allows. Safety zones where hunting is not allowed are generally established on gamelands where congestion, other user activities, or proximity to structures or facilities mandates.
>
> Frankly, I think the concern over sharing these lands with hunters is way overblown, as experience in most other states would indicate. Most hunting takes place much farther off the beaten path than birding. In my many decades of hunting on public lands in three states (mostly waterfowl and upland birds) the number of birders I encountered in the places I was going would not fill up one hand. In my many decades of birding on these same lands, I have never been threatened, or felt threatened, by hunters. Just my experience.
>
> Take care,
>
> Clyde Sorenson
> Clayton and Raleigh, NC
>
>
>
>> On Fri, Jan 17, 2020 at 8:37 PM Harry LeGrand <carolinabirds...> wrote:
>> That still does not clarify whether hunting would be allowed on Sunday on US Forest Service lands. These lands are not “of the State managed for hunting”. They are managed for timber as well as hiking, and many other activities, and not for hunting per se. I figure with all of the wilderness groups and hiking groups and conservation groups in the mountains, WRC would have a huge fight on its hands if all those hundreds of thousands of acres in Pisgah and Nantahala NF were open to hunting all 7 days a week for much of the year.
>>
>> And, this “only have one day a week for hunting”(Saturday) if you work Monday thru Friday ALSO works AGAINST that idea, as all of the people who want to hike and do birding and other non-hunting activities in peace and quiet would now lose Sunday and have NO potential day in the week to walk in the forests without fear of hunters also being out there. Hunting also disturbs and flushes waterfowl from lakes. That is why some bird counts strongly desire to hold them on a Sunday—. Free from shotgun blasts.
>>
>> Harry LeGrand
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>>> On Jan 17, 2020, at 4:01 PM, Derb Carter <derbc...> wrote:
>>>
>>> I think most National Forest lands are also registered North Carolina Game Lands. National Forests generally only require compliance with state game regulations (seasons, time, days, bag limits, etc) to hunt on National Forest lands. Some National Widllife Refuges also allow hunting (e.g., Mattamuskeet, Alligator River). Refuges that allow hunting usually have their own Refuge specific regulations that in most cases limit hunting significantly more than state regulations, which also apply.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Derb Carter
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
Date: 1/17/20 5:55 pm From: Clyde Sorenson <sorenson...> Subject: Re: Hunting on federal public lands
Actually, the mandate for the national forests is expressly multiple use-
forestry, water protection, fishing, hunting, birding and other recreation.
According to this mandate, hunting is just as legitimate a use as any other
of these, so long as safety allows. Safety zones where hunting is not
allowed are generally established on gamelands where congestion, other user
activities, or proximity to structures or facilities mandates.
Frankly, I think the concern over sharing these lands with hunters is way
overblown, as experience in most other states would indicate. Most hunting
takes place much farther off the beaten path than birding. In my many
decades of hunting on public lands in three states (mostly waterfowl and
upland birds) the number of birders I encountered in the places I was going
would not fill up one hand. In my many decades of birding on these same
lands, I have never been threatened, or felt threatened, by hunters. Just
my experience.
Take care,
Clyde Sorenson
Clayton and Raleigh, NC
On Fri, Jan 17, 2020 at 8:37 PM Harry LeGrand <carolinabirds...>
wrote:
> That still does not clarify whether hunting would be allowed on Sunday on
> US Forest Service lands. These lands are not “of the State managed for
> hunting”. They are managed for timber as well as hiking, and many other
> activities, and not for hunting per se. I figure with all of the wilderness
> groups and hiking groups and conservation groups in the mountains, WRC
> would have a huge fight on its hands if all those hundreds of thousands of
> acres in Pisgah and Nantahala NF were open to hunting all 7 days a week for
> much of the year.
>
> And, this “only have one day a week for hunting”(Saturday) if you work
> Monday thru Friday ALSO works AGAINST that idea, as all of the people who
> want to hike and do birding and other non-hunting activities in peace and
> quiet would now lose Sunday and have NO potential day in the week to walk
> in the forests without fear of hunters also being out there. Hunting also
> disturbs and flushes waterfowl from lakes. That is why some bird counts
> strongly desire to hold them on a Sunday—. Free from shotgun blasts.
>
> Harry LeGrand
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Jan 17, 2020, at 4:01 PM, Derb Carter <derbc...> wrote:
>
> I think most National Forest lands are also registered North Carolina Game
> Lands. National Forests generally only require compliance with state game
> regulations (seasons, time, days, bag limits, etc) to hunt on National
> Forest lands. Some National Widllife Refuges also allow hunting (e.g.,
> Mattamuskeet, Alligator River). Refuges that allow hunting usually have
> their own Refuge specific regulations that in most cases limit hunting
> significantly more than state regulations, which also apply.
>
>
>
> Derb Carter
>
>
>
>
>
>
Date: 1/17/20 5:37 pm From: Harry LeGrand (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Re: Hunting on federal public lands
That still does not clarify whether hunting would be allowed on Sunday on US Forest Service lands. These lands are not “of the State managed for hunting”. They are managed for timber as well as hiking, and many other activities, and not for hunting per se. I figure with all of the wilderness groups and hiking groups and conservation groups in the mountains, WRC would have a huge fight on its hands if all those hundreds of thousands of acres in Pisgah and Nantahala NF were open to hunting all 7 days a week for much of the year.
And, this “only have one day a week for hunting”(Saturday) if you work Monday thru Friday ALSO works AGAINST that idea, as all of the people who want to hike and do birding and other non-hunting activities in peace and quiet would now lose Sunday and have NO potential day in the week to walk in the forests without fear of hunters also being out there. Hunting also disturbs and flushes waterfowl from lakes. That is why some bird counts strongly desire to hold them on a Sunday—. Free from shotgun blasts.
Harry LeGrand
Sent from my iPhone
> On Jan 17, 2020, at 4:01 PM, Derb Carter <derbc...> wrote:
>
> I think most National Forest lands are also registered North Carolina Game Lands. National Forests generally only require compliance with state game regulations (seasons, time, days, bag limits, etc) to hunt on National Forest lands. Some National Widllife Refuges also allow hunting (e.g., Mattamuskeet, Alligator River). Refuges that allow hunting usually have their own Refuge specific regulations that in most cases limit hunting significantly more than state regulations, which also apply.
>
> Derb Carter
>
>
Date: 1/17/20 3:54 pm From: Derb Carter <derbc...> Subject: Seven Worlds, One Planet
Only one part will be relevant to North America and Carolina birds, but the BBC will premiere the series Seven Worlds, One Planet tomorrow night on BBC America. I am sure everyone has been following the tragic fires in Australia that have taken such a toll on the people and wildlife. The producers have moved Australia up to the opening tomorrow night. The BBC has done some amazing nature series recently. I have been told this one is the by far the best if your interest is wildlife and a must see.
Date: 1/17/20 3:02 pm From: Derb Carter <derbc...> Subject: Hunting on federal public lands
I think most National Forest lands are also registered North Carolina Game Lands. National Forests generally only require compliance with state game regulations (seasons, time, days, bag limits, etc) to hunt on National Forest lands. Some National Widllife Refuges also allow hunting (e.g., Mattamuskeet, Alligator River). Refuges that allow hunting usually have their own Refuge specific regulations that in most cases limit hunting significantly more than state regulations, which also apply.
I watched this mesmerizing flock a couple of weeks ago and saw an accipiter
trying to snatch one. Twas hard to keep my eyes on the road as I drove
under the swirling mass.
Eddie Owens
Cary NC
On Fri, Jan 17, 2020, 10:22 AM "Shultz, Steven" <carolinabirds...>
wrote:
> More of interest to those local to Cary/Apex/Raleigh….
>
>
>
> Blackbirds are using a very visible roost in west Cary/Morrisville.
>
>
>
> While small by blackbird flock standards (maybe 10,000 birds), they might
> be fun for someone trying out that new camera that came under the tree.
> The birds are using trees between the Whole Foods parking lot and I-540
> (toll) in west Cary, off NC55. The address for Whole Foods is 5000 NC-55,
> Cary, NC 27519 , and the birds can be seen from the strip mall parking lot
> at dusk.
>
>
>
> Steve Shultz
>
> Apex, NC
>
>
>
Date: 1/17/20 1:40 pm From: Paul Glass <pag...> Subject: RE: {Disarmed} Sunday hunting on gamelands survey.
I think I was confused by the same information that you were. The bill
makes Sunday hunting on public lands legal, but apparently it's still
restricted by the WRC. My apologies. With the law in place a simple change
of policy by the WRC could allow Sunday hunting without any new legislation.
Paul
-----Original Message-----
From: Daniel Hannon [mailto:<hannond131...>]
Sent: Friday, January 17, 2020 4:09 PM
To: Paul Glass
Cc: Clyde Sorenson; carolinabirds
Subject: Re: {Disarmed} Sunday hunting on gamelands survey.
Thank you for your comment and interest in this issue. Sunday hunting on
game lands is currently prohibited. However, the information on our website
was definitely misleading. This has been clarified. Thank you for brining
this to our attention.
Carrie Ruhlman
Policy Analyst
NC Wildlife Resources Commission
Mailing Address: 1701 Mail Service Center
Raleigh, North Carolina 27699-1701
Office: 919.707.0011
On Fri, Jan 17, 2020 at 11:00 AM Paul Glass <pag...>
<mailto:<pag...> > wrote:
That's not correct. See the "Outdoor Heritage Enhanced Act".
-----Original Message-----
From: Clyde Sorenson [mailto:<sorenson...> <mailto:<sorenson...> ]
Sent: Friday, January 17, 2020 10:51 AM
To: John Fussell; carolinabirds
Subject: Re: {Disarmed} Sunday hunting on gamelands survey.
Currently Sunday hunting is only permitted on private lands. Since many
hunters don't have access to private land, many are also interested in being
able to hunt on Sunday. I've lived in two other states where Sunday hunting
is universally permitted (as a hunter and a birder) - no problems in my
estimation.
Clyde
On Fri, Jan 17, 2020 at 10:44 AM John Fussell <jofuss...>
<mailto:<jofuss...> > wrote:
I am not offering any opinion on this issue, but I have an information
question...
The entire (or almost entire) Croatan National Forest is designated as a
gameland (an agreement between the federal government and the state).
However, I have never seen any Sunday hunting in the Croatan, and am fairly
certain that there is not any. Are federal lands, even if designated as
gamelands, not automatically included in the new Sunday inclusion?
(I guess an alternative explanation is that since most deer hunting in the
areas I frequent in the hunting season is with dogs that is the reason I
have not seen any Sunday hunting.) I
Thanks,
John Fussell
Morehead City, NC
----- Original Message -----
From: Loren Hintz <mailto:<ldhintz...> To: CarolinaBirds <mailto:<carolinabirds...> Sent: Thursday, January 16, 2020 5:36 PM
Subject: {Disarmed} Sunday hunting on gamelands survey.
with a firearm between 9:30 a.m. and 12:30 p.m.;
*
deer with the use of dogs; and
*
within 500 yards of a place of worship.
* The agency has been gathering data and public input to help inform its
decision about allowing Sunday hunting on game lands. With the help of Group
Solutions, the Commission is undertaking a comprehensive stakeholder
involvement process to gather data and diverse public input to inform this
important decision. From now through February 2, the Commission is seeking
citizen and constituent participation in this online survey to help identify
issues and options related to Sunday hunting on game lands. Information
provided will be used to help provide will help the agency better understand
how the public uses game lands and inform discussions at state-wide Sunday
hunting forums to be held in February.
Public Opinion Survey
Public Opinion Survey
North Carolina Wildlife Resources Commission
From Loren Hintz Chapel Hill, NC
--
This message has been scanned for viruses and
dangerous content by MailScanner, and is
believed to be clean.
*Thank you for your comment and interest in this issue. Sunday hunting on
game lands is currently prohibited. However, the information on our
website was definitely misleading. This has been clarified. Thank you for
brining this to our attention.*
*Carrie Ruhlman*
*Policy Analyst*
*NC Wildlife Resources Commission*
*Mailing Address: 1701 Mail Service Center*
*Raleigh, North Carolina 27699-1701*
*Office: 919.707.0011*
On Fri, Jan 17, 2020 at 11:00 AM Paul Glass <pag...> wrote:
Date: 1/17/20 11:22 am From: Brian Bockhahn (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Falls Lake CBC results
The 22nd Falls Lake CBC was held on Friday Jan 3, 2020, it was damp and
dreary all day with cloudy skies, traces of rain, fog and rain at sunset,
moderate temperatures ranging from 49-64. 38 observers 18 parties managed
84 species, no surprise it was our second lowest (average 91, high 105). We
recorded a record low 11,011 birds (average 16,666), led by perennial
leader 4,571 Ring-billed Gulls, 451 Double-crested Cormorant and 426
White-throated Sparrow. We had two feeder counters, one with a count week
Purple Finch, finally arriving.
Our second Laughing Gull was at lakes center in the main flock, other
goodies include Common Raven near Beaverdam Lake, Merlin in the lower Falls
Lake and three parties with a total of 5 Blue-headed Vireo, effort!
We set some record high counts of Horned Grebe 68 (57) Red-headed
Woodpecker 53 (43) and Blue-headed Vireo 5 (5).
And record low counts Canada Goose 118 (132), Dark-eyed Junco 278 (296),
Swamp Sparrow 9 (11).
Misses include Wood Duck, American Wigeon, Ring-necked Duck, Lesser Scaup,
Ruddy Duck, Northern Harrier, American Coot, Great Black-backed Gull,
Loggerhead Shrike, Palm Warbler, Rusty Blackbird, Common Grackle and
Brown-headed Cowbird.
For the record we put in 72 hours and 67 miles by foot; 12 and 122 miles by
car; 5 hours and 6.25 miles owling and 1.75 feeder hours.
Thanks to all the counters for helping out!!!
Mark your calendars for upcoming counts
Spring count – Monday April 27, 2020
Fall count – Friday September 11, 2020
Christmas – Monday January 4, 2021 (Remember we have to pick a date after
deer season, a non duck day and not a weekend day)
Date: 1/17/20 9:51 am From: Clyde Sorenson <sorenson...> Subject: Re: NC WRC Seeks input on potential Sunday hunting on gamelands
Deer hunting with dogs is generally not allowed on NC gamelands. I don't
see a problem with allowing Sunday hunting on gamelands; it is widespread
in most other states in the nation and there are generally no problems.
Hunters who rely on gamelands because they have no access to private lands
in the state (and who work regular jobs) end up being largely restricted to
a single day a week to hunt as the situation currently stands. Raising deer
bag limits does no good if opportunity to hunt is still restrictive.
I lived, birded, AND hunted in both Nevada and Missouri, which have both
always allowed Sunday hunting on private and public lands. Never saw a
problem with it from either side of the avocational spectrum, although,
admittedly, Nevada is almost all public land and is huge. MO, however, has
a great deal in common with NC.
Take care,
Clyde Sorenson
Clayton and Raleigh, NC
On Fri, Jan 17, 2020 at 11:01 AM Nate Dias <carolinabirds...> wrote:
> It seems to me that if White-tailed Deer are overpopulated in NC, that
> can be addressed by raising bag limits, increasing the number of Doe
> Tags issued, and other ways - without Sunday hunting.
>
> I have talked to multiple birders (and a hiker) who feel they cannot
> enjoy certain NC game lands on deer hunting days for safety reasons
> and from having dealt with unfriendly hunters. And it is nice for
> habitat to have a day off from Deer hunting that involves dog drives,
> which affects all kinds of non-target species.
>
> Nathan Dias - Charleston, SC
>
> On Fri, Jan 17, 2020 at 12:46 AM Jesse Anderson <carolinabirds...>
> wrote:
> >
> > For those of you wanting to immediately condemn hunting on game lands on
> Sunday, please be sure you are making an educated decision with the ecology
> of the bird species we cherish in mind. Remember, the preservation of these
> species are much more important than your (my) year list, county list, or a
> joyful Sunday outing.
> >
> > Whitetail deer are an under-recognized predator of birds, especially of
> ground nesting grassland species (such as E. meadowlark and northern
> bobwhite) which many of our game lands support.
> >
> > Attached below is an article from the Northeast, regarding deer nest
> predation, that is worth a read.
> >
> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__aviansag.org_TAG_Passerine_GBC_GBC-5F02.pdf&d=DwIFaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=_byYDk7TZBai_RcEtv2zKucUmy3k2DON71RLqjsm9vk&s=JSChWwt_RpwvyhCFzZGalc6bq4W06vduhei7SWBd1T8&e= > >
> > Also, the following article suggests a link between deer over-browsing
> and it’s effect on vertical structure in eastern forests, which also points
> toward deer-influenced declines in songbird populations.
> >
> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.fs.fed.us_nrs_pubs_jrnl_1994_ne-5F1994-5Fdecalesta-5F001.pdf&d=DwIFaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=_byYDk7TZBai_RcEtv2zKucUmy3k2DON71RLqjsm9vk&s=XO4NcfKRbP8dcjOgIcux_dyqs_D5T7En9KdF2jUkAmw&e= > >
> > With all this in mind, who’s to say those same deer wouldn’t take
> advantage of expanding that browsing to ground nesting iconic woodland
> songbirds, like the ovenbird?
> >
> > I personally will be voting in support of hunting on Sunday, as both a
> birder and conservation-based hunter.
> >
> > Thank you for sharing the WRC Survey.
> >
> > Jesse Anderson
> > Pinnacle, NC
> >
> > On Jan 16, 2020, at 8:10 PM, steve stevens (via carolinabirds Mailing
> List) <carolinabirds...> wrote:
> >
> >
> > I thought I'd pass this on this notice from the NC WRC since I'm
> assuming some birders have opinions on this issue being many of us use
> gamelands for birding solely on Sundays to avoid conflicts with hunters
> during hunting season:
> >
> >
> > In July 2017, the N.C. Wildlife Resources Commission (WRC) was granted
> authority to allow Sunday hunting on public lands via the Outdoor Heritage
> Enhanced Act. The WRC has been gathering data and public input to help
> inform this decision.
> >
> >
> >
> > The WRC is currently seeking your participation in a survey, from now
> through February 2, to help identify issues and options related to Sunday
> hunting on game lands. The information you provide will help the agency
> better understand how the public uses game lands. This information will
> also be used to inform discussions at state-wide Sunday hunting forums to
> be held in February.
> >
> >
> >
> > The survey, linked below, should take no more than 15 minutes to
> complete. Thank you, in advance, for your participation.
> >
> >
> >
> > Take the 2020 WRC Sunday Hunting Survey
> >
> >
> >
> > For additional information on Sunday hunting on game lands and the
> upcoming public forums, visit ncwildlife.org/SundayHuntingGL.
>
>
>
> --
>
> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.flickr.com_photos_offshorebirder2_&d=DwIFaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=_byYDk7TZBai_RcEtv2zKucUmy3k2DON71RLqjsm9vk&s=gcSUCdkIjAvLaUjQLI1eVat7d-yje6VMKlN1CLrbd9I&e= >
>
> "These days I prefer to hunt with a camera. A good photograph demands
> more skill from the hunter, better nerves and more patience than the
> rifle shot." -- Bror Blixen
>
Date: 1/17/20 9:51 am From: Ken Kneidel (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Charlotte CBC record highs
I reported last week on the record high for Ruby-crowned Kinglets in the Charlotte Christmas Bird Count. But now that I've finally compiled all data, I see that 15 other species had record highs! This is compared to 2 record highs for our count in 2018, 3 in 2017, 7 in 2016, and 9 in 2019. The older a count becomes, the harder it should be for species to set new records (this was our 78th count). Could this be another sign of warming? More bugs, less mortality, changes in winter location? It was a nice day, but not all that unusual. There was also no significant change in our effort - same people, same areas, same methodology.
Here are the 15 other record-setters with their total numbers in parentheses: Red-bellied Woodpecker (134), Yellow-bellied Sapsucker (54), Downy Woodpecker (97), Hairy Woodpecker (15), Eastern Phoebe (104), Blue-headed Vireo (6), Carolina Wren (272), Hermit Thrush (31), Brown Thrasher (40), Pine Warbler (59), Palm Warbler (12), Eastern Towhee (116), Great Blue Heron (17), Turkey Vulture (76), and American Woodcock (9).
Date: 1/17/20 9:24 am From: Harry LeGrand (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Re: {Disarmed} Sunday hunting on gamelands survey.
John’s question is excellent and needs clarification or determination. The regulation that Paul attached state in a1:
“on public lands of the State managed for hunting”.
The “of the state” means to me ONLY on those game lands literally owned by NC and NOT game lands owned or “of” the Federal government, other levels of government besides the State, and private owners that register lands as WRC game lands.
This is critical to clarify, as hundreds of thousands of USFS lands on the 4 national forests contain hiking trails. The Mountains to Sea Trail passes thru lands at Falls Lake that are owned by the US Corps of Engineers that are game lands. Hunting on Sunday on those lands would be a major problem with hundreds or thousands of hikers.
Thus, it appears to means Sunday hunting would be literally just on the State-owned Game lands, such as Holly Shelter Game Land, the several Roanoke River Wetlands Game Land, Green River Game Land, Sandy Mush Game Land, and many others.
Am I correct in this interpretation of the new regulations? Even so, many of us do visit state-owned game lands on Sunday to avoid hunting issues, and this will be compromised.
Harry LeGrand
Raleigh
Sent from my iPhone
> On Jan 17, 2020, at 8:55 AM, Paul Glass <pag...> wrote:
>
> That's not correct. See the "Outdoor Heritage Enhanced Act".
>
> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.ncleg.net_Sessions_2017_Bills_House_PDF_H559v7.pdf&d=DwIFaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=oK1zWdVeft0vxk6xbpxw1S0S4FqKB_ionyMNjS0OgE0&s=vi3bghaM65PKYFdoHKgUBKIvYbMsYsK4BprW3e2RhQo&e= >
> Paul Glass
> South Boston, VA
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Clyde Sorenson [mailto:<sorenson...>]
> Sent: Friday, January 17, 2020 10:51 AM
> To: John Fussell; carolinabirds
> Subject: Re: {Disarmed} Sunday hunting on gamelands survey.
>
> Currently Sunday hunting is only permitted on private lands. Since many hunters don't have access to private land, many are also interested in being able to hunt on Sunday. I've lived in two other states where Sunday hunting is universally permitted (as a hunter and a birder) - no problems in my estimation.
>
> Clyde
>
>> On Fri, Jan 17, 2020 at 10:44 AM John Fussell <jofuss...> wrote:
>> I am not offering any opinion on this issue, but I have an information question...
>>
>> The entire (or almost entire) Croatan National Forest is designated as a gameland (an agreement between the federal government and the state).
>>
>> However, I have never seen any Sunday hunting in the Croatan, and am fairly certain that there is not any. Are federal lands, even if designated as gamelands, not automatically included in the new Sunday inclusion?
>>
>> (I guess an alternative explanation is that since most deer hunting in the areas I frequent in the hunting season is with dogs that is the reason I have not seen any Sunday hunting.) I
>>
>> Thanks,
>> John Fussell
>> Morehead City, NC
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: Loren Hintz
>> To: CarolinaBirds
>> Sent: Thursday, January 16, 2020 5:36 PM
>> Subject: {Disarmed} Sunday hunting on gamelands survey.
>>
>> I just received an invitation to do a survey about Sunday hunting on gamelands. It was legalized several years ago. Here is the link and some information. MailScanner has detected a possible fraud attempt from "urldefense.proofpoint.com" claiming to be https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__mail.yahoo.com_d_folders_1_messages_114379-3F.partner-3Dsbc-26.rand-3D1b1p8se5ftl66&d=DwIFaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=oK1zWdVeft0vxk6xbpxw1S0S4FqKB_ionyMNjS0OgE0&s=q5WNbh6Kycx8T5QPDN55LtctlOSIvAkYHBS0A-O1jfI&e= >> When the Outdoor Heritage Act of 2015 passed, it removed the absolute prohibition on hunting with firearms on Sunday in North Carolina that had been in place since 1868. On July 25, 2017, the Outdoor Heritage Enhanced Act was signed by North Carolina Gov. Roy Cooper granting authority to the Wildlife Commission to implement new options for hunting on Sundays on its game lands, though hunters are still prohibited from hunting:
>> with a firearm between 9:30 a.m. and 12:30 p.m.;
>> deer with the use of dogs; and
>> within 500 yards of a place of worship.
>> · The agency has been gathering data and public input to help inform its decision about allowing Sunday hunting on game lands. With the help of Group Solutions, the Commission is undertaking a comprehensive stakeholder involvement process to gather data and diverse public input to inform this important decision. From now through February 2, the Commission is seeking citizen and constituent participation in this online survey to help identify issues and options related to Sunday hunting on game lands. Information provided will be used to help provide will help the agency better understand how the public uses game lands and inform discussions at state-wide Sunday hunting forums to be held in February.
>> Public Opinion Survey
>>
>> Public Opinion Survey
>> North Carolina Wildlife Resources Commission
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> From Loren Hintz Chapel Hill, NC
>>
>> --
>> This message has been scanned for viruses and
>> dangerous content by MailScanner, and is
>> believed to be clean.
Date: 1/17/20 9:20 am From: Marc Ribaudo (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Lake Benson Rusty Blackbird flock
There is a large flock of Rusty Blackbirds wintering at Lake Benson Park in Garner. I see them in the grassy fields along the entrance road shortly after the park opens at 8am. They mingle with other blackbird species (common grackle, red-winged blackbird, cowbird, and starling), but are in the majority. I have guesstimated up to 160. Its quite a treat. They are rather skittish but it is possible to drive slowly and not push them too far from the road. They move off as traffic in the park increases.
Marc Ribaudo
Date: 1/17/20 8:15 am From: John Fussell <jofuss...> Subject: two Christmas Bird Count season records
Last night I finally entered into ebird two observations from the Christmas Bird Count season.
Purple Sandpiper On 26 December, I was on the Cedar Island to Ocracoke ferry, leaving Cedar Island at 4pm. As we were leaving the harbor, I spotted a Purple Sandpiper at the tip of the longest jetty, resting next to a turnstone. This may be one of the four Purples that Marty Wall and I saw at the location in late November. Purples might be more regular at this location than the handful of records would suggest--parts of the jetties cannot be seen from shore. On the other hand, conditions might not be as favorable as one might assume based on the extent of suitable habitat. This area does not have a regular lunar tide. Instead water levels are determined largely by the direction and force of the wind over Pamlico Sound. In winter, strong northerly winds may cover the best feeding habitat continuously for several consecutive days--not a good situation.
Chuck-will's-widow On 27 December, I saw a Chuck-will's-widow apparently feedng over/along the northern section of the Park Service Frisco campground. This area is along the border between dunes and maritime forest. It was calm and very mild at the time, with numerous moths over the road, as well as a couple of small bats. It was 20 minutes after sunset, with a fair amount of ambient light. The bird came right be me, in profile, and I am certain that it was a Chuck, and not a Whip. If I remember correctly, over the years there have been about as many Chucks as Whips on the Bodie-Pea and Cape Hatteras counts.
Date: 1/17/20 8:01 am From: Nate Dias (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Re: NC WRC Seeks input on potential Sunday hunting on gamelands
It seems to me that if White-tailed Deer are overpopulated in NC, that
can be addressed by raising bag limits, increasing the number of Doe
Tags issued, and other ways - without Sunday hunting.
I have talked to multiple birders (and a hiker) who feel they cannot
enjoy certain NC game lands on deer hunting days for safety reasons
and from having dealt with unfriendly hunters. And it is nice for
habitat to have a day off from Deer hunting that involves dog drives,
which affects all kinds of non-target species.
Nathan Dias - Charleston, SC
On Fri, Jan 17, 2020 at 12:46 AM Jesse Anderson <carolinabirds...> wrote:
>
> For those of you wanting to immediately condemn hunting on game lands on Sunday, please be sure you are making an educated decision with the ecology of the bird species we cherish in mind. Remember, the preservation of these species are much more important than your (my) year list, county list, or a joyful Sunday outing.
>
> Whitetail deer are an under-recognized predator of birds, especially of ground nesting grassland species (such as E. meadowlark and northern bobwhite) which many of our game lands support.
>
> Attached below is an article from the Northeast, regarding deer nest predation, that is worth a read.
> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__aviansag.org_TAG_Passerine_GBC_GBC-5F02.pdf&d=DwIFaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=_byYDk7TZBai_RcEtv2zKucUmy3k2DON71RLqjsm9vk&s=JSChWwt_RpwvyhCFzZGalc6bq4W06vduhei7SWBd1T8&e= >
> Also, the following article suggests a link between deer over-browsing and it’s effect on vertical structure in eastern forests, which also points toward deer-influenced declines in songbird populations.
> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.fs.fed.us_nrs_pubs_jrnl_1994_ne-5F1994-5Fdecalesta-5F001.pdf&d=DwIFaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=_byYDk7TZBai_RcEtv2zKucUmy3k2DON71RLqjsm9vk&s=XO4NcfKRbP8dcjOgIcux_dyqs_D5T7En9KdF2jUkAmw&e= >
> With all this in mind, who’s to say those same deer wouldn’t take advantage of expanding that browsing to ground nesting iconic woodland songbirds, like the ovenbird?
>
> I personally will be voting in support of hunting on Sunday, as both a birder and conservation-based hunter.
>
> Thank you for sharing the WRC Survey.
>
> Jesse Anderson
> Pinnacle, NC
>
> On Jan 16, 2020, at 8:10 PM, steve stevens (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> wrote:
>
>
> I thought I'd pass this on this notice from the NC WRC since I'm assuming some birders have opinions on this issue being many of us use gamelands for birding solely on Sundays to avoid conflicts with hunters during hunting season:
>
>
> In July 2017, the N.C. Wildlife Resources Commission (WRC) was granted authority to allow Sunday hunting on public lands via the Outdoor Heritage Enhanced Act. The WRC has been gathering data and public input to help inform this decision.
>
>
>
> The WRC is currently seeking your participation in a survey, from now through February 2, to help identify issues and options related to Sunday hunting on game lands. The information you provide will help the agency better understand how the public uses game lands. This information will also be used to inform discussions at state-wide Sunday hunting forums to be held in February.
>
>
>
> The survey, linked below, should take no more than 15 minutes to complete. Thank you, in advance, for your participation.
>
>
>
> Take the 2020 WRC Sunday Hunting Survey
>
>
>
> For additional information on Sunday hunting on game lands and the upcoming public forums, visit ncwildlife.org/SundayHuntingGL.
"These days I prefer to hunt with a camera. A good photograph demands
more skill from the hunter, better nerves and more patience than the
rifle shot." -- Bror Blixen
-----Original Message-----
From: Clyde Sorenson [mailto:<sorenson...>]
Sent: Friday, January 17, 2020 10:51 AM
To: John Fussell; carolinabirds
Subject: Re: {Disarmed} Sunday hunting on gamelands survey.
Currently Sunday hunting is only permitted on private lands. Since many
hunters don't have access to private land, many are also interested in being
able to hunt on Sunday. I've lived in two other states where Sunday hunting
is universally permitted (as a hunter and a birder) - no problems in my
estimation.
Clyde
On Fri, Jan 17, 2020 at 10:44 AM John Fussell <jofuss...>
<mailto:<jofuss...> > wrote:
I am not offering any opinion on this issue, but I have an information
question...
The entire (or almost entire) Croatan National Forest is designated as a
gameland (an agreement between the federal government and the state).
However, I have never seen any Sunday hunting in the Croatan, and am fairly
certain that there is not any. Are federal lands, even if designated as
gamelands, not automatically included in the new Sunday inclusion?
(I guess an alternative explanation is that since most deer hunting in the
areas I frequent in the hunting season is with dogs that is the reason I
have not seen any Sunday hunting.) I
Thanks,
John Fussell
Morehead City, NC
----- Original Message -----
From: Loren Hintz <mailto:<ldhintz...> To: CarolinaBirds <mailto:<carolinabirds...> Sent: Thursday, January 16, 2020 5:36 PM
Subject: {Disarmed} Sunday hunting on gamelands survey.
with a firearm between 9:30 a.m. and 12:30 p.m.;
*
deer with the use of dogs; and
*
within 500 yards of a place of worship.
* The agency has been gathering data and public input to help inform its
decision about allowing Sunday hunting on game lands. With the help of Group
Solutions, the Commission is undertaking a comprehensive stakeholder
involvement process to gather data and diverse public input to inform this
important decision. From now through February 2, the Commission is seeking
citizen and constituent participation in this online survey to help identify
issues and options related to Sunday hunting on game lands. Information
provided will be used to help provide will help the agency better understand
how the public uses game lands and inform discussions at state-wide Sunday
hunting forums to be held in February.
Public Opinion Survey
Public Opinion Survey
North Carolina Wildlife Resources Commission
From Loren Hintz Chapel Hill, NC
--
This message has been scanned for viruses and
dangerous content by MailScanner, and is
believed to be clean.
Date: 1/17/20 7:51 am From: Clyde Sorenson <sorenson...> Subject: Re: {Disarmed} Sunday hunting on gamelands survey.
Currently Sunday hunting is only permitted on private lands. Since many
hunters don't have access to private land, many are also interested in
being able to hunt on Sunday. I've lived in two other states where Sunday
hunting is universally permitted (as a hunter and a birder) - no problems
in my estimation.
Clyde
On Fri, Jan 17, 2020 at 10:44 AM John Fussell <jofuss...> wrote:
Date: 1/17/20 7:44 am From: John Fussell <jofuss...> Subject: Re: {Disarmed} Sunday hunting on gamelands survey.
I am not offering any opinion on this issue, but I have an information question...
The entire (or almost entire) Croatan National Forest is designated as a gameland (an agreement between the federal government and the state).
However, I have never seen any Sunday hunting in the Croatan, and am fairly certain that there is not any. Are federal lands, even if designated as gamelands, not automatically included in the new Sunday inclusion?
(I guess an alternative explanation is that since most deer hunting in the areas I frequent in the hunting season is with dogs that is the reason I have not seen any Sunday hunting.) I
Thanks,
John Fussell
Morehead City, NC
----- Original Message -----
From: Loren Hintz
To: CarolinaBirds
Sent: Thursday, January 16, 2020 5:36 PM
Subject: {Disarmed} Sunday hunting on gamelands survey.
I just received an invitation to do a survey about Sunday hunting on gamelands. It was legalized several years ago. Here is the link and some information. MailScanner has detected a possible fraud attempt from "urldefense.proofpoint.com" claiming to be https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__mail.yahoo.com_d_folders_1_messages_114379-3F.partner-3Dsbc-26.rand-3D1b1p8se5ftl66&d=DwIFaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=R78S0Xqe3lU1l5r4PM43_cA4hHlfUiOcAkNM77ketEU&s=5aCf70f7eaCGlA8UddV_gzbOOx7clxnIwAvqvtjJt4s&e= When the Outdoor Heritage Act of 2015 passed, it removed the absolute prohibition on hunting with firearms on Sunday in North Carolina that had been in place since 1868. On July 25, 2017, the Outdoor Heritage Enhanced Act was signed by North Carolina Gov. Roy Cooper granting authority to the Wildlife Commission to implement new options for hunting on Sundays on its game lands, though hunters are still prohibited from hunting:
a.. with a firearm between 9:30 a.m. and 12:30 p.m.;
b.. deer with the use of dogs; and
c.. within 500 yards of a place of worship.
· The agency has been gathering data and public input to help inform its decision about allowing Sunday hunting on game lands. With the help of Group Solutions, the Commission is undertaking a comprehensive stakeholder involvement process to gather data and diverse public input to inform this important decision. From now through February 2, the Commission is seeking citizen and constituent participation in this online survey to help identify issues and options related to Sunday hunting on game lands. Information provided will be used to help provide will help the agency better understand how the public uses game lands and inform discussions at state-wide Sunday hunting forums to be held in February.
Public Opinion Survey
Public Opinion Survey
North Carolina Wildlife Resources Commission
From Loren Hintz Chapel Hill, NC
--
This message has been scanned for viruses and
dangerous content by MailScanner, and is
believed to be clean.
More of interest to those local to Cary/Apex/Raleigh....
Blackbirds are using a very visible roost in west Cary/Morrisville.
While small by blackbird flock standards (maybe 10,000 birds), they might be fun for someone trying out that new camera that came under the tree. The birds are using trees between the Whole Foods parking lot and I-540 (toll) in west Cary, off NC55. The address for Whole Foods is 5000 NC-55, Cary, NC 27519 , and the birds can be seen from the strip mall parking lot at dusk.
Date: 1/17/20 7:16 am From: bruce young (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Re: NC WRC Seeks input on potential Sunday hunting on gamelands
I too fully support reducing the deer population. But like Thicketmoss says, allowing hunting on sundays is not really the answer. There are many ways to reduce the population (eg, increased bag limits or just hiring professionals and letting them use whatever methods they want to take them) if we really wanted to. But I don't imagine that most hunters want to reduce the population at all. Why would they? They want to be able to find one. I would say more about the false economics of hunters being the only ones spending money to support gamelands, but I fear this is off topic for C-birds. So i'll cork it. Bruce <Youngbyoung715...>, NC
On Friday, January 17, 2020, 01:49:22 AM EST, thicketmoss <carolinabirds...> wrote:
You raise a valid point about deer and their effects on birds and ecosystems. However, restricting hunting on Sundays doesn’t restrict hunting entirely. Anyone may freely do their part to reduce the deer population on the other six days of the week, without putting birders and others who enjoy the outdoors at risk on the one day they would otherwise have during hunting season to appreciate the habitats that WRC game lands provide.
On Friday, January 17, 2020, Jesse Anderson <carolinabirds...> wrote:
On Jan 16, 2020, at 8:10 PM, steve stevens (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> wrote:
I thought I'd pass this on this notice from the NC WRC since I'm assuming some birders have opinions on this issue being many of us use gamelands for birding solely on Sundays to avoid conflicts with hunters during hunting season:
In July 2017, the N.C. Wildlife Resources Commission (WRC) was granted authority to allow Sunday hunting on public lands via the Outdoor Heritage Enhanced Act. The WRC has been gathering data and public input to help inform this decision.
The WRC is currently seeking your participation in a survey, from now through February 2, to help identify issues and options related to Sunday hunting on game lands. The information you provide will help the agency better understand how the public uses game lands. This information will also be used to inform discussions at state-wide Sunday hunting forums to be held in February.
The survey, linked below, should take no more than 15 minutes to complete. Thank you, in advance, for your participation.
Take the 2020 WRC Sunday Hunting Survey
For additional information on Sunday hunting on game lands and the upcoming public forums, visit ncwildlife.org/SundayHun tingGL.
You raise a valid point about deer and their effects on birds and
ecosystems. However, restricting hunting on Sundays doesn’t restrict
hunting entirely. Anyone may freely do their part to reduce the deer
population on the other six days of the week, without putting birders and
others who enjoy the outdoors at risk on the one day they would otherwise
have during hunting season to appreciate the habitats that WRC game lands
provide.
On Friday, January 17, 2020, Jesse Anderson <carolinabirds...> wrote:
Date: 1/16/20 9:46 pm From: Jesse Anderson (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Re: NC WRC Seeks input on potential Sunday hunting on gamelands
For those of you wanting to immediately condemn hunting on game lands on Sunday, please be sure you are making an educated decision with the ecology of the bird species we cherish in mind. Remember, the preservation of these species are much more important than your (my) year list, county list, or a joyful Sunday outing.
Whitetail deer are an under-recognized predator of birds, especially of ground nesting grassland species (such as E. meadowlark and northern bobwhite) which many of our game lands support.
With all this in mind, who’s to say those same deer wouldn’t take advantage of expanding that browsing to ground nesting iconic woodland songbirds, like the ovenbird?
I personally will be voting in support of hunting on Sunday, as both a birder and conservation-based hunter.
Thank you for sharing the WRC Survey.
Jesse Anderson
Pinnacle, NC
> On Jan 16, 2020, at 8:10 PM, steve stevens (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> wrote:
>
>
> I thought I'd pass this on this notice from the NC WRC since I'm assuming some birders have opinions on this issue being many of us use gamelands for birding solely on Sundays to avoid conflicts with hunters during hunting season:
>
>
> In July 2017, the N.C. Wildlife Resources Commission (WRC) was granted authority to allow Sunday hunting on public lands via the Outdoor Heritage Enhanced Act. The WRC has been gathering data and public input to help inform this decision.
>
> The WRC is currently seeking your participation in a survey, from now through February 2, to help identify issues and options related to Sunday hunting on game lands. The information you provide will help the agency better understand how the public uses game lands. This information will also be used to inform discussions at state-wide Sunday hunting forums to be held in February.
>
> The survey, linked below, should take no more than 15 minutes to complete. Thank you, in advance, for your participation.
>
> Take the 2020 WRC Sunday Hunting Survey
>
> For additional information on Sunday hunting on game lands and the upcoming public forums, visit ncwildlife.org/SundayHuntingGL.
Date: 1/16/20 5:10 pm From: steve stevens (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: NC WRC Seeks input on potential Sunday hunting on gamelands
I thought I'd pass this on this notice from the NC WRC since I'm assuming some birders have opinions on this issue being many of us use gamelands for birding solely on Sundays to avoid conflicts with hunters during hunting season:
I just received an invitation to do a survey about Sunday hunting on gamelands. It was legalized several years ago. Here is the link and some information. https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__mail.yahoo.com_d_folders_1_messages_114379-3F.partner-3Dsbc-26.rand-3D1b1p8se5ftl66When&d=DwIFaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=_sSTHM7g_59qZXDjZyXT_H7UM6YfgTDoUJzOQO-Olac&s=aKbUYFgLVbYpYFnvjRIE1_w81mdNA9TuwXe8c2NuilQ&e= the Outdoor Heritage Act of 2015 passed, it removed the absolute prohibition on hunting with firearms on Sunday in North Carolina that had been in place since 1868. On July 25, 2017, the Outdoor Heritage Enhanced Act was signed by North Carolina Gov. Roy Cooper granting authority to the Wildlife Commission to implement new options for hunting on Sundays on its game lands, though hunters are still prohibited from hunting:
- with a firearm between 9:30 a.m. and 12:30 p.m.;
- deer with the use of dogs; and
- within 500 yards of a place of worship.
· The agency has been gathering data and public input to help inform its decision about allowing Sunday hunting on game lands. With the help of Group Solutions, the Commission is undertaking a comprehensive stakeholder involvement process to gather data and diverse public input to inform this important decision. From now through February 2, the Commission is seeking citizen and constituent participation in this online survey to help identify issues and options related to Sunday hunting on game lands. Information provided will be used to help provide will help the agency better understand how the public uses game lands and inform discussions at state-wide Sunday hunting forums to be held in February.Public Opinion Survey
Date: 1/16/20 2:35 pm From: Norman Budnitz (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Jordan Lake (NC) CBC
The Jordan Lake Christmas Bird Count was held on January 5, 2020. It was a
rather mild day with moderate temperatures (37-48 °F), clear skies, and no
precipitation. The wind did pick up a bit during the morning hours (5-10
mph) and remained so for the rest of the day. Jordan Lake was at 219 feet,
which is 3 feet above normal—not particularly significant compared to last
year when the lake was 14 feet above normal.
We fielded a record 78 counters this year (previous record was 73), and
they reported 91 species, very close to our 10-year average of 92. We also
reported 28,878 individual birds. This number requires some explanation.
It is well below our 10-year average of 49,622. As in past years, the
number of Ring-billed gulls have a profound affect on our totals. If we
subtract the gull numbers from our total, we get 14,378. Our 10-year
non-gull average is 15,176. So, not counting gulls, we had a fairly
average count.
The Ring-billed Gull story continues to be fascinating (at least to this
compiler). Since the opening of the South Wake County Landfill in 2008, a
significant source of food for these consummate scavengers, the gulls have
spent their days at the landfill and then fly to Jordan Lake to roost each
night. They have typically gathered in numbers ranging from 30,000 to
45,000 gulls (with a high of 65,000 in 2011) in the deep part of the lake
between Ebenezer and Vista Points. This year that roost was estimated at
about 14,500. There were no other large concentrations of gulls in the
count circle (800 along Beaver Creek, which were probably some of the same
birds coming off the Ebenezer roost, and 750 at Harris Lake). Last year we
estimated 10,000 gulls in the whole circle. Thus, our numbers still seem
to be lower than in other recent years. Several of us are planning to
visit the landfill later in January to see what the numbers are like there.
Seventy-eight birders (10-year average: 59) in 24 parties (average: 23) put
in 126 party-hours (average: 121). Leaving out the gulls, that’s
approximately 115 birds per party-hour, a bit below our 10-year average of
125 birds per party-hour. (Including gulls, those numbers are 230 and 405
b/p-h, respectively.)
We had several new high species counts:
· Double-crested Cormorants—6,000 (previous high was 3,466 in 2016)
· Bald Eagles—69 (49 in 2014)
· Pine Warblers—277 (243 in 2000)
Speculation: All those gulls pooping in the lake at night are transferring
lots of nutrients from the landfill. That results in algae and plankton
growth. Fish eat those algae and plankton. And who eats the fish?
Cormorants and eagles. Of course, the gulls aren’t the only source of
nutrients. Agricultural lands around the lake and municipalities in the
area and upstream along the rivers feeding the lake are other sources of
nutrients.
We missed a few species that we normally encounter most years: American
Coot, Sharp-shinned Hawk, Eastern Screech-Owl, House Wren, and Brown-headed
Cowbird. And since this has not been a year with irruptive species, no one
found any Red-breasted Nuthatches, Purple Finches, or Pine Siskins.
However, as a counterbalance to those missed species, several uncommon
species were reported:
· Northern Bobwhite (1)—Brian Bockhahn
· Iceland Gull (1)—Sam Flake, Marc Ribaudo
· Lesser Black-backed Gull (4)—Sam Flake, Mark Ribaudo and Brian
Bockhahn
· Great Black-backed Gull (1)—Brian Bockhahn
· Merlin (1)— Will Cook, Sam Wilson
· Blue-headed Vireo (3)—3 parties: Will Cook and Sam Wilson; Sterling
Southern, Josh Southern, and Doug Pratt; and Brian Bockhahn
· Blue-gray Gnatcatcher (1)— Roger Shaw, Jennifer Maher, Carolyn
McAllaster, Mary & Don Tucker, Juliana Henderson
· Gray Catbirds (1)—Tom Driscoll, Elizabeth Keating, Jin Bai, Don
Pelly
· Black-and-white Warbler (1)— Patrick Coin, Mike DeMatties,
Catherine Ward, Alyssa Martinez, Josh Daniels, Chris Rousseau
· Common Yellowthroat (2)—Will Cook, Sam Wilson
Worthy of note are a few relatively low and one relatively high count this
year. We tallied 99 Golden-crowned Kinglets (10-year average, 203), while
we amassed (if I may use that word for such diminutive birds) 414
Ruby-crowned Kinglets (average, 160). Other low numbers, followed by their
10-year averages: Dark-eyed Junco (286 vs 818), White-throated Sparrow
(342 vs 586), Song Sparrow (150 vs 226), Common Grackle (1 vs 806), and
Yellow-rumped Warbler (40 vs 86). These may just be blips; perhaps the
next few years will tell us if they are trends.
Brian Bockhahn reported 59 species this year, while Tom Driscoll, Elizabeth
Keating, Jin Bai, and Don Pelly found 57 species. We had 78 birders in 24
parties. We put in 126 party hours (106 on foot, 20 by car), 231 party
miles (87 on foot, 144 by car), and 4.7 hours nocturnal birding.
Sadly it looks like there are fewer [Golden-crowned Kinglets] now all around
As mentioned elsewhere it may be just a one-year blip (well, I and Norm Budnitz posted the last decade of numbers from our respective CBCs and for each, 2019-20 was an outlier rather than indicative of a trend).
Date: 1/16/20 1:27 pm From: Norman Budnitz (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Re: Litchfield-Pawleys CBC and G-C Kinglets
In *Winter World* (2003), Bernd Heinrich writes about how Golden-crowned
Kinglets and lots of other critters make it through the brutal winters of
northern North America. A delightful and enlightening read.
On Thu, Jan 16, 2020 at 3:54 PM "Shultz, Steven" <carolinabirds...>
wrote:
> I looked at eBird and a couple of other places. Learned a few things!
> One, GCKI is not that closely related to RCKI, so probably apples and
> oranges between those two. Two, and I think I kinda of knew this, GCKI are
> much more cold hardy, down to -40 per Cornell. So cold weather may not be
> as much of a mortality factor for those little sprites.
>
>
>
> I pulled eBird maps for the same period 10 years apart. Sadly it looks
> like there are fewer now all around L. Notice the big area in the SE
> that had heavy presence ten years ago, and comparison to now. The range
> itself looks about the same, but the overall density looks less now.
> Non-scientific, but sorta scary!
>
>
>
>
>
> 2019-2020 (Nov-Dec)
>
>
>
>
>
> 2009-2010 (Nov-Dec)
>
>
>
>
>
> Steve Shultz
>
> Apex, NC
>
>
>
> *From:* <carolinabirds-request...> [mailto:
> <carolinabirds-request...>] *On Behalf Of *Norman Budnitz
> *Sent:* Thursday, January 16, 2020 3:27 PM
> *To:* Christopher Hill; postings Carolina Birds
> *Subject:* Re: Litchfield-Pawleys CBC and G-C Kinglets
>
>
>
> *This email is from an external source - exercise caution regarding links
> and attachments. *
>
>
>
> With regard to Chris's note on Golden-crowned Kinglet numbers, on the
> Jordan Lake (NC) CBC we had 99 this year. Our 10-year average is 203.
> Here are our numbers for those 10 years:
>
>
>
> 223
>
> 139
>
> 248
>
> 358
>
> 196
>
> 170
>
> 212
>
> 283
>
> 106
>
> 99
>
>
>
> More food for thought.
>
>
>
> On Wed, Jan 1, 2020 at 8:20 AM Christopher Hill <carolinabirds...>
> wrote:
>
> Various parties are still reporting their results from the
> Litchfield-Pawleys Island Christmas Bird Count conducted day before
> yesterday. We don’t have any earth-shattering rarites to report yet, but a
> bunch of “good” birds for us, like Long-tailed Duck, Sedge Wren, Prairie
> Warbler, Northern Bobwhite, and Purple Sandpiper and Piping Plover (the
> last three have been much harder to find this past decade). We’re sitting
> at 151 species now and expect that to climb when the last couple areas
> report.
>
>
>
> But something odd popped up and I thought I’d mention it in case there’s
> something going on region wide: of all the parties reporting so far, nobody
> had a single Golden-crowned Kinglet, and that’s not a bird we “ever” miss
> (once, in the 48 years this count has existed). Here are our GCKI totals
> for the last ten years:
>
>
>
> 63
>
> 36
>
> 34
>
> 81
>
> 115
>
> 154
>
> 45
>
> 27
>
> 73
>
> 21
>
>
>
> So even if the not-yet-reporting parties found a couple, this is so not
> normal (for us) that it looks like more than a random blip.
>
>
>
> Maybe something to keep an eye on as your own counts get finished and
> compiled.
>
>
>
> Now go out there and get those year lists started! [obfirstbird: insistent
> Carolina Wren heard through the living room window]
>
>
>
> Chris Hill
>
> Conway, SC
>
>
>
>
> --
>
> Norm Budnitz
> Orange County
> North Carolina
>
I looked at eBird and a couple of other places. Learned a few things! One, GCKI is not that closely related to RCKI, so probably apples and oranges between those two. Two, and I think I kinda of knew this, GCKI are much more cold hardy, down to -40 per Cornell. So cold weather may not be as much of a mortality factor for those little sprites.
I pulled eBird maps for the same period 10 years apart. Sadly it looks like there are fewer now all around ☹. Notice the big area in the SE that had heavy presence ten years ago, and comparison to now. The range itself looks about the same, but the overall density looks less now. Non-scientific, but sorta scary!
2019-2020 (Nov-Dec)
[cid:<image005.jpg...>]
2009-2010 (Nov-Dec)
[cid:<image006.jpg...>]
Steve Shultz
Apex, NC
From: <carolinabirds-request...> [mailto:<carolinabirds-request...>] On Behalf Of Norman Budnitz
Sent: Thursday, January 16, 2020 3:27 PM
To: Christopher Hill; postings Carolina Birds
Subject: Re: Litchfield-Pawleys CBC and G-C Kinglets
This email is from an external source - exercise caution regarding links and attachments.
With regard to Chris's note on Golden-crowned Kinglet numbers, on the Jordan Lake (NC) CBC we had 99 this year. Our 10-year average is 203. Here are our numbers for those 10 years:
223
139
248
358
196
170
212
283
106
99
More food for thought.
On Wed, Jan 1, 2020 at 8:20 AM Christopher Hill <carolinabirds...><mailto:<carolinabirds...>> wrote:
Various parties are still reporting their results from the Litchfield-Pawleys Island Christmas Bird Count conducted day before yesterday. We don’t have any earth-shattering rarites to report yet, but a bunch of “good” birds for us, like Long-tailed Duck, Sedge Wren, Prairie Warbler, Northern Bobwhite, and Purple Sandpiper and Piping Plover (the last three have been much harder to find this past decade). We’re sitting at 151 species now and expect that to climb when the last couple areas report.
But something odd popped up and I thought I’d mention it in case there’s something going on region wide: of all the parties reporting so far, nobody had a single Golden-crowned Kinglet, and that’s not a bird we “ever” miss (once, in the 48 years this count has existed). Here are our GCKI totals for the last ten years:
63
36
34
81
115
154
45
27
73
21
So even if the not-yet-reporting parties found a couple, this is so not normal (for us) that it looks like more than a random blip.
Maybe something to keep an eye on as your own counts get finished and compiled.
Now go out there and get those year lists started! [obfirstbird: insistent Carolina Wren heard through the living room window]
Date: 1/16/20 12:28 pm From: Norman Budnitz (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Re: Litchfield-Pawleys CBC and G-C Kinglets
With regard to Chris's note on Golden-crowned Kinglet numbers, on the
Jordan Lake (NC) CBC we had 99 this year. Our 10-year average is 203.
Here are our numbers for those 10 years:
223 139 248 358 196 170 212 283 106 99
More food for thought.
On Wed, Jan 1, 2020 at 8:20 AM Christopher Hill <carolinabirds...>
wrote:
> Various parties are still reporting their results from the
> Litchfield-Pawleys Island Christmas Bird Count conducted day before
> yesterday. We don’t have any earth-shattering rarites to report yet, but a
> bunch of “good” birds for us, like Long-tailed Duck, Sedge Wren, Prairie
> Warbler, Northern Bobwhite, and Purple Sandpiper and Piping Plover (the
> last three have been much harder to find this past decade). We’re sitting
> at 151 species now and expect that to climb when the last couple areas
> report.
>
> But something odd popped up and I thought I’d mention it in case there’s
> something going on region wide: of all the parties reporting so far, nobody
> had a single Golden-crowned Kinglet, and that’s not a bird we “ever” miss
> (once, in the 48 years this count has existed). Here are our GCKI totals
> for the last ten years:
>
> 63 36 34 81 115 154 45 27 73 21
> So even if the not-yet-reporting parties found a couple, this is so not
> normal (for us) that it looks like more than a random blip.
>
> Maybe something to keep an eye on as your own counts get finished and
> compiled.
>
> Now go out there and get those year lists started! [obfirstbird: insistent
> Carolina Wren heard through the living room window]
>
> Chris Hill
> Conway, SC
>
Date: 1/16/20 12:20 pm From: Corey, Ed <ed.corey...> Subject: Pettigrew CBC Results + Save the Date
On December 27th, 4 teams covered 6 territories of the Pettigrew CBC for its 34th year. 106 species were tallied, including a count high 7 Sandhill Cranes at Pungo, our second Eurasian Wigeon (also at Pungo), and area specialties like Ash-throated Flycatcher and both Clay-colored and Vesper Sparrows near Pettigrew. Other high counts included 739 Red-breasted Mergansers and 55 Eastern Phoebes. Our biggest miss was Canvasback, but finding these birds can wholly depend on the movement of the raft on the lake.
For those interested, please mark your calendars for Wednesday, December 30th, for our 35th Pettigrew CBC! We'd love to be able to add more territories, or just to have additional volunteers to go with current teams.
Thanks!
Ed Corey
Inventory Biologist, NC Division of Parks and Recreation
NC Dept. of Natural and Cultural Resources
919 841 4037 Office
919 208 7864 Mobile
<Ed.Corey...><mailto:<Ed.Corey...>
12700 Bayleaf Church Road | Raleigh, North Carolina 27614
Email correspondence to and from this address is subject to the North Carolina Public Records Law and may be disclosed to third parties.
Date: 1/16/20 12:16 pm From: Norman Budnitz (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Re: R-c Kinglets and the CBC
One more data point. On the Jordan Lake (NC) CBC we tallied 414 Ruby-crowned Kinglets. That is more than twice the average of 160 over the past 10 years. On the other hand, Golden-crowned Kinglets were down this year. We had 99, while our 10-year average is 203. Hmm.
On Fri, Jan 10, 2020 at 8:51 PM Ken Kneidel <carolinabirds...> wrote:
> Kevin, > > I trust the modelers at Audubon have taken into consideration the issues > you raise. I see them as the "someones" with the time to do the digging > you wished you had time to do. > > Curtis Smalling, when he presented at our recent club meeting, said that a > variety of factors have been taken into consideration in making the > predictions they have done in Survival by Degrees. In the older report, he > said they relied primarily on temperature, and in doing so, made the > outrageous prediction that skimmers would be moving to the Appalachians. > Now, they're looking at suitability of habitat, and changes in habitat, as > well as just temperature changes in predicting shifts in the species' > distributions. > > Assuming they've modeled with these considerations incorporated, it > looks like they've answered your question. If you go to the link I listed > (here it is again to make it easy - you have to switch to winter > distribution, of course: > https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.audubon.org_field-2Dguide_bird_ruby-2Dcrowned-2Dkinglet&d=DwIFaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=2w7F0xfPKATcO888yeXnVrkTJ_ux7-jxbsskZPZUDrk&s=wBLfDCFmzB2wP_daOXmREazAvGpaAlJQMgdJCU51qcs&e= > <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.audubon.org_field-2Dguide_bird_ruby-2Dcrowned-2Dkinglet&d=DwMFaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=iz6FaUSLtZL5m82l-QQiqLtx_lEzb8M7uZgxRYpN-9E&s=8H3qGn6AK6-z5W1VdOHqta71mvPvsybc7G9tJ7fFSSY&e=>) > you'll see that the northern range RCKI's are predicted to gain (in light > blue) is matched by southern range they're predicted to lose (in red). > > Ken > > On Fri, Jan 10, 2020 at 7:02 PM Kevin Metcalf <carolinabirds...> > wrote: > >> Yes, this is an important way to look at it. It isn't an either-or >> situation of greater survivability vs northern range expanion - the two are >> intertwined. Data from bird counts could show us if the areas to the north >> of their prior wintering range are now starting to get Ruby-crowns. >> (Someone with more time than me to look into it could give us the answer >> with a little digging). >> >> I also wonder if there could eventually be less Ruby-crowns at the >> southern edge of their wintering range (which extends into Mexico), if this >> trend continues? What limits their winter range now? Is it temperature >> directly, or the side effects of temperature related to food availability? >> Or competition from other arthropod gleaners that also might be able to >> survive winter further north in a warmer world? Lots of interestin g points >> to ponder. Maybe all of the above. Is climate change also shifting their >> spruce-fir forest breeding range? Thanks Ken, for bringing up this >> intereting topic. >> >> Kevin Metcalf >> Huntersville, NC >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> >From: <badgerboy...> >> >Sent: Jan 10, 2020 5:16 PM >> >To: <carolinabirds...> >> >Subject: Re: R-c Kinglets and the CBC >> > >> >It might be useful to note that because these birds are surviving in >> >higher numbers, they ARE then wintering further north, at least in the >> >sense of being detected more by birders. Thats evolution selecting for >> >the trait of northerly wintering. >> > >> >On 1/10/2020 5:01 PM, Harry LeGrand (via carolinabirds Mailing List) >> wrote: >> >> They aren't wintering farther north, they are surviving in higher >> >> numbers. >> >> >> >> >> > >> >
Date: 1/16/20 10:16 am From: Parula23 (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Bullock's Oriole in Pineville, SC
All, An adult male Bullock's Oriole has been visiting jelly feeders in the yard of a private residence in Pineville, SC since the morning of Wednesday, January 15. There are also several Baltimore Orioles coming to the feeders. I haven't seen the Bullock's myself, but I have seen pictures and the bird does show broad white wingbars, a black back, black throat and heavy black eyeline. It's been coming periodically during both morning and afternoon and tends to drive the other orioles away from the feeders. Hosts Bob and Monica Bradley welcome visits by birders hoping to see the Oriole, but they ask that you call them in advance. Their telephone number is: 843 351-4308. Andy HarrisonCharleston, SC
The Great Cormorant is still present at the Rec.
Area below Clark’s Hill Dam in McCormick CO, SC. It is perched near the base of the dam on ledges with Double-creates Cormorants and gulls. Be patient if you don’t see it right away. It seems to spend its time drying out followed by more fishing.
The rec. area is safe and well maintained with paved walking paths right up to the dam. It might be busy with families on the weekends but the GCCO wouldn’t mind.
If you also need a Dark-eyed Junco and Pine Warbler “Fix” this is the place for you.
Cherrie
~~~~~~~~~~~~
Cherrie & Dan Sneed
Stockman Road
Prosperity, SC
Newberry CO
Date: 1/16/20 8:17 am From: Dwayne Martin (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Common Goldeneye -- Riverbend Park
This morning we had a female Common Goldeneye in the river at Riverbend Park, northern Catawba County. This makes the 6th year in a row we have had this species at the park. Last year we had as many as 25 at a time. With the cold air coming in next week, the numbers may increase.
Dwayne ************* J. Dwayne Martin Hickory, NC <redxbill...>
Date: 1/16/20 6:52 am From: John Fussell <jofuss...> Subject: another Ash-throated Flycatcher
An Ash-throated Flycatcher was at the North River Preserve last Saturday, 11 January, as seen by Rich and Susan Boyd. Rich got very good photos of it.
On Sunday, Steve Howell and I glimpsed the bird a couple of times. Then it went to the north side of the "shrub line" (separates the North River Preserve from the vast Open Grounds Farm), out of sight, and just disappeared. Although we searched for it for several hours, we never saw it again.
I did not do an ebird report for that day because I did not think that the details we could honestly submit (flycatcher posture, general coloration, obviously different from phoebes--we saw about 30 that day) would, by themselves, be adequate to document the species, although we feel certain that we saw the bird.
Am hoping for some clear and cold weather in a few days to concentrate birds along the south side of the shrub line.
Of note, I had 4 Ruby-throateds in my yard in mid-December, but, after all the super-mild weather, apparently I have only one now. The Yellow-breasted Chat is still here: a good life--feasting on peanut butter, dried mealworms, and slices of apple and banana.
Date: 1/15/20 6:09 pm From: Brian Bockhahn (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Rockingham County CBC results
The 8th Rockingham Count Christmas Bird Count was moved from a rainy 23rd
to a sunny Dec 24, 2019 with temperatures ranging from 43-69 under clear
skies and no wind.
9 observers in 5 parties tallied 73 species (average 75) which made a
three-way tie for all-time lows of 73. We tallied our second highest 4,841
total birds (average 3,686) led by 1200 Ring-billed Gulls, 227 European
Starling and 887 Common Grackle. Four birds were seen during count week
Green-winged Teal (would be a 1st), Wild Turkey, American Pipit and
Savannah Sparrow.
One bird was new to the count checklist, a single Canvasback in a farm pond!
In the same pond was our 3rd record of American Black Duck, some Mallard
and Ring-necked Duck. Except for having a nice wooded buffer around the
pond, it looked like every other farm pond! We also had our third
Brown-headed Cowbird, and always nice we had Northern Bobwhite, Bald
Eagle, Red-headed Woodpecker and Fish Crow.
Misses include Hooded Merganser, Pied-billed Grebe, Northern Harrier,
Blue-headed Vireo and of course Red-breasted Nuthatch, Purple Finch and
Pine Siskin.
We did set or tie some record highs however: Red-tailed Hawk 15(15),
Ring-billed Gull 1,200 (1,200 hmm), Yellow-bellied Sapsucker 17 (17),
Pileated Woodpecker 16 (16), Eastern Phoebe 18 (18), Carolina Wren 87 (77),
Ruby-crowned Kinglet 47 (32), Hermit Thrush 12 (12), Pine Warbler 9 (6).
And some record lows: Winter Wren 2 (2), Song Sparrow 112 (112…odd), Swamp
Sparrow 2 (2), Red-winged Blackbird 1 (1).
Thank you all so much for your help! GREAT JOB!!! Our continuing goal is
to break 80 species…not bad for a foothills count!
Mark your calendars
Rockingham County Spring Bird Count April 30, 2020
Rockingham County Fall Count Sep. 9, 2020
Rockingham County Christmas Bird Count December 21, 2020
Even older report! But had a nice count of 32 Lesser Black- backed Gulls in with Ring-billed and Herring in a field near Buena Vista in Bertie Co., NC on 12/28/2019.
Date: 1/14/20 12:59 pm From: Steven Howell (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Where have all the birds gone?
This is just an opinion from my view point. Today I birded Rachel Carson Preserve across from Beaufort, NC. Normally one would see hundreds if not a thousand of shore birds here. Today I saw zero and only one gull. There were no bird footprints on the sand, but there has been some rain showers here. Also, when I go to my main go to place Fort Macon state park I am not seeing many gulls. Normally they are lined up on the beach resting first thing in the morning. A lot of birds are being reported now, but everyone is trying to get there year list going. Is it me or is something going on? Rachel Carson is one of our best birding spots. A little hard to get to and may require a lot of walking. I walked over four miles in sand and marsh to only see a few wading birds.
Date: 1/14/20 12:40 pm From: Brian Bockhahn (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Kerr Lake CBC results
The 17TH Kerr Lake CBC was held on Jan 2, 2019 under clear then cloudy
skies, increasing winds and temperatures 36-50. 17 counters in ten parties
were able to tally 89 species (average 94 and tied for our second lowest)
and 6,924 total birds, our lowest ever (12,060 average) led by 1,170
Ring-billed Gull, 792 Black Vultures (there were few ducks at dusk so I
tallied vultures) 345 Bonaparte’s Gulls and 327 Canada Goose. As with
other counts this season, few irruptive species and the warming trends
meant less duck diversity. Hoped for lingering warblers did not
materialize.
Highlights include our first record Western Grebe at Eagle Point. A
Red-necked Grebe was above the dam making our first ever four Grebe count! We
also had three loon species with the Pacific seen at Satterwhite and
Red-throated Loon at Palmer Point. Grebe grand slam and loon hat trick,
wow, what a lake. One year a Yellow-billed Loon will be seen....
Misses include American Wigeon, Red-breasted Merganser, Sharp-shinned Hawk,
American Coot, Lesser or Greater Black-backed Gull, Loggerhead Shrike,
House Wren, Gray Catbird, American Pipit, Palm Warbler and White-crowned
Sparrow.
We set some record highs with 792 Black Vulture, 13 Red-shouldered Hawk and
168 Pine Warbler, they were everywhere.
Record lows were many: 1 Wood Duck, 1 Ruddy Duck, 5 Red-tailed Hawk, 1,170
Ring-billed Gull, 3 Brown Creeper, 296 Dark-eyed Junco, 87 White-throated
Sparrow (!) 1 Savannah Sparrow and 3 Eastern Meadowlark.
Date: 1/14/20 12:27 pm From: Bill Hilton Jr. <hilton...> Subject: Hilton Pond (12/31/19 (2019 Bird Banding Summary: A New Species)
Whew! It took a while, but I've finally checked and cross-checked my 2019 bird banding data from Hilton Pond AND written it up in digestible format as the 709th "This Week at Hilton Pond” photo essay for 31 Dec 2019. The installment includes lots of anecdotes, charts, tables, maps, and images depicting birds we banded in the just-finished year, along with hypotheses and speculations about the results. Whether you like woodpeckers or warblers or hummingbirds or hawks, you'll likely find something about your bird of interest.
The write-up is best viewed on a tablet or desktop computer--cell phones are cool but more useful for some things than others!--so I hope you'll have time to consume this special end-of-year installment in leisurely fashion from your desk or easy chair.
DR. BILL HILTON JR., Executive Director
Hilton Pond Center for Piedmont Natural History
1432 DeVinney Road, York, South Carolina 29745 USA
office & cell (803) 684-5852
The mission of Hilton Pond Center for Piedmont Natural History is "to conserve plants, animals, habitats, and other natural components of the Piedmont Region of the eastern United States through observation, scientific study, and education for students of all ages.
"Never trust a person too lazy to get up for sunrise or too busy to watch the sunset." BHjr.
*Effort:* 9 birders put in 20 party-hours (Average 34; High 68; Low 16), 0 hours owling
*Total* # of birds seen: 1294 (Avg 1810, High 3179; Low 239)
*Species*: 52 (Avg 50; High 60; Low 28)
*Good finds:* American Black Duck—2 birds at Lake Ashe were our 3^rd count entry Bald Eagle: adult working over the New River at Elk Shoals was a 3^rd count entry Purple Finch: a pair of females at Lake Ashe were one of very few reports in the high country this winter
*High Counts* Northern Raven (10 was 2^nd highest count after 18 in 2009)
Date: 1/13/20 2:45 pm From: <badgerboy...> Subject: Summary of the 7th Upper Yadkin CBC (Wilkesboro)
This was the 7th year of the Upper Yadkin CBC, started in 2013 by Eric Harrold. Its a fun count including Kerr Scott reservoir, YMCA Camp Harrison with Broyhill Lake, and The Yadkin River Greenway as it meanders for several miles through the Wilkesboros.
_*STATS:*_ Effort: 12 participants with 34 Party Hours (Avg 37, High 52, Low 32), and 4.5 hours owling Total counts: 2090 birds (Avg 2653; High 4643; Low 1683) # of species: 68( Avg 67; High 72; Low 62) _*Count firsts: *__*(# of birds)*_ Bonaparte's Gull (1) at Blood Creek Overlook Scaup sp. (8) at Camp Harrison (first record of any scaup) *_Count 2nd's_**_:(# of birds)_* Barred Owl (1) at Combs residence Merlin (1) at Bandit's Roost (wintering for the last several years) Fish Crow (3) at Kerr Scott Dam (2^nd year in a row) House Wren (1) at Kerr Scott Dam-rockwall *_High Counts_**_(#, previous high)_* Pied-billed Grebe (25,23) Bald Eagle (3,3) Red-tailed Hawk (8,8) Northern Raven (6,4) Northern Mockingbird (13,12) Ruby-crowned Kinglet (13,10) Eastern Bluebird (78, 69) Hermit Thrush (20,18) Savannah Sparrow (25,5) (Very large flock at Mourne Rouge cornfield) *_Missed_**_(# years missed out of 7)_* Wilson's Snipe(3) Eastern Screech-owl (1) Winter Wren(3) Brown Creeper(1) Fox Sparrow(3) *_Low Counts_**_(#, previous low)_* Bufflehead (7,7) Rock Pigeon(3,5) Red-shouldered Hawk(6,6) Yellow-bellied Sapsucker(4,4) Cedar Waxwing(4,10) Dark-eyed Junco(46,51)
Date: 1/13/20 11:13 am From: Linda Ward (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Osprey, Dare County, NC
Almost forgot to post this sighting....returning from Alligator NWR on Sunday, Jan 12 we saw an osprey perched on top of a snag near a nest that had been built in the top of a tree (probably from last year). This was near the Visitor's Center for Dare County just at the Roanoke Island end of the bridge between Roanoke Island and Mann's Harbor.
Date: 1/13/20 6:51 am From: jim.capel (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Derb Carter at the Chapel Hill Bird Club - January 27th
The Chapel Hill Bird Club will meet at 7:30 pm on Monday, January 27th in the lounge at Binkley Baptist Church. Binkley is at 1712 Willow Drive in Chapel Hill, NC. The featured speaker is Derb Carter, who will present on “My NC Big Year.”
Mr. Carter, environmental attorney and director of the Southern Environmental Law Center’s Chapel Hill office, observed 351 species of birds in NC during 2008, establishing the Big Year record. Join us, as he recounts his adventures.
Admission is free and the public is invited. Come at 7:15 p.m. for light refreshments.
Date: 1/13/20 1:55 am From: Linda Ward (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Location of sandhill cranes at Pocoson Lakes NWR
When seen on the afternoon of the 11th and morning of the 12th this was the location of the 7 cranes:
West Lake Road Observation Point. Enter refuge on Pat's Road from 45...this road becomes Canal D road as pavement runs out and becomes dirt/sand. Follow Canal D until a right turn (East) onto Property Line Rd (altho we saw no sign for this road). Then turn right (south) on West Lake and stop at intersection with sign "West Lake Road Observation Point." In the afternoon, the cranes were in corn stubble viewed from the end of West Lake Rd; in the morning they were in the wet area/impoundment that bordered the intersection (this will be obvious). If you can find the map online with numbered observation points, West Lake is Number 4.
Did some light birding around Dare County today. Nothing of note except a Purple Sandpiper at the end of jetty at Oregon Inlet. Hadn’t seen one in a while at that location.
Today, the 12th, we had 3 sightings of the rough-legged hawk at Alligator Refuge. All 3 times we found it sitting in the middle of a field, much as we've often seen the harriers do. Had excellent looks, with light breast and below a distinct black belly, and when it took off we could see the black edging to wings. After the first view, it flew to the field next to the one where we first saw it, and we had another good look. Then it flew again and we lost sight of it. We drove on around long curve drive, but didn't see it, then returned to the main wildlife drive and found it again in one of the closely mowed fields sitting again. It took off again, and we lost sight again. We thought it odd that it was sitting in fields, but hardly any birds were in flight when we were there this afternoon. For example, we saw a total of 8 bald eagles, all perched in trees, none in flight. We found many turkey vultures, all sitting in fields, or in trees. Not sure if it was the front going thru or what that had these birds "grounded". Harriers were in flight, tho, but not much.
The fields we found the hawk in were all between the turn off to Sawyer Lake Rd and the turn off to Long Curve. All fields were well mowed, and not full of wildflowers or wees.
Date: 1/11/20 5:33 am From: Nathan Gatto (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Closed - Archie Elledge and Pat Swann Water Treatment Plants
Carolina Birders, Archie Elledge (Winston-Salem, NC) and Pat Swann (Pfafftown, NC) are closed to birder access starting today, 1/11/2020. If they reopen, I will inform the group.
Date: 1/10/20 5:51 pm From: Ken Kneidel (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Re: R-c Kinglets and the CBC
Kevin,
I trust the modelers at Audubon have taken into consideration the issues you raise. I see them as the "someones" with the time to do the digging you wished you had time to do.
Curtis Smalling, when he presented at our recent club meeting, said that a variety of factors have been taken into consideration in making the predictions they have done in Survival by Degrees. In the older report, he said they relied primarily on temperature, and in doing so, made the outrageous prediction that skimmers would be moving to the Appalachians. Now, they're looking at suitability of habitat, and changes in habitat, as well as just temperature changes in predicting shifts in the species' distributions.
On Fri, Jan 10, 2020 at 7:02 PM Kevin Metcalf <carolinabirds...> wrote:
> Yes, this is an important way to look at it. It isn't an either-or > situation of greater survivability vs northern range expanion - the two are > intertwined. Data from bird counts could show us if the areas to the north > of their prior wintering range are now starting to get Ruby-crowns. > (Someone with more time than me to look into it could give us the answer > with a little digging). > > I also wonder if there could eventually be less Ruby-crowns at the > southern edge of their wintering range (which extends into Mexico), if this > trend continues? What limits their winter range now? Is it temperature > directly, or the side effects of temperature related to food availability? > Or competition from other arthropod gleaners that also might be able to > survive winter further north in a warmer world? Lots of interestin g points > to ponder. Maybe all of the above. Is climate change also shifting their > spruce-fir forest breeding range? Thanks Ken, for bringing up this > intereting topic. > > Kevin Metcalf > Huntersville, NC > > > -----Original Message----- > >From: <badgerboy...> > >Sent: Jan 10, 2020 5:16 PM > >To: <carolinabirds...> > >Subject: Re: R-c Kinglets and the CBC > > > >It might be useful to note that because these birds are surviving in > >higher numbers, they ARE then wintering further north, at least in the > >sense of being detected more by birders. Thats evolution selecting for > >the trait of northerly wintering. > > > >On 1/10/2020 5:01 PM, Harry LeGrand (via carolinabirds Mailing List) > wrote: > >> They aren't wintering farther north, they are surviving in higher > >> numbers. > >> > >> > > >
Date: 1/10/20 4:02 pm From: Kevin Metcalf (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Re: R-c Kinglets and the CBC
Yes, this is an important way to look at it. It isn't an either-or situation of greater survivability vs northern range expanion - the two are intertwined. Data from bird counts could show us if the areas to the north of their prior wintering range are now starting to get Ruby-crowns. (Someone with more time than me to look into it could give us the answer with a little digging). I also wonder if there could eventually be less Ruby-crowns at the southern edge of their wintering range (which extends into Mexico), if this trend continues? What limits their winter range now? Is it temperature directly, or the side effects of temperature related to food availability? Or competition from other arthropod gleaners that also might be able to survive winter further north in a warmer world? Lots of interestin g points to ponder. Maybe all of the above. Is climate change also shifting their spruce-fir forest breeding range? Thanks Ken, for bringing up this intereting topic.
Kevin Metcalf Huntersville, NC
-----Original Message----- >From: <badgerboy...> >Sent: Jan 10, 2020 5:16 PM >To: <carolinabirds...> >Subject: Re: R-c Kinglets and the CBC > >It might be useful to note that because these birds are surviving in >higher numbers, they ARE then wintering further north, at least in the >sense of being detected more by birders. Thats evolution selecting for >the trait of northerly wintering. > >On 1/10/2020 5:01 PM, Harry LeGrand (via carolinabirds Mailing List) wrote: >> They aren't wintering farther north, they are surviving in higher >> numbers. >> >> >
Date: 1/10/20 2:24 pm From: Harry LeGrand (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Re: R-c Kinglets and the CBC
Yes, I agree -- "differential survival" over the years would indeed yield a "northward" moving edge to the wintering range. It's like Yellowthroats or Brown Thrashers surviving warm winters in the mountains, instead of dying out. Over time, that means these birds DO winter routinely there, making it all the way into March, and thus the winter range does move north as a result. Glad you pointed this feature out.
Harry
On Fri, Jan 10, 2020 at 5:16 PM <badgerboy...> wrote:
> It might be useful to note that because these birds are surviving in > higher numbers, they ARE then wintering further north, at least in the > sense of being detected more by birders. Thats evolution selecting for > the trait of northerly wintering. > > On 1/10/2020 5:01 PM, Harry LeGrand (via carolinabirds Mailing List) wrote: > > They aren't wintering farther north, they are surviving in higher > > numbers. > > > > > >
Date: 1/10/20 2:16 pm From: <badgerboy...> Subject: Re: R-c Kinglets and the CBC
It might be useful to note that because these birds are surviving in higher numbers, they ARE then wintering further north, at least in the sense of being detected more by birders. Thats evolution selecting for the trait of northerly wintering.
On 1/10/2020 5:01 PM, Harry LeGrand (via carolinabirds Mailing List) wrote: > They aren't wintering farther north, they are surviving in higher > numbers. > >
Date: 1/10/20 2:06 pm From: Ken Kneidel (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Re: R-c Kinglets and the CBC
Interesting alternative. My experience in Charlotte is that the cold snaps
that might kill Kinglets occur after December, so it's hard for me to buy
that their numbers were lower here in the past because of colder weather in
December. I'm a retired teacher, and all the snow days in my memory came
January through March, not a one in December. If the cold weather kills
them, and it's warmer now, I'd expect their improved survival to be more
evident later in the year and not in December.
Ken Kneidel
Charlotte
On Fri, Jan 10, 2020 at 4:43 PM "Shultz, Steven" <carolinabirds...>
wrote:
> Maybe something else to consider. My understanding is that RCKI have very
> high level of fecundity (basically they hatch a whole bunch of young’uns)
> due to, generally, high winter mortality (fide: the back of my Audubon bird
> of the day calendar)
>
>
>
> Well, winters have not been that significant of late in these parts. Ask
> the mosquitos I was swatting away on the Mattamuskeet CBC. I saw a blog on
> weather underground showing that Raleigh NC is in the midst of the lowest
> snow-free (or low snow) period since records began. And my heating bill
> last month was glorious!
>
>
>
> So could it be that RCKIs are not changing distribution, but are rather
> more abundant because their winter mortality is not as high as it normally
> is in places where they would normally experience populations impacts due
> to weather? It makes sense to me that in SC they would not experience as
> much mortality as in NC, we seem to be on the lower (south) boundary of
> “winter”.
>
>
>
> I believe Dr. H LeGrand noted (and this was some years ago after a central
> NC ice storm) that RCKIs are not facultative migrants and normally
> experience high mortality during cold snaps (sorry if I put words in your
> mouth Harry!)
>
>
>
> So are the birds actually wintering father north.. or are they *
> *surviving** at a higher rate?
>
>
>
>
>
> Steve Shultz
>
> Apex NC
>
>
>
> *From:* <carolinabirds-request...> [mailto:
> <carolinabirds-request...>] *On Behalf Of *Ken Kneidel
> *Sent:* Friday, January 10, 2020 4:28 PM
> *To:* Carolina Birds
> *Subject:* R-c Kinglets and the CBC
>
>
>
> *This email is from an external source - exercise caution regarding links
> and attachments. *
>
>
>
> All the data is in on the Audubon Charlotte Christmas Bird Count conducted
> on December 28. Thanks to 42 volunteers for giving their best on a
> beautiful day. We wound up with 93 species, about our recent average. We
> had 90 last year and 95 the year before, our all-time high is 101 in 2016.
>
> In the past I’ve highlighted species that are joining the count by now
> wintering a bit farther north than they historically have. These include
> Palm Warbler, Blue-headed Vireo, House Wren, Black and White Warbler and
> Orange-crowned Warbler. These have become regulars after having been just
> about absent before 2000. All were seen again this year in solid numbers.
>
> A more obscure trend, however, is with Ruby-crowned Kinglets, who seem to
> be doing the same thing. Although a common winter resident in Charlotte,
> the historical high abundance center for Ruby’s is just south of Charlotte
> in South Carolina (looking at December eBird records from 1900-2010). So,
> one would expect if other birds are moving their wintering range north,
> Ruby's should become more common as they do as well. Lo and behold we
> knocked the socks off the previous record for Ruby’s in the count (170 in
> 2016) by recording a whopping 201!
>
> Digging deeper, from 1941-1969 we averaged 8 Ruby’s per count, from
> 1970-2001 we averaged 34, from 2003-2018 we averaged 94 (topping 100 seven
> times in these 16 years). Now we’re over 200.
>
> My takeaway from this is (1) how although with the Christmas Bird Count we
> tend to think of global trends, each count circle has its own story to tell
> and (2) how important it is to count every bird. I know during counts we
> become focused on finding that rare bird, but here we see that the common
> Ruby-crowned Kinglet, right under our nose, might be the bird with the
> interesting story to tell.
>
> Props to my son, Alan, for predicting this trend before the count, and
> Audubon's report Survival by Degrees which does the same, see the predicted
> future winter range for Ruby-crowned Kinglets here:
> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.audubon.org_field-2Dguide_bird_ruby-2Dcrowned-2Dkinglet&d=DwIFaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=tsyXnbbgk5QRlYTW_ZSjYgKrCh2etJbrSO_xeaXLW7k&s=20NB0LT5CRUuZZaYwSNMSrhpRLt38VByi3w4-Tf_8FY&e= > <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.audubon.org_field-2Dguide_bird_ruby-2Dcrowned-2Dkinglet&d=DwMFaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=rBy7wOI-gKOsHfPoisZ78RtnB5ypgqOe0puuH-nMuZg&s=9QcaFCt8AoquRicZ2M3rUPNpFXVu2sMFzRUK8Bxz8UY&e=> >
> Ken Kneidel
> Charlotte CBC compiler
>
Date: 1/10/20 2:02 pm From: Harry LeGrand (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Re: R-c Kinglets and the CBC
I agree 100% with Steve. You will probably note that after severe cold
spells, which we have in the Carolinas every 2-3 winters, Rubies crash in
numbers, along with birds like Winter Wrens, and a number of other small
passerines. These guys aren't going to be building up enough fat during
winter to actually "migrate" south when very cold weather hits. They don't
have that migratory condition in winter (Zugunruhe). They simply go to
roost, fluff up, and hope to not fall off their perch and die overnight.
Note that songbirds that you see flying in daytime -- waxwings, robins,
swallows, winter finches, etc., CAN indeed make wintertime north or south
movements.
I recall doing surveys at Clemson for 3 winters in the mid-70s. One of the
three winters was absolutely brutal. Normally, in the other winters I would
get 10-20 Rubies on a route, but on the other, at least by February, it was
0-2 per route.
As long as the winter stays mild, we won't see much mortality, and we
SHOULD see even MORE Rubies in the Carolinas next fall. They aren't
wintering farther north, they are surviving in higher numbers.
Harry LeGrand
On Fri, Jan 10, 2020 at 4:43 PM "Shultz, Steven" <carolinabirds...>
wrote:
> Maybe something else to consider. My understanding is that RCKI have very
> high level of fecundity (basically they hatch a whole bunch of young’uns)
> due to, generally, high winter mortality (fide: the back of my Audubon bird
> of the day calendar)
>
>
>
> Well, winters have not been that significant of late in these parts. Ask
> the mosquitos I was swatting away on the Mattamuskeet CBC. I saw a blog on
> weather underground showing that Raleigh NC is in the midst of the lowest
> snow-free (or low snow) period since records began. And my heating bill
> last month was glorious!
>
>
>
> So could it be that RCKIs are not changing distribution, but are rather
> more abundant because their winter mortality is not as high as it normally
> is in places where they would normally experience populations impacts due
> to weather? It makes sense to me that in SC they would not experience as
> much mortality as in NC, we seem to be on the lower (south) boundary of
> “winter”.
>
>
>
> I believe Dr. H LeGrand noted (and this was some years ago after a central
> NC ice storm) that RCKIs are not facultative migrants and normally
> experience high mortality during cold snaps (sorry if I put words in your
> mouth Harry!)
>
>
>
> So are the birds actually wintering father north.. or are they *
> *surviving** at a higher rate?
>
>
>
>
>
> Steve Shultz
>
> Apex NC
>
>
>
> *From:* <carolinabirds-request...> [mailto:
> <carolinabirds-request...>] *On Behalf Of *Ken Kneidel
> *Sent:* Friday, January 10, 2020 4:28 PM
> *To:* Carolina Birds
> *Subject:* R-c Kinglets and the CBC
>
>
>
> *This email is from an external source - exercise caution regarding links
> and attachments. *
>
>
>
> All the data is in on the Audubon Charlotte Christmas Bird Count conducted
> on December 28. Thanks to 42 volunteers for giving their best on a
> beautiful day. We wound up with 93 species, about our recent average. We
> had 90 last year and 95 the year before, our all-time high is 101 in 2016.
>
> In the past I’ve highlighted species that are joining the count by now
> wintering a bit farther north than they historically have. These include
> Palm Warbler, Blue-headed Vireo, House Wren, Black and White Warbler and
> Orange-crowned Warbler. These have become regulars after having been just
> about absent before 2000. All were seen again this year in solid numbers.
>
> A more obscure trend, however, is with Ruby-crowned Kinglets, who seem to
> be doing the same thing. Although a common winter resident in Charlotte,
> the historical high abundance center for Ruby’s is just south of Charlotte
> in South Carolina (looking at December eBird records from 1900-2010). So,
> one would expect if other birds are moving their wintering range north,
> Ruby's should become more common as they do as well. Lo and behold we
> knocked the socks off the previous record for Ruby’s in the count (170 in
> 2016) by recording a whopping 201!
>
> Digging deeper, from 1941-1969 we averaged 8 Ruby’s per count, from
> 1970-2001 we averaged 34, from 2003-2018 we averaged 94 (topping 100 seven
> times in these 16 years). Now we’re over 200.
>
> My takeaway from this is (1) how although with the Christmas Bird Count we
> tend to think of global trends, each count circle has its own story to tell
> and (2) how important it is to count every bird. I know during counts we
> become focused on finding that rare bird, but here we see that the common
> Ruby-crowned Kinglet, right under our nose, might be the bird with the
> interesting story to tell.
>
> Props to my son, Alan, for predicting this trend before the count, and
> Audubon's report Survival by Degrees which does the same, see the predicted
> future winter range for Ruby-crowned Kinglets here:
> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.audubon.org_field-2Dguide_bird_ruby-2Dcrowned-2Dkinglet&d=DwIFaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=WzFeIqbN6l7ZQlq1slgBcfmvwshFXPa2efcf9bopUZE&s=BK-2DZK-7zs9JyZ78lnnjYmkrliLBbQHea1eV2rZ5CM&e= > <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.audubon.org_field-2Dguide_bird_ruby-2Dcrowned-2Dkinglet&d=DwMFaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=rBy7wOI-gKOsHfPoisZ78RtnB5ypgqOe0puuH-nMuZg&s=9QcaFCt8AoquRicZ2M3rUPNpFXVu2sMFzRUK8Bxz8UY&e=> >
> Ken Kneidel
> Charlotte CBC compiler
>
Date: 1/10/20 1:43 pm From: \Shultz, Steven\ (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: RE: R-c Kinglets and the CBC
Maybe something else to consider. My understanding is that RCKI have very high level of fecundity (basically they hatch a whole bunch of young’uns) due to, generally, high winter mortality (fide: the back of my Audubon bird of the day calendar)
Well, winters have not been that significant of late in these parts. Ask the mosquitos I was swatting away on the Mattamuskeet CBC. I saw a blog on weather underground showing that Raleigh NC is in the midst of the lowest snow-free (or low snow) period since records began. And my heating bill last month was glorious!
So could it be that RCKIs are not changing distribution, but are rather more abundant because their winter mortality is not as high as it normally is in places where they would normally experience populations impacts due to weather? It makes sense to me that in SC they would not experience as much mortality as in NC, we seem to be on the lower (south) boundary of “winter”.
I believe Dr. H LeGrand noted (and this was some years ago after a central NC ice storm) that RCKIs are not facultative migrants and normally experience high mortality during cold snaps (sorry if I put words in your mouth Harry!)
So are the birds actually wintering father north.. or are they *surviving* at a higher rate?
Steve Shultz
Apex NC
From: <carolinabirds-request...> [mailto:<carolinabirds-request...>] On Behalf Of Ken Kneidel
Sent: Friday, January 10, 2020 4:28 PM
To: Carolina Birds
Subject: R-c Kinglets and the CBC
This email is from an external source - exercise caution regarding links and attachments.
All the data is in on the Audubon Charlotte Christmas Bird Count conducted on December 28. Thanks to 42 volunteers for giving their best on a beautiful day. We wound up with 93 species, about our recent average. We had 90 last year and 95 the year before, our all-time high is 101 in 2016.
In the past I’ve highlighted species that are joining the count by now wintering a bit farther north than they historically have. These include Palm Warbler, Blue-headed Vireo, House Wren, Black and White Warbler and Orange-crowned Warbler. These have become regulars after having been just about absent before 2000. All were seen again this year in solid numbers.
A more obscure trend, however, is with Ruby-crowned Kinglets, who seem to be doing the same thing. Although a common winter resident in Charlotte, the historical high abundance center for Ruby’s is just south of Charlotte in South Carolina (looking at December eBird records from 1900-2010). So, one would expect if other birds are moving their wintering range north, Ruby's should become more common as they do as well. Lo and behold we knocked the socks off the previous record for Ruby’s in the count (170 in 2016) by recording a whopping 201!
Digging deeper, from 1941-1969 we averaged 8 Ruby’s per count, from 1970-2001 we averaged 34, from 2003-2018 we averaged 94 (topping 100 seven times in these 16 years). Now we’re over 200.
My takeaway from this is (1) how although with the Christmas Bird Count we tend to think of global trends, each count circle has its own story to tell and (2) how important it is to count every bird. I know during counts we become focused on finding that rare bird, but here we see that the common Ruby-crowned Kinglet, right under our nose, might be the bird with the interesting story to tell.
Props to my son, Alan, for predicting this trend before the count, and Audubon's report Survival by Degrees which does the same, see the predicted future winter range for Ruby-crowned Kinglets here: https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.audubon.org_field-2Dguide_bird_ruby-2Dcrowned-2Dkinglet&d=DwIGaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=2YJTok51hwf7ZrenYmPgQ8AY7Afyr8RVCV9YFvAarGE&s=02CtC6evUP3LMuNsdUN_apsHza0E1jhDhVS6jWwMIOM&e= <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.audubon.org_field-2Dguide_bird_ruby-2Dcrowned-2Dkinglet&d=DwMFaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=rBy7wOI-gKOsHfPoisZ78RtnB5ypgqOe0puuH-nMuZg&s=9QcaFCt8AoquRicZ2M3rUPNpFXVu2sMFzRUK8Bxz8UY&e=> Ken Kneidel
Charlotte CBC compiler
Date: 1/10/20 1:28 pm From: Ken Kneidel (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: R-c Kinglets and the CBC
All the data is in on the Audubon Charlotte Christmas Bird Count conducted
on December 28. Thanks to 42 volunteers for giving their best on a
beautiful day. We wound up with 93 species, about our recent average. We
had 90 last year and 95 the year before, our all-time high is 101 in 2016.
In the past I’ve highlighted species that are joining the count by now
wintering a bit farther north than they historically have. These include
Palm Warbler, Blue-headed Vireo, House Wren, Black and White Warbler and
Orange-crowned Warbler. These have become regulars after having been just
about absent before 2000. All were seen again this year in solid numbers.
A more obscure trend, however, is with Ruby-crowned Kinglets, who seem to
be doing the same thing. Although a common winter resident in Charlotte,
the historical high abundance center for Ruby’s is just south of Charlotte
in South Carolina (looking at December eBird records from 1900-2010). So,
one would expect if other birds are moving their wintering range north,
Ruby's should become more common as they do as well. Lo and behold we
knocked the socks off the previous record for Ruby’s in the count (170 in
2016) by recording a whopping 201!
Digging deeper, from 1941-1969 we averaged 8 Ruby’s per count, from
1970-2001 we averaged 34, from 2003-2018 we averaged 94 (topping 100 seven
times in these 16 years). Now we’re over 200.
My takeaway from this is (1) how although with the Christmas Bird Count we
tend to think of global trends, each count circle has its own story to tell
and (2) how important it is to count every bird. I know during counts we
become focused on finding that rare bird, but here we see that the common
Ruby-crowned Kinglet, right under our nose, might be the bird with the
interesting story to tell.
Date: 1/10/20 10:00 am From: Nate Dias (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Snow Goose in North Charleston
Today around 11am there was a blue phase Snow Goose in with feral Canada Geese in the pond on Bridge View Drive near the corner of Leeds Avenue. The pond is diagonally across Bridge View Drive from the county government office building.
"These days I prefer to hunt with a camera. A good photograph demands more skill from the hunter, better nerves and more patience than the rifle shot." -- Bror Blixen
Date: 1/10/20 5:03 am From: \Gilbert S. Grant\ (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Wood stork in Sneads Ferry, NC today
Just now I watched a Wood Stork flying northward over the North Shores golf course in Sneads Ferry, Onslow County, NC. Would be interesting to know if this was the same individual that John Fussell reported over Pine Knoll Shores. Gilbert S. GrantSneads Ferry,NC
Date: 1/10/20 3:49 am From: John Fussell <jofuss...> Subject: Wood Stork in Carteret County, NC
Yesterday, about 10am, I had a Wood Stork circling over the N.C. Aquarium (on Bogue Banks) for a couple of minutes, before it drifted SW out of sight behind the tree line. Perhaps it continued westerly down the island.
I was very surprised that this sighting was not flagged by ebird. In all my years of birding in Carteret, this was only my second sighting of a Wood Stork here. The other was also of a single bird, and was also in winter (December 1977).
I might not have looked up and seen the bird if it had not been for 3 circling Ospreys, which were calling loudly, seemingly excitedly. I couldn't help but wonder if this was related to the presence of the nearby soaring stork.
Date: 1/9/20 4:00 pm From: Marbry Hopkins (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Cackling Goose at Old Kernersville Lake Park
Nathaniel Watkins discovered a Cackling Goose in Kernersville, NC in a large flock of Canada Geese. Old Kernersville Lake Park is located near 936 Lake Drive in Kernersville. If you travel from the west you will need to use I-40 around Winston Salem but you can connect with old Business 40 at 52 N.
Marbry Hopkins Kernersville, NC -- Hop Hopkins Kernersville, NC
> On Jan 9, 2020, at 11:10 AM, whoffman (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> wrote:
>
>
> Present now at Carolina Beach Lake.
>
> 11:09 AM Jan 9
>
> Wayne
>
>
> Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone
>
Date: 1/8/20 6:10 am From: Corey, Ed <ed.corey...> Subject: RE: [External] Wood Stork sighting in Moore Co.
Mike Gosselin had 5 Wood Storks flying over Alligator River NWR yesterday as well.
Ed Corey
Raleigh, NC
Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone
-------- Original message --------
From: Susan Campbell <susan...>
Date: 1/7/20 9:45 PM (GMT-05:00)
To: Carolinabirds <carolinabirds...>
Subject: [External] Wood Stork sighting in Moore Co.
CAUTION: External email. Do not click links or open attachments unless you verify. Send all suspicious email as an attachment to <report.spam...><mailto:<report.spam...>
I received notification today that two Wood Storks were seen over Lake Auman this past weekend by a local couple. Although the birds were first spotted soaring over the lake, they did fly down over the dam and presumably landed in the swamp downstream.
The lake is in a gated community (Seven Lakes) with few birdwatchers. I am hoping that the Misegades, who are new residents, will let me know about other interesting observations from here on out.
I have spread the word locally-- hopefully they will get re-sighted if they are some place nearby.
Date: 1/7/20 6:45 pm From: Susan Campbell <susan...> Subject: Wood Stork sighting in Moore Co.
I received notification today that two Wood Storks were seen over Lake Auman this past weekend by a local couple. Although the birds were first spotted soaring over the lake, they did fly down over the dam and presumably landed in the swamp downstream.
The lake is in a gated community (Seven Lakes) with few birdwatchers. I am hoping that the Misegades, who are new residents, will let me know about other interesting observations from here on out.
I have spread the word locally-- hopefully they will get re-sighted if they are some place nearby.
Regarding Ebird lists, Christmas Bird Counts, and summarizing what you saw:
Ebird has a feature that helps you summarize all of your checklists for one CBC.
I use the ebird mobile app to make the checklists, one for each
location, during a CBC.
Then I access ebird via a real computer and use the web site, not the
phone app, when I want to summarize.
After making all my lists on the phone app, and then CHECKING them on
the computer for accuracy:
Click on My Ebird, then Summarize My Observations, then Week Report
(but you are using this feature for a day...)
Next, pick the date of the CBC you covered, then choose all the
locations you visited that day for the CBC. Then hit Continue.
It generates a multi-tab report showing how many of each species was
seen at each location.
The report tab called "Species Totals" shows the number of each
species seen, in taxonomic order. BINGO!
PLUS, you can download it as a spreadsheet, which makes it easy to
prepare your report for the CBC compiler.
Only weakness: If you are visiting the same locations on other days of
that week, then they get dumped in there, too.
But most birders are birding a CBC location that isn't on their daily
routine, so it's a minor problem. And I have a couple of workarounds
for that (change the locations or dates temporarily of the ones you
don't want in the report, then change them back when you have the
report.)
(I think Kent F's link looks like it is even better than this method!
I will give it a try soon.)
My experience about the different methods: I helped out on a CBC in
Daytona Beach, Florida a couple of years ago, and the leader never
shared the list(s) with me on ebird. Annoying.
The next year, I led the quadrant. I made plenty of lists, shared them
with the team members, and I used the ebird summary report (described
above) to fill in the data sheet for the quadrant.
This year I was on a team of three but I was not the leader. I quietly
used ebird to make my 10 lists, changing to a new list whenever we
moved to a new location or when nocturnal became diurnal.
The summary report was the job of the leader of the three-person team.
The leader made his own ebird list, starting at 6 am ("nocturnal"),
running for 11 hours, and reported all the birds for one personal
location inside a park....but half of our stops were NOT in that park!
And he didn't share the list; I happened to find it on ebird. I shared
my lists with the third birder.
Is it redundant data?
So which method is better?
Lynn Erla Beegle
Raleigh NC
On Tue, Jan 7, 2020 at 2:27 PM Corey, Ed <ed.corey...> wrote:
>
> I was able to compile 15 checklists rather easily using Kent’s link, but it would be nice to know what the upper limit for functionality would be.
>
>
>
> Ed Corey
>
> Inventory Biologist, NC Division of Parks and Recreation
>
> NC Dept. of Natural and Cultural Resources
>
> 919 841 4037 Office
>
> 919 208 7864 Mobile
>
> <Ed.Corey...>
>
>
>
> 12700 Bayleaf Church Road | Raleigh, North Carolina 27614
>
>
>
> Email correspondence to and from this address is subject to the North Carolina Public Records Law and may be disclosed to third parties.
>
>
>
> From: <carolinabirds-request...> <carolinabirds-request...> On Behalf Of Kent Fiala
> Sent: Tuesday, January 7, 2020 1:56 PM
> To: <carolinabirds...>
> Subject: [External] Re: Ebird checklists for CBC's getting flagged
>
>
>
> CAUTION: External email. Do not click links or open attachments unless you verify. Send all suspicious email as an attachment to <report.spam...>
>
>
>
> I'll admit to not having tried it, but theoretically you should be able to merge 200 separate checklists in my https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.faintlake.com_eBird_compiler_&d=DwIFaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=rR0AQPUKPnPlfGDPaX28GbAAvIJ1bqfumKxvXtQGrAE&s=Pi498pC7zjAyBJ1sYPjbwyAJS04cZmmk8mhImJKsxsM&e= tool. Let me know if there is a way that I could make it easier.
>
> Kent Fiala
>
> On 1/7/2020 1:52 PM, Christopher Hill (via carolinabirds Mailing List) wrote:
>
> Speaking as a compiler, I cannot really handle “proper” ebird lists, and I ask my counters ON THIS ONE DAY to make one list (or two, or three, but not 8 or 12) that makes my life easier. I have a great workflow for going from ebird lists to the spreadsheet where I compile all the results, but the count I compile has 20+ parties in the field, plus feeder watchers. If each of those parties were to submit 8 lists, that’s nearly two hundred separate lists for me to merge, which is not fun at all (right, Judi?). And many of the “territories” within our CBC circle have existed in their present form for decades. There is definitely value in going back to see what a normal day’s count was in your count sector 10, 20, 30 years ago, as contrasted with the atomized site by site nature of ebird records.
>
>
>
> There is just a conflict between doing an ideal eBird list and doing an ideal CBC list. Remember also that the CBC in its 120 years of history records time and distance data differently from ebird,* and there is value in consistency there, too. I don’t think you can expect a perfect solution. Well, if I were the boss of eBird I could invent a “Doing a Christmas Bird Count” protocol very much like the iPhone day summary people are talking about that would work for both CBC compilers and habitual ebirders, but I am pretty sure I am not the boss of ebird, so don’t hold your breath on that.
>
>
>
> Chris Hill
>
> Conway, SC
>
>
>
> *yes Wendy I got your email!
>
>
>
> On Jan 7, 2020, at 12:11 PM, Tom <carolinabirds...> wrote:
>
>
>
> I break my lists up and use the trip summary feature to enter the final numbers. The summary trip summary shows your species list and totals in one location, at least the IOS version does.
>
> Tom Ledford
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>
>
> On Jan 7, 2020, at 10:01 AM, Judi Sawyer (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> wrote:
>
>
>
> Guy, I used to try to split it up by location but it was just too hard to compile at the end of the day. I could export each list to a spreadsheet but I still found myself making mistakes when combining the lists. With this last CBC for Elizabethton, Roan Mountain and the Grandfather Count I did mostly one list. Grandfather I split between Valle Crucis park and then the rest of our route. I just noted it as traveling and put a comment for which CBC it was. I know eBird doesn't like lists that are longer than 4 miles or so, but honestly, I found that it was too cumbersome to try to split them. Inevitably, someone would ask me during the count how many Eastern Bluebirds (or whatever) we had seen so far and I'd have to shuffle through 9 checklists to figure it out. I know combing them is not ideal, but they weren't flagged. I'd be interested to know if there are better ways to do it, or if it skews the data enough that it's better for scientific purposes to just not try to eBird them.
>
>
>
> Judi
>
>
>
> On Tue, Jan 7, 2020 at 9:33 AM <badgerboy...> wrote:
>
> Thanks Kent, yes I did read that and honestly it wasn't very helpful. It says to break up your day into multiple checklists, and of course that defeats the purpose. Didn't anyone else out there have any input on this? Wasn't anyone able to get ebird lists to work for CBC's and not be flagged? You can reply to my private email if your afraid of being targeted by the reviewers.
>
> Thanks, Guy
>
> On 1/3/2020 7:35 PM, Kent Fiala (via carolinabirds Mailing List) wrote:
>
> Have you read https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__ebird.org_news_ebirding-2Dyour-2Dcbc&d=DwIFaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=rR0AQPUKPnPlfGDPaX28GbAAvIJ1bqfumKxvXtQGrAE&s=2ejfhhMbL0pEt2WqY9JVwMA1uCnWnVpU39ybCZd9tE4&e= >
> Kent Fiala
>
> On 1/3/2020 7:29 PM, <badgerboy...> wrote:
>
> My CBC Ebird checklists are getting flagged so they do not appear in public outputs. The message I see on the checklist says:"Protocol issue. This checklist has been flagged because of an issue with the selected protocol. This checklist and its observations do not appear in public eBird outputs."
>
> A few years ago I heard that it was OK to submit a CBC Ebird checklist as long as you used the "Incidental" protocol and used the following language in the description of the site:"XXXX CBC Sector 4--DATA" That is what I have done but now they are being hidden. And there is no way to know what the specific issue with the checklist is.
>
> I've gone through Ebird's guidelines to try and find what the problem might be, but can't find anything that should trigger this flag, which apparently is the reviewer's decision. Does anyone know how to make a CBC checklist acceptable for Ebird?
>
> Guy McGrane, Deep Gap, NC
>
>
Date: 1/7/20 1:05 pm From: Brian Bockhahn (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Rocky Mount CBC results
The 23rd Rocky Mount CBC was held on December 20, 2019 under clear skies,
calm winds and cooler temperatures in the morning 23-56. 9 counters in the
field and 1 feeder counter tallied our third highest total with *98 species
(*average 89). Not as surprising with no large flocks of blackbirds, swans
or gulls, we tallied our lowest with only 3,057 birds (average 7,930 and
previous low was 4,567!). Most numerous birds were 208 American Robin and
207 White-throated Sparrow
Highlights include two first count record birds, a less surprising American
Bittern flew over Seven Ridges Road at dawn, but remarkable and indicate of
the fall-like conditions recently was a well seen and photographed Le
Conte’s Sparrow at a private farm.
Other goodies include our second Blue-gray Gnatcatcher along Seven Bridges
Road; our third Snow Goose along swift creek near Whitakers; third Green
Heron along Seven Bridges; fourth count birds include 4 Sandhill Cranes in
two spots in the floodplain swamps along Seven Bridges Road; fourth record
of Lincoln’s Sparrow southeast of Rocky Mount.
We set record highs with 5 Coopers Hawk, 5 Bald Eagle, 16 Pileated
Woodpecker, 24 Pine Warbler. Record lows of 1 Snipe, 1 American Woodcock,
30 Ring-billed Gull and 3 Winter Wren. Yep, November like.
Misses include Northern Bobwhite, any gull other than Ring-billed, Great
Horned Owl!, Red-breasted Nuthatch of course, Brown-headed Cowbird! and of
course Purple Finch and Pine Siskin too.
Thanks to all my intrepid counters for a great count!
Mark your calendars for next year’s count: Friday, December 18, 2020.
A lot of the swans at Mattamuskeet actually fly out, versus in, at dusk. They've learned to avoid hunters by feeding at night. Pretty slick.
One of the better spots to watch is from the Lake Landing area. Park in the little lot by the closed gate. At dusk recently we had more than 20,000 ducks fly out from the lake toward the sound at sunset. You'll also see swans here. Lake Landing is on the lake's east side, just south of Engelhard. A bridge over the canal and small sign indicate you are at the right spot. Drive west 1/3 mile from 264 to the parking lot. Birds leave the lake about the time a woodcock starts calling, so fairly dark. Say 20-30 minutes after sunset?
The "entrance impoundment" (Refuge entrance road at Hwy 94) used to be good for fly-out, but they seem not to be using the area as much.
To see really big numbers of swans, head up to Pungo. But be prepared for bad roads and few road signs :-) Areas on the NW and SW sides of the lake seem to have the most birds flying back and forth.
Steve Shultz
Apex NC
-----Original Message-----
From: <carolinabirds-request...> [mailto:<carolinabirds-request...>] On Behalf Of Anne Olsen
Sent: Tuesday, January 07, 2020 3:12 PM
To: <carolinabirds...>
Subject: Mattamuskeet birding
This email is from an external source - exercise caution regarding links and attachments.
Blayne and I are traveling to Mattamuskeet tomorrow to see the Tundra Swans and other waterfowl. Tundras will be a life bird for me.
I have studied the eBird posts for this area but have not yet found good information about when to see the swans flying in to roost. Is it possible to see that? Where to view? What time?
Any other suggestions would be appreciated. I have the info about Pungo roads and several ebird lists.
On Tue, Jan 7, 2020 at 2:27 PM Corey, Ed <ed.corey...> wrote:
> I was able to compile 15 checklists rather easily using Kent’s link, but
> it would be nice to know what the upper limit for functionality would be.
>
>
>
> *Ed Corey*
>
> Inventory Biologist, NC Division of Parks and Recreation
>
> NC Dept. of Natural and Cultural Resources
>
> 919 841 4037 Office
>
> 919 208 7864 Mobile
>
> <Ed.Corey...>
>
>
>
> 12700 Bayleaf Church Road | Raleigh, North Carolina 27614
>
>
>
> *Email correspondence to and from this address is subject to the North
> Carolina Public Records Law and may be disclosed to third parties.*
>
>
>
> *From:* <carolinabirds-request...> <carolinabirds-request...> *On
> Behalf Of *Kent Fiala
> *Sent:* Tuesday, January 7, 2020 1:56 PM
> *To:* <carolinabirds...>
> *Subject:* [External] Re: Ebird checklists for CBC's getting flagged
>
>
>
> *CAUTION:* External email. Do not click links or open attachments unless
> you verify. Send all suspicious email as an attachment to
> <report.spam...>
>
>
>
> I'll admit to not having tried it, but theoretically you should be able to
> merge 200 separate checklists in my
> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.faintlake.com_eBird_compiler_&d=DwIFaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=Y1go2Ha7cbKIMowd_0LZZOksIItfUHok9CZ4dTFuE9c&s=UT-aWnZip48qGc5bZ82AtOzS7rAfrDgPVsL-UWAUvbw&e= > <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.faintlake.com_eBird_compiler_&d=DwMFaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=lyBt6BivQfulNyuAcpCb2Fsw4H4JWm9OoNvFRagXOBM&s=yBqZ6Nzk98NCKeJyj6nRBPtrkmrnjdbvs-zBbntGYcQ&e=> > tool. Let me know if there is a way that I could make it easier.
>
> Kent Fiala
>
> On 1/7/2020 1:52 PM, Christopher Hill (via carolinabirds Mailing List)
> wrote:
>
> Speaking as a compiler, I cannot really handle “proper” ebird lists, and I
> ask my counters ON THIS ONE DAY to make one list (or two, or three, but not
> 8 or 12) that makes my life easier. I have a great workflow for going from
> ebird lists to the spreadsheet where I compile all the results, but the
> count I compile has 20+ parties in the field, plus feeder watchers. If
> each of those parties were to submit 8 lists, that’s nearly two hundred
> separate lists for me to merge, which is not fun at all (right, Judi?).
> And many of the “territories” within our CBC circle have existed in their
> present form for decades. There is definitely value in going back to see
> what a normal day’s count was in your count sector 10, 20, 30 years ago, as
> contrasted with the atomized site by site nature of ebird records.
>
>
>
> There is just a conflict between doing an ideal eBird list and doing an
> ideal CBC list. Remember also that the CBC in its 120 years of history
> records time and distance data differently from ebird,* and there is value
> in consistency there, too. I don’t think you can expect a perfect
> solution. Well, if I were the boss of eBird I could invent a “Doing a
> Christmas Bird Count” protocol very much like the iPhone day summary people
> are talking about that would work for both CBC compilers and habitual
> ebirders, but I am pretty sure I am not the boss of ebird, so don’t hold
> your breath on that.
>
>
>
> Chris Hill
>
> Conway, SC
>
>
>
> *yes Wendy I got your email!
>
>
>
> On Jan 7, 2020, at 12:11 PM, Tom <carolinabirds...> wrote:
>
>
>
> I break my lists up and use the trip summary feature to enter the final
> numbers. The summary trip summary shows your species list and totals in one
> location, at least the IOS version does.
>
> Tom Ledford
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>
>
> On Jan 7, 2020, at 10:01 AM, Judi Sawyer (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <
> <carolinabirds...> wrote:
>
>
>
> Guy, I used to try to split it up by location but it was just too hard to
> compile at the end of the day. I could export each list to a spreadsheet
> but I still found myself making mistakes when combining the lists. With
> this last CBC for Elizabethton, Roan Mountain and the Grandfather Count I
> did mostly one list. Grandfather I split between Valle Crucis park and
> then the rest of our route. I just noted it as traveling and put a comment
> for which CBC it was. I know eBird doesn't like lists that are longer than
> 4 miles or so, but honestly, I found that it was too cumbersome to try to
> split them. Inevitably, someone would ask me during the count how many
> Eastern Bluebirds (or whatever) we had seen so far and I'd have to shuffle
> through 9 checklists to figure it out. I know combing them is not ideal,
> but they weren't flagged. I'd be interested to know if there are better
> ways to do it, or if it skews the data enough that it's better for
> scientific purposes to just not try to eBird them.
>
>
>
> Judi
>
>
>
> On Tue, Jan 7, 2020 at 9:33 AM <badgerboy...> wrote:
>
> Thanks Kent, yes I did read that and honestly it wasn't very helpful. It
> says to break up your day into multiple checklists, and of course that
> defeats the purpose. Didn't anyone else out there have any input on this?
> Wasn't anyone able to get ebird lists to work for CBC's and not be flagged?
> You can reply to my private email if your afraid of being targeted by the
> reviewers.
>
> Thanks, Guy
>
> On 1/3/2020 7:35 PM, Kent Fiala (via carolinabirds Mailing List) wrote:
>
> Have you read https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__ebird.org_news_ebirding-2Dyour-2Dcbc&d=DwIFaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=Y1go2Ha7cbKIMowd_0LZZOksIItfUHok9CZ4dTFuE9c&s=GQDaiHBE7a3H5ept_xX3bafiqIHmVD3Qk-x9pxlC42g&e= > <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__nam03.safelinks.protection.outlook.com_-3Furl-3Dhttps-253A-252F-252Furldefense.proofpoint.com-252Fv2-252Furl-253Fu-253Dhttps-2D3A-5F-5Febird.org-5Fnews-5Febirding-2D2Dyour-2D2Dcbc-2526d-253DDwMC-2Dg-2526c-253DimBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj-5FgZ4adc-2526r-253DymRCw6Q-2DsBitug-5FrdeO1Tokz-2DI-5FSX2LQN2-5FOcvlal9U-2526m-253DbwZ73bwDCC2-2DPg5mykelzZRbOysYU46usqSqJe2jqvM-2526s-253DmojV9FSEkVHLfRSaX2d4GOEPJoaakthYsCehidRjeVE-2526e-253D-26data-3D02-257C01-257Cchill-2540coastal.edu-257C3b7a7a82bcbf4319f05608d79394d1bc-257Cbf1f856b8ef84e52be9387d3c3622797-257C0-257C0-257C637140139708024794-26sdata-3D-252Fd6rVCNC3GL4Bo6-252FmF0pq44EAztuQoKTwzkSZwrD9nU-253D-26reserved-3D0&d=DwMGaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=-aV7NzFoooHChrWSEkXtfoT0_zkAbXvoG6DJ75iNOTE&s=B9uEn__Qp2s7eQM5zvbhgccqArR9HE_2sgxjyQNDdqo&e=> >
> Kent Fiala
>
> On 1/3/2020 7:29 PM, <badgerboy...> wrote:
>
> My CBC Ebird checklists are getting flagged so they do not appear in
> public outputs. The message I see on the checklist says:"*Protocol issue.**
> This checklist has been flagged because of an issue with the selected
> protocol. This checklist and its observations do not appear in public eBird
> outputs."*
>
> A few years ago I heard that it was OK to submit a CBC Ebird checklist as
> long as you used the "Incidental" protocol and used the following language
> in the description of the site:"XXXX CBC Sector 4--DATA" That is what I
> have done but now they are being hidden. And there is no way to know what
> the specific issue with the checklist is.
>
> I've gone through Ebird's guidelines to try and find what the problem
> might be, but can't find anything that should trigger this flag, which
> apparently is the reviewer's decision. Does anyone know how to make a CBC
> checklist acceptable for Ebird?
>
> Guy McGrane, Deep Gap, NC
>
>
>
>
Blayne and I are traveling to Mattamuskeet tomorrow to see the Tundra Swans and other waterfowl. Tundras will be a life bird for me.
I have studied the eBird posts for this area but have not yet found good information about when to see the swans flying in to roost. Is it possible to see that? Where to view? What time?
Any other suggestions would be appreciated. I have the info about Pungo roads and several ebird lists.
Date: 1/7/20 11:27 am From: Corey, Ed <ed.corey...> Subject: RE: [External] Re: Ebird checklists for CBC's getting flagged
I was able to compile 15 checklists rather easily using Kent’s link, but it would be nice to know what the upper limit for functionality would be.
Ed Corey
Inventory Biologist, NC Division of Parks and Recreation
NC Dept. of Natural and Cultural Resources
919 841 4037 Office
919 208 7864 Mobile
<Ed.Corey...><mailto:<Ed.Corey...>
12700 Bayleaf Church Road | Raleigh, North Carolina 27614
Email correspondence to and from this address is subject to the North Carolina Public Records Law and may be disclosed to third parties.
From: <carolinabirds-request...> <carolinabirds-request...> On Behalf Of Kent Fiala
Sent: Tuesday, January 7, 2020 1:56 PM
To: <carolinabirds...>
Subject: [External] Re: Ebird checklists for CBC's getting flagged
CAUTION: External email. Do not click links or open attachments unless you verify. Send all suspicious email as an attachment to <report.spam...><mailto:<report.spam...>
Kent Fiala
On 1/7/2020 1:52 PM, Christopher Hill (via carolinabirds Mailing List) wrote:
Speaking as a compiler, I cannot really handle “proper” ebird lists, and I ask my counters ON THIS ONE DAY to make one list (or two, or three, but not 8 or 12) that makes my life easier. I have a great workflow for going from ebird lists to the spreadsheet where I compile all the results, but the count I compile has 20+ parties in the field, plus feeder watchers. If each of those parties were to submit 8 lists, that’s nearly two hundred separate lists for me to merge, which is not fun at all (right, Judi?). And many of the “territories” within our CBC circle have existed in their present form for decades. There is definitely value in going back to see what a normal day’s count was in your count sector 10, 20, 30 years ago, as contrasted with the atomized site by site nature of ebird records.
There is just a conflict between doing an ideal eBird list and doing an ideal CBC list. Remember also that the CBC in its 120 years of history records time and distance data differently from ebird,* and there is value in consistency there, too. I don’t think you can expect a perfect solution. Well, if I were the boss of eBird I could invent a “Doing a Christmas Bird Count” protocol very much like the iPhone day summary people are talking about that would work for both CBC compilers and habitual ebirders, but I am pretty sure I am not the boss of ebird, so don’t hold your breath on that.
I break my lists up and use the trip summary feature to enter the final numbers. The summary trip summary shows your species list and totals in one location, at least the IOS version does.
Tom Ledford
Sent from my iPhone
On Jan 7, 2020, at 10:01 AM, Judi Sawyer (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...><mailto:<carolinabirds...>> wrote:
Guy, I used to try to split it up by location but it was just too hard to compile at the end of the day. I could export each list to a spreadsheet but I still found myself making mistakes when combining the lists. With this last CBC for Elizabethton, Roan Mountain and the Grandfather Count I did mostly one list. Grandfather I split between Valle Crucis park and then the rest of our route. I just noted it as traveling and put a comment for which CBC it was. I know eBird doesn't like lists that are longer than 4 miles or so, but honestly, I found that it was too cumbersome to try to split them. Inevitably, someone would ask me during the count how many Eastern Bluebirds (or whatever) we had seen so far and I'd have to shuffle through 9 checklists to figure it out. I know combing them is not ideal, but they weren't flagged. I'd be interested to know if there are better ways to do it, or if it skews the data enough that it's better for scientific purposes to just not try to eBird them.
Kent Fiala
On 1/3/2020 7:29 PM, <badgerboy...><mailto:<badgerboy...> wrote:
My CBC Ebird checklists are getting flagged so they do not appear in public outputs. The message I see on the checklist says:"Protocol issue. This checklist has been flagged because of an issue with the selected protocol. This checklist and its observations do not appear in public eBird outputs."
A few years ago I heard that it was OK to submit a CBC Ebird checklist as long as you used the "Incidental" protocol and used the following language in the description of the site:"XXXX CBC Sector 4--DATA" That is what I have done but now they are being hidden. And there is no way to know what the specific issue with the checklist is.
I've gone through Ebird's guidelines to try and find what the problem might be, but can't find anything that should trigger this flag, which apparently is the reviewer's decision. Does anyone know how to make a CBC checklist acceptable for Ebird?
Guy McGrane, Deep Gap, NC
Date: 1/7/20 11:21 am From: Judi Sawyer (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Re: Ebird checklists for CBC's getting flagged
I have always given the compiler one complete list. I'm thrilled to know
about eBird's compiling feature for multiple lists. That will solve my
problem. I would never dream of handing off 8-10 checklists to the
compiler to have to sort out.
Judi
On Tue, Jan 7, 2020 at 2:03 PM Paul Glass <pag...> wrote:
> I would think your participants would provide you with 1 list regardless
> of how many they submit to Ebird. That's what I do for the CBCs that I
> participate in. There's no reason that both sets of protocols can't be
> satisfied at the same time without overworking the compiler.
>
> Paul Glass
> South Boston, VA
>
> -----Original Message-----
> *From:* Christopher Hill [mailto:<carolinabirds...>]
> *Sent:* Tuesday, January 07, 2020 1:53 PM
> *To:* Tom
> *Cc:* Judi Sawyer; Guy McGrane; Carolinabirds
> *Subject:* Re: Ebird checklists for CBC's getting flagged
>
> Speaking as a compiler, I cannot really handle “proper” ebird lists, and I
> ask my counters ON THIS ONE DAY to make one list (or two, or three, but not
> 8 or 12) that makes my life easier. I have a great workflow for going from
> ebird lists to the spreadsheet where I compile all the results, but the
> count I compile has 20+ parties in the field, plus feeder watchers. If
> each of those parties were to submit 8 lists, that’s nearly two hundred
> separate lists for me to merge, which is not fun at all (right, Judi?).
> And many of the “territories” within our CBC circle have existed in their
> present form for decades. There is definitely value in going back to see
> what a normal day’s count was in your count sector 10, 20, 30 years ago, as
> contrasted with the atomized site by site nature of ebird records.
>
> There is just a conflict between doing an ideal eBird list and doing an
> ideal CBC list. Remember also that the CBC in its 120 years of history
> records time and distance data differently from ebird,* and there is value
> in consistency there, too. I don’t think you can expect a perfect
> solution. Well, if I were the boss of eBird I could invent a “Doing a
> Christmas Bird Count” protocol very much like the iPhone day summary people
> are talking about that would work for both CBC compilers and habitual
> ebirders, but I am pretty sure I am not the boss of ebird, so don’t hold
> your breath on that.
>
> Chris Hill
> Conway, SC
>
> *yes Wendy I got your email!
>
> On Jan 7, 2020, at 12:11 PM, Tom <carolinabirds...> wrote:
>
> I break my lists up and use the trip summary feature to enter the final
> numbers. The summary trip summary shows your species list and totals in one
> location, at least the IOS version does.
> Tom Ledford
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Jan 7, 2020, at 10:01 AM, Judi Sawyer (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <
> <carolinabirds...> wrote:
>
>
> Guy, I used to try to split it up by location but it was just too hard to
> compile at the end of the day. I could export each list to a spreadsheet
> but I still found myself making mistakes when combining the lists. With
> this last CBC for Elizabethton, Roan Mountain and the Grandfather Count I
> did mostly one list. Grandfather I split between Valle Crucis park and
> then the rest of our route. I just noted it as traveling and put a comment
> for which CBC it was. I know eBird doesn't like lists that are longer than
> 4 miles or so, but honestly, I found that it was too cumbersome to try to
> split them. Inevitably, someone would ask me during the count how many
> Eastern Bluebirds (or whatever) we had seen so far and I'd have to shuffle
> through 9 checklists to figure it out. I know combing them is not ideal,
> but they weren't flagged. I'd be interested to know if there are better
> ways to do it, or if it skews the data enough that it's better for
> scientific purposes to just not try to eBird them.
>
> Judi
>
> On Tue, Jan 7, 2020 at 9:33 AM <badgerboy...> wrote:
>
>> Thanks Kent, yes I did read that and honestly it wasn't very helpful. It
>> says to break up your day into multiple checklists, and of course that
>> defeats the purpose. Didn't anyone else out there have any input on this?
>> Wasn't anyone able to get ebird lists to work for CBC's and not be flagged?
>> You can reply to my private email if your afraid of being targeted by the
>> reviewers.
>>
>> Thanks, Guy
>> On 1/3/2020 7:35 PM, Kent Fiala (via carolinabirds Mailing List) wrote:
>>
>> Have you read https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__ebird.org_news_ebirding-2Dyour-2Dcbc&d=DwIFaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=oen2AFY3BYlKptJ-efwg1yA1aiDZ1GmpgaSFsGFqT9E&s=Hz1YaLFj3d9Acdo-FWp4PviOqFz31st_ImpDbCrTvrc&e= >> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__nam03.safelinks.protection.outlook.com_-3Furl-3Dhttps-253A-252F-252Furldefense.proofpoint.com-252Fv2-252Furl-253Fu-253Dhttps-2D3A-5F-5Febird.org-5Fnews-5Febirding-2D2Dyour-2D2Dcbc-2526d-253DDwMC-2Dg-2526c-253DimBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj-5FgZ4adc-2526r-253DymRCw6Q-2DsBitug-5FrdeO1Tokz-2DI-5FSX2LQN2-5FOcvlal9U-2526m-253DbwZ73bwDCC2-2DPg5mykelzZRbOysYU46usqSqJe2jqvM-2526s-253DmojV9FSEkVHLfRSaX2d4GOEPJoaakthYsCehidRjeVE-2526e-253D-26data-3D02-257C01-257Cchill-2540coastal.edu-257C3b7a7a82bcbf4319f05608d79394d1bc-257Cbf1f856b8ef84e52be9387d3c3622797-257C0-257C0-257C637140139708024794-26sdata-3D-252Fd6rVCNC3GL4Bo6-252FmF0pq44EAztuQoKTwzkSZwrD9nU-253D-26reserved-3D0&d=DwMGaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=-aV7NzFoooHChrWSEkXtfoT0_zkAbXvoG6DJ75iNOTE&s=B9uEn__Qp2s7eQM5zvbhgccqArR9HE_2sgxjyQNDdqo&e=> >>
>> Kent Fiala
>>
>> On 1/3/2020 7:29 PM, <badgerboy...> wrote:
>>
>> My CBC Ebird checklists are getting flagged so they do not appear in
>> public outputs. The message I see on the checklist says:"*Protocol
>> issue. This checklist has been flagged because of an issue with the
>> selected protocol. This checklist and its observations do not appear in
>> public eBird outputs."*
>>
>> A few years ago I heard that it was OK to submit a CBC Ebird checklist as
>> long as you used the "Incidental" protocol and used the following language
>> in the description of the site:"XXXX CBC Sector 4--DATA" That is what I
>> have done but now they are being hidden. And there is no way to know what
>> the specific issue with the checklist is.
>>
>> I've gone through Ebird's guidelines to try and find what the problem
>> might be, but can't find anything that should trigger this flag, which
>> apparently is the reviewer's decision. Does anyone know how to make a CBC
>> checklist acceptable for Ebird?
>>
>> Guy McGrane, Deep Gap, NC
>>
>>
>
Date: 1/7/20 11:03 am From: Paul Glass <pag...> Subject: RE: Ebird checklists for CBC's getting flagged
I would think your participants would provide you with 1 list regardless of
how many they submit to Ebird. That's what I do for the CBCs that I
participate in. There's no reason that both sets of protocols can't be
satisfied at the same time without overworking the compiler.
Paul Glass
South Boston, VA
-----Original Message-----
From: Christopher Hill [mailto:<carolinabirds...>]
Sent: Tuesday, January 07, 2020 1:53 PM
To: Tom
Cc: Judi Sawyer; Guy McGrane; Carolinabirds
Subject: Re: Ebird checklists for CBC's getting flagged
Speaking as a compiler, I cannot really handle “proper” ebird lists, and I
ask my counters ON THIS ONE DAY to make one list (or two, or three, but not
8 or 12) that makes my life easier. I have a great workflow for going from
ebird lists to the spreadsheet where I compile all the results, but the
count I compile has 20+ parties in the field, plus feeder watchers. If each
of those parties were to submit 8 lists, that’s nearly two hundred separate
lists for me to merge, which is not fun at all (right, Judi?). And many of
the “territories” within our CBC circle have existed in their present form
for decades. There is definitely value in going back to see what a normal
day’s count was in your count sector 10, 20, 30 years ago, as contrasted
with the atomized site by site nature of ebird records.
There is just a conflict between doing an ideal eBird list and doing an
ideal CBC list. Remember also that the CBC in its 120 years of history
records time and distance data differently from ebird,* and there is value
in consistency there, too. I don’t think you can expect a perfect solution.
Well, if I were the boss of eBird I could invent a “Doing a Christmas Bird
Count” protocol very much like the iPhone day summary people are talking
about that would work for both CBC compilers and habitual ebirders, but I am
pretty sure I am not the boss of ebird, so don’t hold your breath on that.
I break my lists up and use the trip summary feature to enter the final
numbers. The summary trip summary shows your species list and totals in one
location, at least the IOS version does.
Tom Ledford
Sent from my iPhone
On Jan 7, 2020, at 10:01 AM, Judi Sawyer (via carolinabirds Mailing List)
<carolinabirds...> <mailto:<carolinabirds...> > wrote:
Guy, I used to try to split it up by location but it was just too hard to
compile at the end of the day. I could export each list to a spreadsheet but
I still found myself making mistakes when combining the lists. With this
last CBC for Elizabethton, Roan Mountain and the Grandfather Count I did
mostly one list. Grandfather I split between Valle Crucis park and then the
rest of our route. I just noted it as traveling and put a comment for which
CBC it was. I know eBird doesn't like lists that are longer than 4 miles or
so, but honestly, I found that it was too cumbersome to try to split them.
Inevitably, someone would ask me during the count how many Eastern Bluebirds
(or whatever) we had seen so far and I'd have to shuffle through 9
checklists to figure it out. I know combing them is not ideal, but they
weren't flagged. I'd be interested to know if there are better ways to do
it, or if it skews the data enough that it's better for scientific purposes
to just not try to eBird them.
Thanks Kent, yes I did read that and honestly it wasn't very helpful. It
says to break up your day into multiple checklists, and of course that
defeats the purpose. Didn't anyone else out there have any input on this?
Wasn't anyone able to get ebird lists to work for CBC's and not be flagged?
You can reply to my private email if your afraid of being targeted by the
reviewers.
Thanks, Guy
On 1/3/2020 7:35 PM, Kent Fiala (via carolinabirds Mailing List) wrote:
My CBC Ebird checklists are getting flagged so they do not appear in public
outputs. The message I see on the checklist says:"Protocol issue. This
checklist has been flagged because of an issue with the selected protocol.
This checklist and its observations do not appear in public eBird outputs."
A few years ago I heard that it was OK to submit a CBC Ebird checklist as
long as you used the "Incidental" protocol and used the following language
in the description of the site:"XXXX CBC Sector 4--DATA" That is what I have
done but now they are being hidden. And there is no way to know what the
specific issue with the checklist is.
I've gone through Ebird's guidelines to try and find what the problem might
be, but can't find anything that should trigger this flag, which apparently
is the reviewer's decision. Does anyone know how to make a CBC checklist
acceptable for Ebird?
On 1/7/2020 1:52 PM, Christopher Hill (via carolinabirds Mailing List) wrote:
> Speaking as a compiler, I cannot really handle “proper” ebird lists, and I ask my counters ON THIS ONE DAY to make one list (or two, or three, but not 8 or 12) that makes my life easier. I have a great workflow for going from ebird lists to the spreadsheet where I compile all the results, but the count I compile has 20+ parties in the field, plus feeder watchers. If each of those parties were to submit 8 lists, that’s nearly two hundred separate lists for me to merge, which is not fun at all (right, Judi?). And many of the “territories” within our CBC circle have existed in their present form for decades. There is definitely value in going back to see what a normal day’s count was in your count sector 10, 20, 30 years ago, as contrasted with the atomized site by site nature of ebird records.
>
> There is just a conflict between doing an ideal eBird list and doing an ideal CBC list. Remember also that the CBC in its 120 years of history records time and distance data differently from ebird,* and there is value in consistency there, too. I don’t think you can expect a perfect solution. Well, if I were the boss of eBird I could invent a “Doing a Christmas Bird Count” protocol very much like the iPhone day summary people are talking about that would work for both CBC compilers and habitual ebirders, but I am pretty sure I am not the boss of ebird, so don’t hold your breath on that.
>
> Chris Hill
> Conway, SC
>
> *yes Wendy I got your email!
>
>> On Jan 7, 2020, at 12:11 PM, Tom <carolinabirds...> <mailto:<carolinabirds...>> wrote:
>>
>> I break my lists up and use the trip summary feature to enter the final numbers. The summary trip summary shows your species list and totals in one location, at least the IOS version does.
>> Tom Ledford
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>>> On Jan 7, 2020, at 10:01 AM, Judi Sawyer (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> <mailto:<carolinabirds...>> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> Guy, I used to try to split it up by location but it was just too hard to compile at the end of the day. I could export each list to a spreadsheet but I still found myself making mistakes when combining the lists. With this last CBC for Elizabethton, Roan Mountain and the Grandfather Count I did mostly one list. Grandfather I split between Valle Crucis park and then the rest of our route. I just noted it as traveling and put a comment for which CBC it was. I know eBird doesn't like lists that are longer than 4 miles or so, but honestly, I found that it was too cumbersome to try to split them. Inevitably, someone would ask me during the count how many Eastern Bluebirds (or whatever) we had seen so far and I'd have to shuffle through 9 checklists to figure it out. I know combing them is not ideal, but they weren't flagged. I'd be interested to know if there are better ways to do it, or if it skews the data enough that it's better for scientific purposes to just not
>>> try to eBird them.
>>>
>>> Judi
>>>
>>> On Tue, Jan 7, 2020 at 9:33 AM <badgerboy...> <mailto:<badgerboy...>> wrote:
>>>
>>> Thanks Kent, yes I did read that and honestly it wasn't very helpful. It says to break up your day into multiple checklists, and of course that defeats the purpose. Didn't anyone else out there have any input on this? Wasn't anyone able to get ebird lists to work for CBC's and not be flagged? You can reply to my private email if your afraid of being targeted by the reviewers.
>>>
>>> Thanks, Guy
>>>
>>> On 1/3/2020 7:35 PM, Kent Fiala (via carolinabirds Mailing List) wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Have you read https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__ebird.org_news_ebirding-2Dyour-2Dcbc&d=DwIFaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=lyBt6BivQfulNyuAcpCb2Fsw4H4JWm9OoNvFRagXOBM&s=wuXym2DUKqw2acT8I_EdefLpUjv52P_SxIEg4Psx6dY&e= <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__nam03.safelinks.protection.outlook.com_-3Furl-3Dhttps-253A-252F-252Furldefense.proofpoint.com-252Fv2-252Furl-253Fu-253Dhttps-2D3A-5F-5Febird.org-5Fnews-5Febirding-2D2Dyour-2D2Dcbc-2526d-253DDwMC-2Dg-2526c-253DimBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj-5FgZ4adc-2526r-253DymRCw6Q-2DsBitug-5FrdeO1Tokz-2DI-5FSX2LQN2-5FOcvlal9U-2526m-253DbwZ73bwDCC2-2DPg5mykelzZRbOysYU46usqSqJe2jqvM-2526s-253DmojV9FSEkVHLfRSaX2d4GOEPJoaakthYsCehidRjeVE-2526e-253D-26data-3D02-257C01-257Cchill-2540coastal.edu-257C3b7a7a82bcbf4319f05608d79394d1bc-257Cbf1f856b8ef84e52be9387d3c3622797-257C0-257C0-257C637140139708024794-26sdata-3D-252Fd6rVCNC3GL4Bo6-252FmF0pq44EAztuQoKTwzkSZwrD9nU-253D-26reserved-3D0&d=DwMGaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=-aV7NzFoooHChrWSEkXtfoT0_zkAbXvoG6DJ75iNOTE&s=B9uEn__Qp2s7eQM5zvbhgccqArR9HE_2sgxjyQNDdqo&e=> >>>>
>>>> Kent Fiala
>>>> On 1/3/2020 7:29 PM, <badgerboy...> <mailto:<badgerboy...> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> My CBC Ebird checklists are getting flagged so they do not appear in public outputs. The message I see on the checklist says:"/*Protocol issue.* This checklist has been flagged because of an issue with the selected protocol. This checklist and its observations do not appear in public eBird outputs."/
>>>>>
>>>>> A few years ago I heard that it was OK to submit a CBC Ebird checklist as long as you used the "Incidental" protocol and used the following language in the description of the site:"XXXX CBC Sector 4--DATA" That is what I have done but now they are being hidden. And there is no way to know what the specific issue with the checklist is.
>>>>>
>>>>> I've gone through Ebird's guidelines to try and find what the problem might be, but can't find anything that should trigger this flag, which apparently is the reviewer's decision. Does anyone know how to make a CBC checklist acceptable for Ebird?
>>>>>
>>>>> Guy McGrane, Deep Gap, NC
>>>>>
>
Date: 1/7/20 10:53 am From: Christopher Hill (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Re: Ebird checklists for CBC's getting flagged
Speaking as a compiler, I cannot really handle “proper” ebird lists, and I ask my counters ON THIS ONE DAY to make one list (or two, or three, but not 8 or 12) that makes my life easier. I have a great workflow for going from ebird lists to the spreadsheet where I compile all the results, but the count I compile has 20+ parties in the field, plus feeder watchers. If each of those parties were to submit 8 lists, that’s nearly two hundred separate lists for me to merge, which is not fun at all (right, Judi?). And many of the “territories” within our CBC circle have existed in their present form for decades. There is definitely value in going back to see what a normal day’s count was in your count sector 10, 20, 30 years ago, as contrasted with the atomized site by site nature of ebird records.
There is just a conflict between doing an ideal eBird list and doing an ideal CBC list. Remember also that the CBC in its 120 years of history records time and distance data differently from ebird,* and there is value in consistency there, too. I don’t think you can expect a perfect solution. Well, if I were the boss of eBird I could invent a “Doing a Christmas Bird Count” protocol very much like the iPhone day summary people are talking about that would work for both CBC compilers and habitual ebirders, but I am pretty sure I am not the boss of ebird, so don’t hold your breath on that.
I break my lists up and use the trip summary feature to enter the final numbers. The summary trip summary shows your species list and totals in one location, at least the IOS version does.
Tom Ledford
Sent from my iPhone
On Jan 7, 2020, at 10:01 AM, Judi Sawyer (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...><mailto:<carolinabirds...>> wrote:
Guy, I used to try to split it up by location but it was just too hard to compile at the end of the day. I could export each list to a spreadsheet but I still found myself making mistakes when combining the lists. With this last CBC for Elizabethton, Roan Mountain and the Grandfather Count I did mostly one list. Grandfather I split between Valle Crucis park and then the rest of our route. I just noted it as traveling and put a comment for which CBC it was. I know eBird doesn't like lists that are longer than 4 miles or so, but honestly, I found that it was too cumbersome to try to split them. Inevitably, someone would ask me during the count how many Eastern Bluebirds (or whatever) we had seen so far and I'd have to shuffle through 9 checklists to figure it out. I know combing them is not ideal, but they weren't flagged. I'd be interested to know if there are better ways to do it, or if it skews the data enough that it's better for scientific purposes to just not try to eBird them.
Thanks Kent, yes I did read that and honestly it wasn't very helpful. It says to break up your day into multiple checklists, and of course that defeats the purpose. Didn't anyone else out there have any input on this? Wasn't anyone able to get ebird lists to work for CBC's and not be flagged? You can reply to my private email if your afraid of being targeted by the reviewers.
Thanks, Guy
On 1/3/2020 7:35 PM, Kent Fiala (via carolinabirds Mailing List) wrote:
My CBC Ebird checklists are getting flagged so they do not appear in public outputs. The message I see on the checklist says:"Protocol issue. This checklist has been flagged because of an issue with the selected protocol. This checklist and its observations do not appear in public eBird outputs."
A few years ago I heard that it was OK to submit a CBC Ebird checklist as long as you used the "Incidental" protocol and used the following language in the description of the site:"XXXX CBC Sector 4--DATA" That is what I have done but now they are being hidden. And there is no way to know what the specific issue with the checklist is.
I've gone through Ebird's guidelines to try and find what the problem might be, but can't find anything that should trigger this flag, which apparently is the reviewer's decision. Does anyone know how to make a CBC checklist acceptable for Ebird?
Date: 1/7/20 9:12 am From: Tom (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Re: Ebird checklists for CBC's getting flagged
I break my lists up and use the trip summary feature to enter the final numbers. The summary trip summary shows your species list and totals in one location, at least the IOS version does.
Tom Ledford
Sent from my iPhone
> On Jan 7, 2020, at 10:01 AM, Judi Sawyer (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> wrote:
>
>
> Guy, I used to try to split it up by location but it was just too hard to compile at the end of the day. I could export each list to a spreadsheet but I still found myself making mistakes when combining the lists. With this last CBC for Elizabethton, Roan Mountain and the Grandfather Count I did mostly one list. Grandfather I split between Valle Crucis park and then the rest of our route. I just noted it as traveling and put a comment for which CBC it was. I know eBird doesn't like lists that are longer than 4 miles or so, but honestly, I found that it was too cumbersome to try to split them. Inevitably, someone would ask me during the count how many Eastern Bluebirds (or whatever) we had seen so far and I'd have to shuffle through 9 checklists to figure it out. I know combing them is not ideal, but they weren't flagged. I'd be interested to know if there are better ways to do it, or if it skews the data enough that it's better for scientific purposes to just not try to eBird them.
>
> Judi
>
>> On Tue, Jan 7, 2020 at 9:33 AM <badgerboy...> wrote:
>> Thanks Kent, yes I did read that and honestly it wasn't very helpful. It says to break up your day into multiple checklists, and of course that defeats the purpose. Didn't anyone else out there have any input on this? Wasn't anyone able to get ebird lists to work for CBC's and not be flagged? You can reply to my private email if your afraid of being targeted by the reviewers.
>>
>> Thanks, Guy
>>
>> On 1/3/2020 7:35 PM, Kent Fiala (via carolinabirds Mailing List) wrote:
>>> Have you read https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__ebird.org_news_ebirding-2Dyour-2Dcbc&d=DwIFaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=wyxs_MXXAvGUK_ZKTV-v6rc5qYBnNycXYPnXMraMMgU&s=g0hE_DWhYVVwXbliGL7ZkdrE20M9b3tZ1ZuIZlU1zCg&e= >>>
>>> Kent Fiala
>>> On 1/3/2020 7:29 PM, <badgerboy...> wrote:
>>>> My CBC Ebird checklists are getting flagged so they do not appear in public outputs. The message I see on the checklist says:"Protocol issue. This checklist has been flagged because of an issue with the selected protocol. This checklist and its observations do not appear in public eBird outputs."
>>>>
>>>> A few years ago I heard that it was OK to submit a CBC Ebird checklist as long as you used the "Incidental" protocol and used the following language in the description of the site:"XXXX CBC Sector 4--DATA" That is what I have done but now they are being hidden. And there is no way to know what the specific issue with the checklist is.
>>>>
>>>> I've gone through Ebird's guidelines to try and find what the problem might be, but can't find anything that should trigger this flag, which apparently is the reviewer's decision. Does anyone know how to make a CBC checklist acceptable for Ebird?
>>>>
>>>> Guy McGrane, Deep Gap, NC
Date: 1/7/20 8:57 am From: Kent Fiala (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Re: Ebird checklists for CBC's getting flagged
Sadly, the Trip Summary feature is only on iPhone, not Android. eBird central inexplicably refuses to provide that feature for Android users.
Kent Fiala
On 1/7/2020 11:48 AM, Stacy and Natalie Barbour (via carolinabirds Mailing List) wrote:
> Using the’Trips’ feature in eBird mobile one can quickly see a summary compilation of multiple individual checklists over any specified time period, including just one day.
>
> In other words, the trip summary for one day might include dozens of checklists adhering to eBird protocols. The summary shows totals of all species observed.
>
> The trip summary also can be emailed if desired. It’s a neat feature.
>
> Maybe this would be useful for a CBC.
>
> Stacy Barbour
> Raleigh
>
>> On Jan 7, 2020, at 10:00 AM, Judi Sawyer (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> wrote:
>>
>>
>> Guy, I used to try to split it up by location but it was just too hard to compile at the end of the day. I could export each list to a spreadsheet but I still found myself making mistakes when combining the lists. With this last CBC for Elizabethton, Roan Mountain and the Grandfather Count I did mostly one list. Grandfather I split between Valle Crucis park and then the rest of our route. I just noted it as traveling and put a comment for which CBC it was. I know eBird doesn't like lists that are longer than 4 miles or so, but honestly, I found that it was too cumbersome to try to split them. Inevitably, someone would ask me during the count how many Eastern Bluebirds (or whatever) we had seen so far and I'd have to shuffle through 9 checklists to figure it out. I know combing them is not ideal, but they weren't flagged. I'd be interested to know if there are better ways to do it, or if it skews the data enough that it's better for scientific purposes to just not
>> try to eBird them.
>>
>> Judi
>>
>> On Tue, Jan 7, 2020 at 9:33 AM <badgerboy...> <mailto:<badgerboy...>> wrote:
>>
>> Thanks Kent, yes I did read that and honestly it wasn't very helpful. It says to break up your day into multiple checklists, and of course that defeats the purpose. Didn't anyone else out there have any input on this? Wasn't anyone able to get ebird lists to work for CBC's and not be flagged? You can reply to my private email if your afraid of being targeted by the reviewers.
>>
>> Thanks, Guy
>>
>> On 1/3/2020 7:35 PM, Kent Fiala (via carolinabirds Mailing List) wrote:
>>>
>>> Have you read https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__ebird.org_news_ebirding-2Dyour-2Dcbc&d=DwIFaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=HT4iiDf2va3BXieVJ5e4munPb1gfQIUmEizBvJi3d0A&s=2qiXVBaTy9IfMbpz9pAHYY6K0u7BdjFMxAe4PtlYG1w&e= <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__ebird.org_news_ebirding-2Dyour-2Dcbc&d=DwMC-g&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=bwZ73bwDCC2-Pg5mykelzZRbOysYU46usqSqJe2jqvM&s=mojV9FSEkVHLfRSaX2d4GOEPJoaakthYsCehidRjeVE&e=> >>>
>>> Kent Fiala
>>> On 1/3/2020 7:29 PM, <badgerboy...> <mailto:<badgerboy...> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> My CBC Ebird checklists are getting flagged so they do not appear in public outputs. The message I see on the checklist says:"/*Protocol issue.* This checklist has been flagged because of an issue with the selected protocol. This checklist and its observations do not appear in public eBird outputs."/
>>>>
>>>> A few years ago I heard that it was OK to submit a CBC Ebird checklist as long as you used the "Incidental" protocol and used the following language in the description of the site:"XXXX CBC Sector 4--DATA" That is what I have done but now they are being hidden. And there is no way to know what the specific issue with the checklist is.
>>>>
>>>> I've gone through Ebird's guidelines to try and find what the problem might be, but can't find anything that should trigger this flag, which apparently is the reviewer's decision. Does anyone know how to make a CBC checklist acceptable for Ebird?
>>>>
>>>> Guy McGrane, Deep Gap, NC
>>>>
Date: 1/7/20 8:57 am From: Judi Sawyer (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Re: Ebird checklists for CBC's getting flagged
Thanks Stacy... as best I can tell that's only available right now for
iPhone. I have an android, but I can still compile them the way that Kent
mentioned now that I know that exists. Hopefully, that feature will be in
a future android update.
Good birding,
Judi
On Tue, Jan 7, 2020 at 11:48 AM Stacy and Natalie Barbour <
<2ncbirders...> wrote:
> Using the’Trips’ feature in eBird mobile one can quickly see a summary
> compilation of multiple individual checklists over any specified time
> period, including just one day.
>
> In other words, the trip summary for one day might include dozens of
> checklists adhering to eBird protocols. The summary shows totals of all
> species observed.
>
> The trip summary also can be emailed if desired. It’s a neat feature.
>
> Maybe this would be useful for a CBC.
>
> Stacy Barbour
> Raleigh
>
> On Jan 7, 2020, at 10:00 AM, Judi Sawyer (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <
> <carolinabirds...> wrote:
>
>
> Guy, I used to try to split it up by location but it was just too hard to
> compile at the end of the day. I could export each list to a spreadsheet
> but I still found myself making mistakes when combining the lists. With
> this last CBC for Elizabethton, Roan Mountain and the Grandfather Count I
> did mostly one list. Grandfather I split between Valle Crucis park and
> then the rest of our route. I just noted it as traveling and put a comment
> for which CBC it was. I know eBird doesn't like lists that are longer than
> 4 miles or so, but honestly, I found that it was too cumbersome to try to
> split them. Inevitably, someone would ask me during the count how many
> Eastern Bluebirds (or whatever) we had seen so far and I'd have to shuffle
> through 9 checklists to figure it out. I know combing them is not ideal,
> but they weren't flagged. I'd be interested to know if there are better
> ways to do it, or if it skews the data enough that it's better for
> scientific purposes to just not try to eBird them.
>
> Judi
>
> On Tue, Jan 7, 2020 at 9:33 AM <badgerboy...> wrote:
>
>> Thanks Kent, yes I did read that and honestly it wasn't very helpful. It
>> says to break up your day into multiple checklists, and of course that
>> defeats the purpose. Didn't anyone else out there have any input on this?
>> Wasn't anyone able to get ebird lists to work for CBC's and not be flagged?
>> You can reply to my private email if your afraid of being targeted by the
>> reviewers.
>>
>> Thanks, Guy
>> On 1/3/2020 7:35 PM, Kent Fiala (via carolinabirds Mailing List) wrote:
>>
>> Have you read https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__ebird.org_news_ebirding-2Dyour-2Dcbc&d=DwIFaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=DJYOXRA4ZUXJ54cZdAVn90KnMVdEo1SORf1e-ywg_fc&s=iSVfDIJYdMFJrS8Dn3ex4Kp_GJzizOXfv3sBau8635Y&e= >> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__ebird.org_news_ebirding-2Dyour-2Dcbc&d=DwMC-g&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=bwZ73bwDCC2-Pg5mykelzZRbOysYU46usqSqJe2jqvM&s=mojV9FSEkVHLfRSaX2d4GOEPJoaakthYsCehidRjeVE&e=> >>
>> Kent Fiala
>>
>> On 1/3/2020 7:29 PM, <badgerboy...> wrote:
>>
>> My CBC Ebird checklists are getting flagged so they do not appear in
>> public outputs. The message I see on the checklist says:"*Protocol
>> issue. This checklist has been flagged because of an issue with the
>> selected protocol. This checklist and its observations do not appear in
>> public eBird outputs."*
>>
>> A few years ago I heard that it was OK to submit a CBC Ebird checklist as
>> long as you used the "Incidental" protocol and used the following language
>> in the description of the site:"XXXX CBC Sector 4--DATA" That is what I
>> have done but now they are being hidden. And there is no way to know what
>> the specific issue with the checklist is.
>>
>> I've gone through Ebird's guidelines to try and find what the problem
>> might be, but can't find anything that should trigger this flag, which
>> apparently is the reviewer's decision. Does anyone know how to make a CBC
>> checklist acceptable for Ebird?
>>
>> Guy McGrane, Deep Gap, NC
>>
>>
Date: 1/7/20 8:48 am From: Stacy and Natalie Barbour (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Re: Ebird checklists for CBC's getting flagged
Using the’Trips’ feature in eBird mobile one can quickly see a summary compilation of multiple individual checklists over any specified time period, including just one day.
In other words, the trip summary for one day might include dozens of checklists adhering to eBird protocols. The summary shows totals of all species observed.
The trip summary also can be emailed if desired. It’s a neat feature.
Maybe this would be useful for a CBC.
Stacy Barbour
Raleigh
> On Jan 7, 2020, at 10:00 AM, Judi Sawyer (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> wrote:
>
>
> Guy, I used to try to split it up by location but it was just too hard to compile at the end of the day. I could export each list to a spreadsheet but I still found myself making mistakes when combining the lists. With this last CBC for Elizabethton, Roan Mountain and the Grandfather Count I did mostly one list. Grandfather I split between Valle Crucis park and then the rest of our route. I just noted it as traveling and put a comment for which CBC it was. I know eBird doesn't like lists that are longer than 4 miles or so, but honestly, I found that it was too cumbersome to try to split them. Inevitably, someone would ask me during the count how many Eastern Bluebirds (or whatever) we had seen so far and I'd have to shuffle through 9 checklists to figure it out. I know combing them is not ideal, but they weren't flagged. I'd be interested to know if there are better ways to do it, or if it skews the data enough that it's better for scientific purposes to just not try to eBird them.
>
> Judi
>
>> On Tue, Jan 7, 2020 at 9:33 AM <badgerboy...> wrote:
>> Thanks Kent, yes I did read that and honestly it wasn't very helpful. It says to break up your day into multiple checklists, and of course that defeats the purpose. Didn't anyone else out there have any input on this? Wasn't anyone able to get ebird lists to work for CBC's and not be flagged? You can reply to my private email if your afraid of being targeted by the reviewers.
>>
>> Thanks, Guy
>>
>> On 1/3/2020 7:35 PM, Kent Fiala (via carolinabirds Mailing List) wrote:
>>> Have you read https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__ebird.org_news_ebirding-2Dyour-2Dcbc&d=DwIFaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=zJWXXfSIIzP47_ectPO-gXhEYbIkbvCtieRN8k38HGU&s=aCjQoXLncrmj9vsaqbwiuXSa2qk07f5MdPQ_B3JZMK0&e= >>>
>>> Kent Fiala
>>> On 1/3/2020 7:29 PM, <badgerboy...> wrote:
>>>> My CBC Ebird checklists are getting flagged so they do not appear in public outputs. The message I see on the checklist says:"Protocol issue. This checklist has been flagged because of an issue with the selected protocol. This checklist and its observations do not appear in public eBird outputs."
>>>>
>>>> A few years ago I heard that it was OK to submit a CBC Ebird checklist as long as you used the "Incidental" protocol and used the following language in the description of the site:"XXXX CBC Sector 4--DATA" That is what I have done but now they are being hidden. And there is no way to know what the specific issue with the checklist is.
>>>>
>>>> I've gone through Ebird's guidelines to try and find what the problem might be, but can't find anything that should trigger this flag, which apparently is the reviewer's decision. Does anyone know how to make a CBC checklist acceptable for Ebird?
>>>>
>>>> Guy McGrane, Deep Gap, NC
Date: 1/7/20 7:42 am From: Judi Sawyer (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Re: Ebird checklists for CBC's getting flagged
Thanks Dwayne,
I've never felt targeted by an eBird reviewer anywhere; educated yes; targeted no. Now that I know about the method of compiling multiple lists into one checklist I'll be back to doing multiple checklists next time I'm on a count!
Judi
On Tue, Jan 7, 2020 at 10:25 AM Dwayne Martin <carolinabirds...> wrote:
Date: 1/7/20 7:25 am From: Dwayne Martin (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Re: Ebird checklists for CBC's getting flagged
First of all, reviewers are not out to "target" anyone. We are simply going by what eBird central tells us how to handle things. Reviewers are not the "bad guys". Your list was reported as "Incidental". According to eBird protocol, that means birding was not your primary activity. I would think doing a CBC, birding is most certainly your primary activity. Yes, eBird would would like list to be under 5 miles and no more that a few hours. We do give some lee way with that, within reason.
Dwayne ************* J. Dwayne Martin Hickory, NC <redxbill...>
Date: 1/7/20 7:16 am From: Judi Sawyer (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Re: Ebird checklists for CBC's getting flagged
That's awesome! Thanks Kent. I really hated doing one long list this year. I used to download them, combine them into one spreadsheet, sort alphabetically, combine the numbers and then try to get them back in Taxonomic order. That was a nightmare. This is great!
Judi
On Tue, Jan 7, 2020 at 10:05 AM Kent Fiala <carolinabirds...> wrote:
On 1/7/2020 9:59 AM, Judi Sawyer (via carolinabirds Mailing List) wrote:
> Guy, I used to try to split it up by location but it was just too hard to compile at the end of the day. I could export each list to a spreadsheet but I still found myself making mistakes when combining the lists. With this last CBC for Elizabethton, Roan Mountain and the Grandfather Count I did mostly one list. Grandfather I split between Valle Crucis park and then the rest of our route. I just noted it as traveling and put a comment for which CBC it was. I know eBird doesn't like lists that are longer than 4 miles or so, but honestly, I found that it was too cumbersome to try to split them. Inevitably, someone would ask me during the count how many Eastern Bluebirds (or whatever) we had seen so far and I'd have to shuffle through 9 checklists to figure it out. I know combing them is not ideal, but they weren't flagged. I'd be interested to know if there are better ways to do it, or if it skews the data enough that it's better for scientific purposes to just not
> try to eBird them.
>
> Judi
>
> On Tue, Jan 7, 2020 at 9:33 AM <badgerboy...> <mailto:<badgerboy...>> wrote:
>
> Thanks Kent, yes I did read that and honestly it wasn't very helpful. It says to break up your day into multiple checklists, and of course that defeats the purpose. Didn't anyone else out there have any input on this? Wasn't anyone able to get ebird lists to work for CBC's and not be flagged? You can reply to my private email if your afraid of being targeted by the reviewers.
>
> Thanks, Guy
>
> On 1/3/2020 7:35 PM, Kent Fiala (via carolinabirds Mailing List) wrote:
>>
>> Have you read https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__ebird.org_news_ebirding-2Dyour-2Dcbc&d=DwIFaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=JFIbOBMqBn1kgXV15-vJEf4UaiV-i83g6hN1D_Y58jQ&s=xRf7PSBicAYEEgdYRSVvQ-2uRfbbom3P3TUbboNqz4M&e= <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__ebird.org_news_ebirding-2Dyour-2Dcbc&d=DwMC-g&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=bwZ73bwDCC2-Pg5mykelzZRbOysYU46usqSqJe2jqvM&s=mojV9FSEkVHLfRSaX2d4GOEPJoaakthYsCehidRjeVE&e=> >>
>> Kent Fiala
>> On 1/3/2020 7:29 PM, <badgerboy...> <mailto:<badgerboy...> wrote:
>>>
>>> My CBC Ebird checklists are getting flagged so they do not appear in public outputs. The message I see on the checklist says:"/*Protocol issue.* This checklist has been flagged because of an issue with the selected protocol. This checklist and its observations do not appear in public eBird outputs."/
>>>
>>> A few years ago I heard that it was OK to submit a CBC Ebird checklist as long as you used the "Incidental" protocol and used the following language in the description of the site:"XXXX CBC Sector 4--DATA" That is what I have done but now they are being hidden. And there is no way to know what the specific issue with the checklist is.
>>>
>>> I've gone through Ebird's guidelines to try and find what the problem might be, but can't find anything that should trigger this flag, which apparently is the reviewer's decision. Does anyone know how to make a CBC checklist acceptable for Ebird?
>>>
>>> Guy McGrane, Deep Gap, NC
>>>
Date: 1/7/20 7:01 am From: Judi Sawyer (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Re: Ebird checklists for CBC's getting flagged
Guy, I used to try to split it up by location but it was just too hard to compile at the end of the day. I could export each list to a spreadsheet but I still found myself making mistakes when combining the lists. With this last CBC for Elizabethton, Roan Mountain and the Grandfather Count I did mostly one list. Grandfather I split between Valle Crucis park and then the rest of our route. I just noted it as traveling and put a comment for which CBC it was. I know eBird doesn't like lists that are longer than 4 miles or so, but honestly, I found that it was too cumbersome to try to split them. Inevitably, someone would ask me during the count how many Eastern Bluebirds (or whatever) we had seen so far and I'd have to shuffle through 9 checklists to figure it out. I know combing them is not ideal, but they weren't flagged. I'd be interested to know if there are better ways to do it, or if it skews the data enough that it's better for scientific purposes to just not try to eBird them.
Judi
On Tue, Jan 7, 2020 at 9:33 AM <badgerboy...> wrote:
Date: 1/7/20 7:00 am From: Norman Budnitz (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Re: Ebird checklists for CBC's getting flagged
I use eBird for CBCs, but if I am visiting multiple habitats, I submit multiple lists. Entering data in the field has become so much easier now with eBird that it has become a much more useful tool for me. However, when it comes to submitting my data to the CBC count compiler (full disclosure, I am one), I collect the various checklists into one spreadsheet and send that in. If my count area is just one place with no interruptions such as driving to other spots, one eBird checklist works fine. I have never had my lists flagged when I do this.
Note that eBird data is more valuable to researchers if any given checklist is restricted to one general place or a particular habitat. If data gathered while birding from a car while driving through residential areas is combined in one list with data gathered while walking through a pine forest, it becomes much less useful for researchers who are trying to tease out habitat information. This is one of the problems with the data available from CBCs. Those data are valuable on a coarse-grained level. EBird has the potential to be more valuable on a fine-grained level if people restrict their individual submissions to smaller areas and/or individual habitats.
On Tue, Jan 7, 2020 at 9:33 AM <badgerboy...> wrote:
Date: 1/7/20 6:33 am From: <badgerboy...> Subject: Re: Ebird checklists for CBC's getting flagged
Thanks Kent, yes I did read that and honestly it wasn't very helpful. It says to break up your day into multiple checklists, and of course that defeats the purpose. Didn't anyone else out there have any input on this? Wasn't anyone able to get ebird lists to work for CBC's and not be flagged? You can reply to my private email if your afraid of being targeted by the reviewers.
Thanks, Guy
On 1/3/2020 7:35 PM, Kent Fiala (via carolinabirds Mailing List) wrote: > > Have you read https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__ebird.org_news_ebirding-2Dyour-2Dcbc&d=DwIC-g&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=CfFCKT-Vm2zqAkEmyaTlhZOZ35dy0QTBVTMtjh0o1qU&s=aabd0Zjm7cjTevyXBmfchkvLFZQ0-1Olw_yZizsyo-k&e= > > Kent Fiala > On 1/3/2020 7:29 PM, <badgerboy...> wrote: >> >> My CBC Ebird checklists are getting flagged so they do not appear in >> public outputs. The message I see on the checklist says:"/*Protocol >> issue.* This checklist has been flagged because of an issue with the >> selected protocol. This checklist and its observations do not appear >> in public eBird outputs."/ >> >> A few years ago I heard that it was OK to submit a CBC Ebird >> checklist as long as you used the "Incidental" protocol and used the >> following language in the description of the site:"XXXX CBC Sector >> 4--DATA" That is what I have done but now they are being hidden. And >> there is no way to know what the specific issue with the checklist is. >> >> I've gone through Ebird's guidelines to try and find what the problem >> might be, but can't find anything that should trigger this flag, >> which apparently is the reviewer's decision. Does anyone know how to >> make a CBC checklist acceptable for Ebird? >> >> Guy McGrane, Deep Gap, NC >>
Just a reminder to folks used to navigating by phone... there is little to (most of the time no) cell service in and around Pungo. Someone pointed out that one could just pull up the refuge map on the net and navigate that way. This only works if you save the map for offline use :-)
Steve Shultz
Apex NC
-----Original Message-----
From: <carolinabirds-request...> [mailto:<carolinabirds-request...>] On Behalf Of Kent Fiala
Sent: Monday, January 06, 2020 9:40 PM
To: <carolinabirds...>
Subject: Re: Pungo snow goose intel
This email is from an external source - exercise caution regarding links and attachments.
Date: 1/6/20 2:05 pm From: Ann Brice (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: No Sandhill Cranes on Hwy 33 in Edgecombe County yesterday
I drove to where I found the 39 cranes On Dec 1 and 22 and didn't see any in the area.
Date: 1/6/20 11:01 am From: Kay Lovelace (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Re: Pungo snow goose intel
> One thing to consider is the budget cuts faced by the refuges. I’ve often found the staff at Pungo to be very helpful and friendly. My guess is that they are working with limited resources and personnel.
> I’ll add a little to what Harry said.
>
> A – Pungo frustrates the %$#^ out of me because nothing (or not much, at least compared to Alligator River NWR) is signed. You need a refuge map, and the map station is often empty. That said, the deets below should help.
>
> B- I’m not surprised that Harry et al did not see the *big* SNGO flock from their position on the lake’s SW side. When we were there a few weeks ago, the birds flew off the lake due north. About half landed in a field on the refuge, the other half kept going north. You can position yourself north of the lake on North Lake Rd (park at the gate near Canal D and North Lake and walk east about a mile) and hope the birds are still heading in that direction. We had half a dozen Ross’s with the Snows as they flew over.
>
> C – My understanding is that you can still access the observation tower on the south side by proceeding to the corner Harry notes below, and then continuing east on South Lake Rd to the tower. South Lake seems to be intermittently open.
>
> Steve Shultz
> Apex NC
>
> From: <carolinabirds-request...> [mailto:<carolinabirds-request...>] On Behalf Of Harry LeGrand
> Sent: Monday, January 06, 2020 11:50 AM
> To: Clyde Sorenson; Harry LeGrand
> Cc: carolinabirds
> Subject: Re: Pungo snow goose intel
>
> This email is from an external source - exercise caution regarding links and attachments.
>
> Clyde and others:
>
> You are going to indeed need intel! I visited the place last Friday (Jan. 3), with Erla Beegle and Jeri Smart. Well, we did NOT have intel, and I was very pissed regarding road closings.
>
> There is no longer a loop road near the lake. We did not know that. Here is the refuge map, to refer my comments to:
>
> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.fws.gov_southeast_pubs_PungoMap.pdf&d=DwIFaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=0HfdK_vBxeB0xMVoNH6PrCXAd7VHvQsB3WnWk2wniC0&s=km1uAT2_YKbOxtyerznNxd08j-NfWzBoYPqTonO1V74&e= >
> Normally, the loop consists of: east on Refuge Road, north on Valstaaldulnen Road, right (east) on South Pungo Road, north on Hyde Park Road to the south edge of the lake, then west on South Lake Road, then north on West Lake Road, then south on D-Canal Road (to include Pat's Road). However, there is a gate now at the west end of South Pungo Road, and so you cannot go this way! You MUST head north up Pat's Road and D-Canal Road, turn right onto West Lake Road, and then stop where West Lake Road meets South Lake Road. That is the place to set up the scopes and wait around for 2 hours. The swans are there, the SANDHILL CRANES are usually seen around the margins of the several impoundments at this intersection. This intersection is where the binocular symbol is on the map.
>
> We arrived at this spot around 4:15 pm, after having made the mistake of trying to make a counter-clockwise loop (nope!). On the way, along D-Canal Road, we stopped and talked to guys in an SUV heading south, asking about the road conditions and how to get to the intersection with the impoundments. Good news -- yes, they were there and roads were good, but bad news. They said the cranes had gotten up and flown away! If I wasn't already pissed by the blockedo roads, I was really pissed now -- as we were too late to catch the cranes. Thankfully, we arrived at the impoundments, saw some swans, about 300 shorebirds, mostly Killdeers, and I DID spot the 7 Sandhill Cranes feeding in corn stubble looking south from the intersection. Whew! After about 15 minutes, we heard a distinct bugling call, about 3 times, coming from a solo flying swan. We all agree this was a TRUMPETER SWAN! Erla and I each played different tapes of the call of the species to hear what it sounded like, and all three of us agreed we had heard a Trumpeter. Tundras are everywhere and their calls are quite familiar to us. Also, there were maybe 10,000 swans densely packed into the impoundment south of the intersection -- way too far to do anything with. (You can see a bit of this pack of swans -- through trees -- from D-Canal Road, but not overly well. And, thankfully, the cranes were feeding around the intersection.)
>
> Now, onto the Snow Geese. As Clyde and other know, the 20,000 birds -- roughly -- tend to all come and go together -- between roosting on the lake and feeding in remote fields, often far from cars. We DID see two flocks flying NE to SW overhead, looking north from the intersection, maybe around 445. One was about 1000 and the other about 3000. We had 20 or more "Blues" in them and at least one ROSS' GOOSE. So, this was not the huge flock, but it worked for us. BTW -- the large shorebird flock, in the impoundment east of the intersection, had 45-50 Wilson's Snipes (that's a lot!), 3 Long-billed Dowitchers, and a very few Lesser Yellowlegs. There were a few ducks of various common species visible.
>
> The key is getting to the intersection of South Lake and West Lake roads, and hang around there for a good while, preferably after 3 pm to dusk. Early morning CAN be good, but I often completely strike out in the mornings on the Snow Geese.
>
> So -- the roads to reach this key intersection (from the west) are good, and not rutted or pot-holed now. Still, 4WD is better than 2 WD, but any car should be able to get there.
>
> Someone asked about when the cranes were last seen? Please, please, continue to check the Carolina Bird Club Sightings listing. Some of us keep saying to do this, and people still ask this question. There was no report yesterday -- maybe no one was there, but they were reported on Saturday. As the 7 have been there all winter, .... common sense saysthey are still there, but of course they could be missable. We DID see them pick up around 500 and head to the lake, where perhaps they roost.
>
> It could be rainy on Saturday and Sunday, but ... remember, the loop is no longer there this winter. You need to head north up Pat's Road, and reach the intersection from this west side. I assume you can then drive to the platform on the south end of the lake. I hate that spot, as the birds are usually very far away. The fields along the east side of Pat's Road are completely mowed down and likely won't have any geese this winter. Some folks have been lucky to see the geese in fields this winter -- that is chancey, and you have to assume you may only see them in flight, if even see any at all.
>
> Maybe you'll find a Trumpeter Swan or the ground with Tundras for comparison, or some other surprise. We did see an American Bittern in flight near dusk, and heard two Woodcocks calling along West Lake Road at dusk as we were driving out.
>
> Harry LeGrand
> Raleigh
>
>
>
> On Sun, Jan 5, 2020 at 11:30 PM Clyde Sorenson <sorenson...> wrote:
> All- I would appreciate any intel anyone could provide me on the whereabouts and timing of the snow goose movements at Pungo. I'm bringing a visitor from the UK to see them on Sunday.
>
> Thanks,
> Clyde Sorenson
> Clayton and Raleigh, NC
Date: 1/6/20 9:25 am From: Susan Campbell <susan...> Subject: Re: Pungo snow goose intel
FWIW I have sent a note to the refuge manager.
Burning up this keyboard today.
No sign of HVAC guy...
xo me
________________________________
From: <carolinabirds-request...> <carolinabirds-request...> on behalf of "Shultz, Steven" <carolinabirds...>
Sent: Monday, January 6, 2020 11:59 AM
To: <carolinabirds...> <carolinabirds...>
Subject: RE: Pungo snow goose intel
Ill add a little to what Harry said.
A Pungo frustrates the %$#^ out of me because nothing (or not much, at least compared to Alligator River NWR) is signed. You need a refuge map, and the map station is often empty. That said, the deets below should help.
B- Im not surprised that Harry et al did not see the *big* SNGO flock from their position on the lakes SW side. When we were there a few weeks ago, the birds flew off the lake due north. About half landed in a field on the refuge, the other half kept going north. You can position yourself north of the lake on North Lake Rd (park at the gate near Canal D and North Lake and walk east about a mile) and hope the birds are still heading in that direction. We had half a dozen Rosss with the Snows as they flew over.
C My understanding is that you can still access the observation tower on the south side by proceeding to the corner Harry notes below, and then continuing east on South Lake Rd to the tower. South Lake seems to be intermittently open.
Steve Shultz
Apex NC
From: <carolinabirds-request...> [mailto:<carolinabirds-request...>] On Behalf Of Harry LeGrand
Sent: Monday, January 06, 2020 11:50 AM
To: Clyde Sorenson; Harry LeGrand
Cc: carolinabirds
Subject: Re: Pungo snow goose intel
This email is from an external source - exercise caution regarding links and attachments.
Clyde and others:
You are going to indeed need intel! I visited the place last Friday (Jan. 3), with Erla Beegle and Jeri Smart. Well, we did NOT have intel, and I was very pissed regarding road closings.
There is no longer a loop road near the lake. We did not know that. Here is the refuge map, to refer my comments to:
Normally, the loop consists of: east on Refuge Road, north on Valstaaldulnen Road, right (east) on South Pungo Road, north on Hyde Park Road to the south edge of the lake, then west on South Lake Road, then north on West Lake Road, then south on D-Canal Road (to include Pat's Road). However, there is a gate now at the west end of South Pungo Road, and so you cannot go this way! You MUST head north up Pat's Road and D-Canal Road, turn right onto West Lake Road, and then stop where West Lake Road meets South Lake Road. That is the place to set up the scopes and wait around for 2 hours. The swans are there, the SANDHILL CRANES are usually seen around the margins of the several impoundments at this intersection. This intersection is where the binocular symbol is on the map.
We arrived at this spot around 4:15 pm, after having made the mistake of trying to make a counter-clockwise loop (nope!). On the way, along D-Canal Road, we stopped and talked to guys in an SUV heading south, asking about the road conditions and how to get to the intersection with the impoundments. Good news -- yes, they were there and roads were good, but bad news. They said the cranes had gotten up and flown away! If I wasn't already pissed by the blockedo roads, I was really pissed now -- as we were too late to catch the cranes. Thankfully, we arrived at the impoundments, saw some swans, about 300 shorebirds, mostly Killdeers, and I DID spot the 7 Sandhill Cranes feeding in corn stubble looking south from the intersection. Whew! After about 15 minutes, we heard a distinct bugling call, about 3 times, coming from a solo flying swan. We all agree this was a TRUMPETER SWAN! Erla and I each played different tapes of the call of the species to hear what it sounded like, and all three of us agreed we had heard a Trumpeter. Tundras are everywhere and their calls are quite familiar to us. Also, there were maybe 10,000 swans densely packed into the impoundment south of the intersection -- way too far to do anything with. (You can see a bit of this pack of swans -- through trees -- from D-Canal Road, but not overly well. And, thankfully, the cranes were feeding around the intersection.)
Now, onto the Snow Geese. As Clyde and other know, the 20,000 birds -- roughly -- tend to all come and go together -- between roosting on the lake and feeding in remote fields, often far from cars. We DID see two flocks flying NE to SW overhead, looking north from the intersection, maybe around 445. One was about 1000 and the other about 3000. We had 20 or more "Blues" in them and at least one ROSS' GOOSE. So, this was not the huge flock, but it worked for us. BTW -- the large shorebird flock, in the impoundment east of the intersection, had 45-50 Wilson's Snipes (that's a lot!), 3 Long-billed Dowitchers, and a very few Lesser Yellowlegs. There were a few ducks of various common species visible.
The key is getting to the intersection of South Lake and West Lake roads, and hang around there for a good while, preferably after 3 pm to dusk. Early morning CAN be good, but I often completely strike out in the mornings on the Snow Geese.
So -- the roads to reach this key intersection (from the west) are good, and not rutted or pot-holed now. Still, 4WD is better than 2 WD, but any car should be able to get there.
Someone asked about when the cranes were last seen? Please, please, continue to check the Carolina Bird Club Sightings listing. Some of us keep saying to do this, and people still ask this question. There was no report yesterday -- maybe no one was there, but they were reported on Saturday. As the 7 have been there all winter, .... common sense saysthey are still there, but of course they could be missable. We DID see them pick up around 500 and head to the lake, where perhaps they roost.
It could be rainy on Saturday and Sunday, but ... remember, the loop is no longer there this winter. You need to head north up Pat's Road, and reach the intersection from this west side. I assume you can then drive to the platform on the south end of the lake. I hate that spot, as the birds are usually very far away. The fields along the east side of Pat's Road are completely mowed down and likely won't have any geese this winter. Some folks have been lucky to see the geese in fields this winter -- that is chancey, and you have to assume you may only see them in flight, if even see any at all.
Maybe you'll find a Trumpeter Swan or the ground with Tundras for comparison, or some other surprise. We did see an American Bittern in flight near dusk, and heard two Woodcocks calling along West Lake Road at dusk as we were driving out.
Harry LeGrand
Raleigh
On Sun, Jan 5, 2020 at 11:30 PM Clyde Sorenson <sorenson...><mailto:<sorenson...>> wrote:
All- I would appreciate any intel anyone could provide me on the whereabouts and timing of the snow goose movements at Pungo. I'm bringing a visitor from the UK to see them on Sunday.
A – Pungo frustrates the %$#^ out of me because nothing (or not much, at least compared to Alligator River NWR) is signed. You need a refuge map, and the map station is often empty. That said, the deets below should help.
B- I’m not surprised that Harry et al did not see the *big* SNGO flock from their position on the lake’s SW side. When we were there a few weeks ago, the birds flew off the lake due north. About half landed in a field on the refuge, the other half kept going north. You can position yourself north of the lake on North Lake Rd (park at the gate near Canal D and North Lake and walk east about a mile) and hope the birds are still heading in that direction. We had half a dozen Ross’s with the Snows as they flew over.
C – My understanding is that you can still access the observation tower on the south side by proceeding to the corner Harry notes below, and then continuing east on South Lake Rd to the tower. South Lake seems to be intermittently open.
Steve Shultz
Apex NC
From: <carolinabirds-request...> [mailto:<carolinabirds-request...>] On Behalf Of Harry LeGrand
Sent: Monday, January 06, 2020 11:50 AM
To: Clyde Sorenson; Harry LeGrand
Cc: carolinabirds
Subject: Re: Pungo snow goose intel
This email is from an external source - exercise caution regarding links and attachments.
Clyde and others:
You are going to indeed need intel! I visited the place last Friday (Jan. 3), with Erla Beegle and Jeri Smart. Well, we did NOT have intel, and I was very pissed regarding road closings.
There is no longer a loop road near the lake. We did not know that. Here is the refuge map, to refer my comments to:
Normally, the loop consists of: east on Refuge Road, north on Valstaaldulnen Road, right (east) on South Pungo Road, north on Hyde Park Road to the south edge of the lake, then west on South Lake Road, then north on West Lake Road, then south on D-Canal Road (to include Pat's Road). However, there is a gate now at the west end of South Pungo Road, and so you cannot go this way! You MUST head north up Pat's Road and D-Canal Road, turn right onto West Lake Road, and then stop where West Lake Road meets South Lake Road. That is the place to set up the scopes and wait around for 2 hours. The swans are there, the SANDHILL CRANES are usually seen around the margins of the several impoundments at this intersection. This intersection is where the binocular symbol is on the map.
We arrived at this spot around 4:15 pm, after having made the mistake of trying to make a counter-clockwise loop (nope!). On the way, along D-Canal Road, we stopped and talked to guys in an SUV heading south, asking about the road conditions and how to get to the intersection with the impoundments. Good news -- yes, they were there and roads were good, but bad news. They said the cranes had gotten up and flown away! If I wasn't already pissed by the blockedo roads, I was really pissed now -- as we were too late to catch the cranes. Thankfully, we arrived at the impoundments, saw some swans, about 300 shorebirds, mostly Killdeers, and I DID spot the 7 Sandhill Cranes feeding in corn stubble looking south from the intersection. Whew! After about 15 minutes, we heard a distinct bugling call, about 3 times, coming from a solo flying swan. We all agree this was a TRUMPETER SWAN! Erla and I each played different tapes of the call of the species to hear what it sounded like, and all three of us agreed we had heard a Trumpeter. Tundras are everywhere and their calls are quite familiar to us. Also, there were maybe 10,000 swans densely packed into the impoundment south of the intersection -- way too far to do anything with. (You can see a bit of this pack of swans -- through trees -- from D-Canal Road, but not overly well. And, thankfully, the cranes were feeding around the intersection.)
Now, onto the Snow Geese. As Clyde and other know, the 20,000 birds -- roughly -- tend to all come and go together -- between roosting on the lake and feeding in remote fields, often far from cars. We DID see two flocks flying NE to SW overhead, looking north from the intersection, maybe around 445. One was about 1000 and the other about 3000. We had 20 or more "Blues" in them and at least one ROSS' GOOSE. So, this was not the huge flock, but it worked for us. BTW -- the large shorebird flock, in the impoundment east of the intersection, had 45-50 Wilson's Snipes (that's a lot!), 3 Long-billed Dowitchers, and a very few Lesser Yellowlegs. There were a few ducks of various common species visible.
The key is getting to the intersection of South Lake and West Lake roads, and hang around there for a good while, preferably after 3 pm to dusk. Early morning CAN be good, but I often completely strike out in the mornings on the Snow Geese.
So -- the roads to reach this key intersection (from the west) are good, and not rutted or pot-holed now. Still, 4WD is better than 2 WD, but any car should be able to get there.
Someone asked about when the cranes were last seen? Please, please, continue to check the Carolina Bird Club Sightings listing. Some of us keep saying to do this, and people still ask this question. There was no report yesterday -- maybe no one was there, but they were reported on Saturday. As the 7 have been there all winter, .... common sense saysthey are still there, but of course they could be missable. We DID see them pick up around 500 and head to the lake, where perhaps they roost.
It could be rainy on Saturday and Sunday, but ... remember, the loop is no longer there this winter. You need to head north up Pat's Road, and reach the intersection from this west side. I assume you can then drive to the platform on the south end of the lake. I hate that spot, as the birds are usually very far away. The fields along the east side of Pat's Road are completely mowed down and likely won't have any geese this winter. Some folks have been lucky to see the geese in fields this winter -- that is chancey, and you have to assume you may only see them in flight, if even see any at all.
Maybe you'll find a Trumpeter Swan or the ground with Tundras for comparison, or some other surprise. We did see an American Bittern in flight near dusk, and heard two Woodcocks calling along West Lake Road at dusk as we were driving out.
Harry LeGrand
Raleigh
On Sun, Jan 5, 2020 at 11:30 PM Clyde Sorenson <sorenson...><mailto:<sorenson...>> wrote:
All- I would appreciate any intel anyone could provide me on the whereabouts and timing of the snow goose movements at Pungo. I'm bringing a visitor from the UK to see them on Sunday.
Date: 1/6/20 8:51 am From: Harry LeGrand (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Re: Pungo snow goose intel
Clyde and others:
*You are going to indeed need intel!* I visited the place last Friday (Jan. 3), with Erla Beegle and Jeri Smart. Well, we did NOT have intel, and I was very pissed regarding road closings.
*There is no longer a loop road near the lake. *We did not know that. Here is the refuge map, to refer my comments to:
Normally, the loop consists of: east on Refuge Road, north on Valstaaldulnen Road, right (east) on South Pungo Road, north on Hyde Park Road to the south edge of the lake, then west on South Lake Road, then north on West Lake Road, then south on D-Canal Road (to include Pat's Road). *However, there is a gate now at the west end of South Pungo Road, and so you cannot go this way! * You MUST head north up Pat's Road and D-Canal Road, turn right onto West Lake Road, and then stop where West Lake Road meets South Lake Road. *That is the place *to set up the scopes and wait around for 2 hours. The swans are there, the SANDHILL CRANES are usually seen around the margins of the several impoundments at this intersection. This intersection is where the binocular symbol is on the map.
We arrived at this spot around 4:15 pm, after having made the mistake of trying to make a counter-clockwise loop (nope!). On the way, along D-Canal Road, we stopped and talked to guys in an SUV heading south, asking about the road conditions and how to get to the intersection with the impoundments. Good news -- yes, they were there and roads were good, but bad news. They said the cranes had gotten up and flown away! If I wasn't already pissed by the blockedo roads, I was really pissed now -- as we were too late to catch the cranes. Thankfully, we arrived at the impoundments, saw some swans, about 300 shorebirds, mostly Killdeers, and I DID spot the 7 Sandhill Cranes feeding in corn stubble looking south from the intersection. Whew! After about 15 minutes, we heard a distinct bugling call, about 3 times, coming from a solo flying swan. We all agree this was a TRUMPETER SWAN! Erla and I each played different tapes of the call of the species to hear what it sounded like, and all three of us agreed we had heard a Trumpeter. Tundras are everywhere and their calls are quite familiar to us. Also, there were maybe 10,000 swans densely packed into the impoundment south of the intersection -- way too far to do anything with. (You can see a bit of this pack of swans -- through trees -- from D-Canal Road, but not overly well. And, thankfully, the cranes were feeding around the intersection.)
Now, onto the Snow Geese. As Clyde and other know, the 20,000 birds -- roughly -- tend to all come and go together -- between roosting on the lake and feeding in remote fields, often far from cars. We DID see two flocks flying NE to SW overhead, looking north from the intersection, maybe around 445. One was about 1000 and the other about 3000. We had 20 or more "Blues" in them and at least one ROSS' GOOSE. So, this was not the huge flock, but it worked for us. BTW -- the large shorebird flock, in the impoundment east of the intersection, had 45-50 Wilson's Snipes (that's a lot!), 3 Long-billed Dowitchers, and a very few Lesser Yellowlegs. There were a few ducks of various common species visible.
The key is getting to the intersection of South Lake and West Lake roads, and hang around there for a good while, preferably after 3 pm to dusk. Early morning CAN be good, but I often completely strike out in the mornings on the Snow Geese.
So -- the roads to reach this key intersection (from the west) are good, and not rutted or pot-holed now. Still, 4WD is better than 2 WD, but any car should be able to get there.
Someone asked about when the cranes were last seen? Please, please, continue to check the Carolina Bird Club Sightings listing. Some of us keep saying to do this, and people still ask this question. There was no report yesterday -- maybe no one was there, but they were reported on Saturday. As the 7 have been there all winter, .... common sense saysthey are still there, but of course they could be missable. We DID see them pick up around 500 and head to the lake, where perhaps they roost.
It could be rainy on Saturday and Sunday, but ... remember, the loop is no longer there this winter. You need to head north up Pat's Road, and reach the intersection from this west side. I assume you can then drive to the platform on the south end of the lake. I hate that spot, as the birds are usually very far away*. * The fields along the east side of Pat's Road are completely mowed down and likely won't have any geese this winter. Some folks have been lucky to see the geese in fields this winter -- that is chancey, and you have to assume you may only see them in flight, if even see any at all.
Maybe you'll find a Trumpeter Swan or the ground with Tundras for comparison, or some other surprise. We did see an American Bittern in flight near dusk, and heard two Woodcocks calling along West Lake Road at dusk as we were driving out.
Harry LeGrand Raleigh
On Sun, Jan 5, 2020 at 11:30 PM Clyde Sorenson <sorenson...> wrote:
> All- I would appreciate any intel anyone could provide me on the > whereabouts and timing of the snow goose movements at Pungo. I'm bringing a > visitor from the UK to see them on Sunday. > > Thanks, > Clyde Sorenson > Clayton and Raleigh, NC >
Date: 1/6/20 6:46 am From: Linda Ward (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Pungo road conditions?
To follow up on the request for intel re snow geese location and timing...would someone also comment on road conditions at Pungo for those who do not have a 4WD vehicle? I believe "Pat's Road" is usually passable, but what about others? Any recent sandhill crane sightings?
BTW, the gray kingbird continues at Cornland Road near intersection of 17 in Virginia...for those not familiar, this is only about 4-5 miles past the state line with NC. If you've visited Dismal Swamp State Park on the state boundary between NC and VA, the hotspot location for the gray kingbird is only a short drive north.
Date: 1/6/20 5:05 am From: Corey, Ed <ed.corey...> Subject: (Late Post) - Immature Golden Eagle on trail cam - Stokes County 02Dec2019
Apologies for the much delayed post, but the superintendent at Hanging Rock State Park contacted me on December 2nd to confirm an eagle identification. The animal was captured on a trail camera coming to a deer carcass by a park visitor, and was an obvious immature Golden Eagle. We spent a bit of time trying to figure out where exactly the animal was seen, but apparently the original report came from Germantown, in Stokes County. If you happen to be in the area, it would be worth keeping an eye to the skies, as this bird could still be hanging around the area.
Ed Corey
Inventory Biologist, NC Division of Parks and Recreation
NC Dept. of Natural and Cultural Resources
919 841 4037 Office
919 208 7864 Mobile
<Ed.Corey...><mailto:<Ed.Corey...>
12700 Bayleaf Church Road | Raleigh, North Carolina 27614
Email correspondence to and from this address is subject to the North Carolina Public Records Law and may be disclosed to third parties.
All- I would appreciate any intel anyone could provide me on the whereabouts and timing of the snow goose movements at Pungo. I'm bringing a visitor from the UK to see them on Sunday.
Date: 1/5/20 1:29 pm From: Brian Patteson (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Re: Puffin at Cape Hatteras and Upcoming Boat Trips
Some clarification about the puffin. It was a live stranding away from the ocean. Not sure how it got there, but it went to our local rehab facility.
Brian Patteson
Hatteras, NC
> On Jan 5, 2020, at 3:45 PM, Brian Patteson (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> wrote:
>
> I recently learned that an Atlantic Puffin came ashore at Buxton, NC a couple of days ago. This is a species that we have seen offshore on several occasions, but we have not been out north of Diamond Shoals recently to see if they are around. We are, however, running some pelagic trips next month, starting on Saturday, February 1. That will be our first trip of the year. We have space on that trip, but our trip the following weekend is sold out. We also have space on the President’s Day Weekend double header. You can sign up for one or both trips that weekend: Feb. 15 and or 16. Our final winter trip is on Feb. 22(23.) What we see on these trips varies from year to year, but we have found Great Skua on most of them over the last 25 years, and we have seen five species of alcids from the boat in a single day! Fulmar, Manx Shearwater, Red Phalarope, and Little Gull are also frequently found offshore in February, and we have seen two Yellow-nosed Albatrosses and one Black-browed Albatross on our trips off Hatteras- all in February. These are all day trips aboard our boat, Stormy Petrel II, and we generally depart from Hatteras Inlet. It’s a great opportunity to photograph these birds along with hundreds of gulls and gannets because we chum for the duration of the trip. For more information, please see our website- wwwDOTseabirdingDOTcom. You can also call me at (252) 986-1363.
>
> Brian Patteson
> Hatteras, NC
Date: 1/5/20 12:46 pm From: Brian Patteson (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Puffin at Cape Hatteras and Upcoming Boat Trips
I recently learned that an Atlantic Puffin came ashore at Buxton, NC a couple of days ago. This is a species that we have seen offshore on several occasions, but we have not been out north of Diamond Shoals recently to see if they are around. We are, however, running some pelagic trips next month, starting on Saturday, February 1. That will be our first trip of the year. We have space on that trip, but our trip the following weekend is sold out. We also have space on the President’s Day Weekend double header. You can sign up for one or both trips that weekend: Feb. 15 and or 16. Our final winter trip is on Feb. 22(23.) What we see on these trips varies from year to year, but we have found Great Skua on most of them over the last 25 years, and we have seen five species of alcids from the boat in a single day! Fulmar, Manx Shearwater, Red Phalarope, and Little Gull are also frequently found offshore in February, and we have seen two Yellow-nosed Albatrosses and one Black-browed Albatross on our trips off Hatteras- all in February. These are all day trips aboard our boat, Stormy Petrel II, and we generally depart from Hatteras Inlet. It’s a great opportunity to photograph these birds along with hundreds of gulls and gannets because we chum for the duration of the trip. For more information, please see our website- wwwDOTseabirdingDOTcom. You can also call me at (252) 986-1363.
On 1/3/2020 7:29 PM, <badgerboy...> wrote: > > My CBC Ebird checklists are getting flagged so they do not appear in public outputs. The message I see on the checklist says:"/*Protocol issue.* This checklist has been flagged because of an issue with the selected protocol. This checklist and its observations do not appear in public eBird outputs."/ > > A few years ago I heard that it was OK to submit a CBC Ebird checklist as long as you used the "Incidental" protocol and used the following language in the description of the site:"XXXX CBC Sector 4--DATA" That is what I have done but now they are being hidden. And there is no way to know what the specific issue with the checklist is. > > I've gone through Ebird's guidelines to try and find what the problem might be, but can't find anything that should trigger this flag, which apparently is the reviewer's decision. Does anyone know how to make a CBC checklist acceptable for Ebird? > > Guy McGrane, Deep Gap, NC >
My CBC Ebird checklists are getting flagged so they do not appear in public outputs. The message I see on the checklist says:"/*Protocol issue.* This checklist has been flagged because of an issue with the selected protocol. This checklist and its observations do not appear in public eBird outputs."/
A few years ago I heard that it was OK to submit a CBC Ebird checklist as long as you used the "Incidental" protocol and used the following language in the description of the site:"XXXX CBC Sector 4--DATA" That is what I have done but now they are being hidden. And there is no way to know what the specific issue with the checklist is.
I've gone through Ebird's guidelines to try and find what the problem might be, but can't find anything that should trigger this flag, which apparently is the reviewer's decision. Does anyone know how to make a CBC checklist acceptable for Ebird?
Date: 1/3/20 5:08 am From: Birding Poet (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Re: Nesting material in January?
Thank you, Chris. There were two birds together, but I'll go with 'showing
off' in this early instance.
On Fri, Jan 3, 2020 at 8:04 AM Christopher Hill <carolinabirds...>
wrote:
> I saw a male Loggerhead Shrike with some nesting material the other day.
> He wasn’t even paired. I think in Carolina Wrens (certainly in Marsh
> Wrens), males probably build partial nests to show off to females, who then
> take over and build the real nests. So yes, it’s almost certainly nest
> building behavior, but it is not necessarily going to directly lead to
> nesting any time soon.
>
> Chris Hill
> Conway, SC
> > On Jan 3, 2020, at 7:23 AM, Birding Poet <carolinabirds...> wrote:
> >
> > Is it too early to see a Carolina Wren carrying nesting material in
> Charleston, SC? I really would think so, but one picked up some tiny bits
> of dried grass off my back porch, looked like it was eating something at
> first, then had a bit of something hanging from its mouth as it flew off.
> > --
> > ~Tracee 843/425-7630
>
> --
~Tracee 843/425-7630
Date: 1/3/20 5:04 am From: Christopher Hill (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Re: Nesting material in January?
I saw a male Loggerhead Shrike with some nesting material the other day. He wasn’t even paired. I think in Carolina Wrens (certainly in Marsh Wrens), males probably build partial nests to show off to females, who then take over and build the real nests. So yes, it’s almost certainly nest building behavior, but it is not necessarily going to directly lead to nesting any time soon.
Chris Hill
Conway, SC
> On Jan 3, 2020, at 7:23 AM, Birding Poet <carolinabirds...> wrote:
>
> Is it too early to see a Carolina Wren carrying nesting material in Charleston, SC? I really would think so, but one picked up some tiny bits of dried grass off my back porch, looked like it was eating something at first, then had a bit of something hanging from its mouth as it flew off.
> --
> ~Tracee 843/425-7630
Date: 1/3/20 4:24 am From: Birding Poet (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Nesting material in January?
Is it too early to see a Carolina Wren carrying nesting material in Charleston, SC? I really would think so, but one picked up some tiny bits of dried grass off my back porch, looked like it was eating something at first, then had a bit of something hanging from its mouth as it flew off. -- ~Tracee 843/425-7630
Date: 1/2/20 5:17 pm From: Bill Hilton Jr. <hilton...> Subject: Hilton Pond 12/22/19 (York/Rock Hill SC Christmas Bird Count)
I just compiled and wrote up the results of the 29th annual York/Rock Hill (SC) Christmas Bird Count, held in December. The tally, with some comparisons to the previous 28 years, is part of my “This Week at Hilton Pond” photo essay #708 for 22-30 Dec 2019. Included are some photos and an editorial comment about habitat loss and bird counting.
DR. BILL HILTON JR., Executive Director
Hilton Pond Center for Piedmont Natural History
1432 DeVinney Road, York, South Carolina 29745 USA
office & cell (803) 684-5852
The mission of Hilton Pond Center for Piedmont Natural History is "to conserve plants, animals, habitats, and other natural components of the Piedmont Region of the eastern United States through observation, scientific study, and education for students of all ages.
"Never trust a person too lazy to get up for sunrise or too busy to watch the sunset." BHjr.
Date: 1/2/20 5:40 am From: Linda Ward (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Gray kingbird, just over NC state line in Chesapeake, Va
Because of our proximity to the state line of Va., I subscribe to ebird rare bird alerts from Chesapeake, Va (a 30 min drive from Coinjock, NC). This morning I received an alert for a gray kingbird posted by Laura Mae. She had 3 photos posted. Listed location as Cornland Road, West of Rt. 17. Date posted was Jan. 1, 2020.
Seen on private land in Sampson County today. If the bird persists the landowner is willing to make arrangements for viewing. Poor quality iPhone photos today, hopefully better photos if the bird is still present Friday.
We have a pair of Canon 10 x 30 image stabilization (IS) binoculars that are about 5-6 years old. The optics and stabilization are good but the coating has become gooey; it leaves a sticky, almost greasy black residue on your hands and anything that touches the case. Cleaning with rubbing alcohol didn’t help. According to reviews on the Canon website as well as on Amazon, literally scores of people have reported similar experience with this product, and only two have gotten something better than a brush-off from Canon. Has anyone else on the listserv had a similar experience? If so, did you come up with anything to make them usable again, say, wrapping the case in some sort of tape or film? Short of figuring out an over-coat that we can apply, I think our options are to throw them away, give them away with full disclosure, or wear nitrile medical gloves when we use them :-)
Thanks in advance.
Peggy Schachte
Sullivan’s Island, SC
<schachtep...> <mailto:<schachtep...> (if you prefer not to reply to the whole gang)
Date: 1/1/20 11:21 am From: Marc Ribaudo (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Lake Benson, Garner
I started off 2020 at Lake Benson in Garner. Waterfowl were typical for this winter so far: Mute Swan, Canada Goose, Mallard, Green-winged Teal, Ruddy Duck, Ring-necked Duck, Gadwall, and Hooded Merganser. Also good numbers of Pied-billed Grebes. The surprise was a Fox Sparrow in a thicket on the lake shore. This is my first Fox Sparrow in Wake County. I have found them to be much more difficult to find here than in Northern Virginia, my previous home.
Marc Ribaudo
Date: 1/1/20 9:35 am From: Harry LeGrand (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Good diversity of ducks in the RDU area
I hit 3 lakes close to the RDU airport northwest of Raleigh this morning. Big Lake at Umstead State Park has settled down to the same ducks I saw a week ago. I then decided to stop at Brier Creek Reservoir as there were some white-bodied ducks and traffic was light. Yes, it’s a bit scary parking along Aviation Parkway.
Lake Crabtree County Park was closed today, so I stopped at the Southport side and finally the dam, where I was met with a bone-chilling wind and whitecaps!
Here is a general summary by memory; I have already submitted 3 eBird lists — BL, BCR, LC
Canada Goose zip, nada
Mallard. 12 BL
Am. Black Duck. 6 same
Gadwall. 8 same
Green-winged Teal. 40-50 same
Ring-necked Duck. 35. BL. BCR
Lesser Scaup. 50 or more. BCR
Greater Scaup. 10-12 or more BCR
Scaup sp. 35 same
Bufflehead. 20. BL, BCR
Hooded Merganser. 20. Same lakes
Red-breasted Merganser. 1. Continuing female at LC - only Duck I saw on the lake
Ruddy Duck. 30 BL, BCR
Pied- billed Grebe. 7 only at LC
Common Raven 1 circling low over Aviation Parkway. My first in this area near the lake
I didn’t see Greater Scaup on previous eBird lists for BCR this fall and winter, but they are regular here. In previous winters the large Scaup flock often was at LC, but it seems that this winter the scaups have stayed at BCR, always a trickier place to stop! And if you are driving north on Aviation it is much harder to pull over. Best to head south on the road and pull off onto the exit to Durham, close to the dam.
Date: 1/1/20 7:39 am From: Brian Bockhahn (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Cumberland County NC results
The ELEVENTH “revived” Cumberland County CBC was held on December 19, 2019
under clear skies, light winds and cool temperatures from 27-43 degrees.
12 counters in seven parties tallied our fourth highest 88 species (average
of 81) and 4,598 total birds (average 7,514) led by 472 American Crow, 425
Common Grackle and 297 European Starling. The weather and season has been
more like late November, so no major blackbird or winter flocks, few
irruptive’s around and the ducks just aren’t here in good numbers yet,
trend across the counts so far.
Goodies include three parties reporting our third Great Egrets, with a
total of 4 on the day. Two parties with Bobwhite is nice, not always
reliable on this count Black Vultures were reported, all three nuthatches,
all three common wrens, and impressive was an OCTET or EIGHTSOME of
Woodpecker species!!
We set several record highs: 4 Great Egret, 4 Bald Eagle, 472 American
Crow, 17 Winter Wren, 13 Brown Thrasher, 6 Palm Warbler, 67 Pine Warbler
(?), 132 Northern Cardinal, 105 Eastern Meadowlark.
And of course some record lows: 2 Bufflehead, 6 Hooded Merganser, 7
Yellow-bellied Sapsucker, 40 Red-winged Blackbird.
Misses include a list Ring-necked Duck, White-crowned Sparrow, Brown-headed
Cowbird and Purple Finch
Mark your calendars for next year’s count Thursday December 17, 2020
Date: 1/1/20 7:04 am From: <badgerboy...> Subject: Upper Yadkin CBC (Wilkes Co.) this Sunday
Anyone is welcome to join in the CBC on Sunday, but we could particularly use someone willing to lead a party or cover area independently, as it appears that much of the count circle will go un-birded.
The count includes much of the wilkesboro area, including Kerr Scott reservoir, YMCA Camp Harrison and its lake, the lakes at Woodfield, The Yadkin River Greenway at several spots including Mulberry Fields, Lowe's Park at Riversedge, Smoot Park, Jefferson Turnpike; Wilkes Community College, and much more.
Date: 1/1/20 5:20 am From: Christopher Hill (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Litchfield-Pawleys CBC and G-C Kinglets
Various parties are still reporting their results from the Litchfield-Pawleys Island Christmas Bird Count conducted day before yesterday. We don’t have any earth-shattering rarites to report yet, but a bunch of “good” birds for us, like Long-tailed Duck, Sedge Wren, Prairie Warbler, Northern Bobwhite, and Purple Sandpiper and Piping Plover (the last three have been much harder to find this past decade). We’re sitting at 151 species now and expect that to climb when the last couple areas report.
But something odd popped up and I thought I’d mention it in case there’s something going on region wide: of all the parties reporting so far, nobody had a single Golden-crowned Kinglet, and that’s not a bird we “ever” miss (once, in the 48 years this count has existed). Here are our GCKI totals for the last ten years:
63 36 34 81 115 154 45 27 73 21
So even if the not-yet-reporting parties found a couple, this is so not normal (for us) that it looks like more than a random blip.
Maybe something to keep an eye on as your own counts get finished and compiled.
Now go out there and get those year lists started! [obfirstbird: insistent Carolina Wren heard through the living room window]
Date: 12/31/19 6:45 pm From: Harry LeGrand (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Re: 2 yellow rails Pea Island CBC
Sounds like Spartina patens to me. Are you familiar with it? That’s where Yellow Rails and Black Rails prefer to be in winter.
Harry LeGrand
Sent from my iPhone
> On Dec 31, 2019, at 9:26 PM, <badgerboy...> wrote:
>
> On Saturday on the Peas Island CBC, Al H. and I had the extraordinary experience of flushing 2 separate Yellow Rails in about half an hour in spots separated by about 100 yards, in the vast marshes on the north end of Pea Island. The habitat was in the high marsh--the major species was a very clumpy, lush, thick grass, but not very tall, with supple round stems that seemed so soft it could easily make a good pillow, and so thick that no bird or other animal could ever be found under it. I'm unfamiliar with the species but it doesn't look like either Spartina, or Distichlis, and it certainly is NOT Juncus, but there were sparse stands of Juncus mixed in and also some low woody vegetation in patches.
>
> Both rails popped up fairly close in front of us and flew up to about eye level and away about 25 feet before settling back into the dense vegetation. We had pretty good views of the white patches on the interior rear of the wing that penetrated fairly deep into the wing, and good views of the overall size and stubby bill, but the sun angle, motion of the birds, and naked eye only views, prevented us from seeing the expected bright yellow streaks. It would have been great to get bins on a stationary bird but I guess we'll have to take what we can get.
>
> Guy McGrane, Deep Gap, NC
>
>
>
Date: 12/31/19 6:27 pm From: <badgerboy...> Subject: 2 yellow rails Pea Island CBC
On Saturday on the Peas Island CBC, Al H. and I had the extraordinary experience of flushing 2 separate Yellow Rails in about half an hour in spots separated by about 100 yards, in the vast marshes on the north end of Pea Island. The habitat was in the high marsh--the major species was a very clumpy, lush, thick grass, but not very tall, with supple round stems that seemed so soft it could easily make a good pillow, and so thick that no bird or other animal could ever be found under it. I'm unfamiliar with the species but it doesn't look like either Spartina, or Distichlis, and it certainly is NOT Juncus, but there were sparse stands of Juncus mixed in and also some low woody vegetation in patches.
Both rails popped up fairly close in front of us and flew up to about eye level and away about 25 feet before settling back into the dense vegetation. We had pretty good views of the white patches on the interior rear of the wing that penetrated fairly deep into the wing, and good views of the overall size and stubby bill, but the sun angle, motion of the birds, and naked eye only views, prevented us from seeing the expected bright yellow streaks. It would have been great to get bins on a stationary bird but I guess we'll have to take what we can get.
DR. BILL HILTON JR., Executive Director
Hilton Pond Center for Piedmont Natural History
1432 DeVinney Road, York, South Carolina 29745 USA
office & cell (803) 684-5852
The mission of Hilton Pond Center for Piedmont Natural History is "to conserve plants, animals, habitats, and other natural components of the Piedmont Region of the eastern United States through observation, scientific study, and education for students of all ages.
"Never trust a person too lazy to get up for sunrise or too busy to watch the sunset." BHjr.
Data quality and coverage quality are issues in all "citizen science" endeavors.
There are two general approaches to handling these issues.
First, some programs spend a lot of effort on training to bring volunteers up to acceptable performance level, and a lot of effort tweaking protocols to better accommodate the skills, capabilities, and interests of their volunteers.
Second, others dial back their expectations and limit their analyses to questions whose answers are insensitive to the biases inherent in the raw data. For example, if someone wanted to map seasonal distribution and abundance of relatively common birds using ebird data, they might want to only use data from checklists reported as complete. If someone wanted to use ebird data to map occurrences of casual or rare species, they would be well-advised to develop algorithms to do a lot of hand work to identify and correct for clusters of reports that pertain to the same individual birds. Doing this would also clean up the maps referred to earlier in this thread.
A third approach which is used all too often is to pretend that if huge enough datasets are assembled, the effects of the inherent biases such as pointed out by Nate will wash out. This is seldom true, and needs to be avoided.
This is an interesting thread and raises issues I have always wondered about with regard to data quality:
1: False Impression of Density of Rare Birds
Perhaps research could develop an adjustment factor that is a function of how close the sitings are, the time differences. and the species plus other factors. Thesis Project utilizing the GPS information in E-Bird?
2. How well does the editing work? Seems to me it creates an undercount bias because all species do not get the same level of scrutiny (rare birds get more review).
3. Reporting bias- how many birds are not reported because of the trouble of dealing with the editors? This strikes me as an undercount bias. How many rare birds are rejected because of editor bias? Reminds me of Justice Sanders saying he heard the Ivory Bill when he needed it to help
get Congaree National Park.
4. Reporting Back up
Seems to me that without a photo, it is hard to win an argument with an editor over a rare bird. I just bird with an IPhone and its camera and binoculars.
5. Perhaps credibility factors could be assigned to age, experience, etc.
And on and on. Sorry for long post. I assume the ornithologists on this list know what has been studied. Lots of testable hypotheses.
Seems to me a statistical framework would be more appropriate since dealing with imperfect information.
Parkin Hunter
Columbia, Garden City Beach and Ridgeway SC
Sent from my iPhone
> On Dec 31, 2019, at 2:31 PM, Nate Dias (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> wrote:
>
> Thanks Steve,
>
> But to clarify - I wasn't so much talking about people who under-count
> or estimate "low". Rather, it's people who willfully reduce their
> original count/estimate by significant amounts.
>
> From talking to them, the thinking seems to be that it is a much
> greater "sin" to over-report than under-report - so they radically
> under-report ON PURPOSE, consistently. To me, this seems different
> than what you and the 1st eBird article mention. Something along the
> lines of "better to be a few thousand birds low, than to risk being
> couple of dozen birds high".
>
> Nathan Dias - Charleston, SC
>
> --
> flickr.com/photos/offshorebirder2/
>
>
>> On Tue, Dec 31, 2019 at 2:08 PM "Shultz, Steven" <carolinabirds...> wrote:
>>
>> As someone who submitted a single hotspot checklist with more than 100,000 birds recently (on the Mattamuskeet NWR CBC... 5 species were each in the 5 digits) I can empathize with some of the things Nate shares. I consistently tend to undercount, and having an experienced/trained counter along with me helped to "normalize" some of my numbers to be more accurate.
>>
>> It may seem like counting is something we stop learning to do after kindergarten, but it really is something that can be learned/improved with effort.
>>
>> The links below provide some introduction. The FWS link also has a "game" that lets one practice!
>>
>> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__ebird.org_news_counting-2D101_&d=DwIGaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=B0ON6QIM3WmsPZr7ogt2DRvZmd8g8C9xmdNtpQGlR_8&s=AkWyRD7af8PBLbDrqoPAwlCKEfo4p4NRpGLkH4QZ4f4&e= >>
>> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__ebird.org_news_counting-2D201&d=DwIGaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=B0ON6QIM3WmsPZr7ogt2DRvZmd8g8C9xmdNtpQGlR_8&s=Zy-ag9wxTo_PpH2joEZ2io60Nq9aaRdvHfuzwxJo69A&e= >>
>> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.fws.gov_waterfowlsurveys_forms_counting.jsp-3Fmenu-3Dcounting&d=DwIGaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=B0ON6QIM3WmsPZr7ogt2DRvZmd8g8C9xmdNtpQGlR_8&s=plIbHP__71Fbqquoq1F_HD7zC2Qb_WLqx0SZxtNajoM&e= >>
>> Are you an under counter or an over counter??
>>
>>
>> Steve Shultz
>> RTP NC
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: <carolinabirds-request...> [mailto:<carolinabirds-request...>] On Behalf Of Nate Dias
>> Sent: Tuesday, December 31, 2019 1:31 PM
>> To: CarolinaBirds
>> Subject: Re: sightings
>>
>> This email is from an external source - exercise caution regarding links and attachments.
>>
>>
>> Brian and Dwayne are correct - and that implies the UNDERLYING DATA
>> behind the graphs and maps is skewed by "observer effort directed at
>> birds of interest". -- Not to mention birders' tendency to eBird
>> every single rarity they see - but not every trash bird.
>>
>> And how many birders are going to rush out in the next few days (after
>> midnight January 1) to see the same rare stakeout birds they saw this
>> week, in order to get them in their total for the "eBird Top 100"
>> list as quickly as possible?
>>
>> Another thing that is puzzling about how people use eBird is the
>> chronic tendency of so many birders to under-report numbers. MANY is
>> the time I bird right next to people, see exactly the same birds and
>> flocks, we often talk about and agree upon numbers - then I see their
>> checklist which reports 1/2, 1/3, or less of the numbers actually
>> seen. When I ask them about it (sometimes showing them a single
>> photo with more individuals than they reported) they admit to severe
>> under-reporting because "I wanted to be sure and submit conservative
>> numbers".
>>
>> Many say they estimate and then reduce by half or a third just to be
>> "safe". Weird but true. As a result, I forbid people to submit
>> eBird checklists when they tag along on my ISS shorebird surveys
>> because their habitually reporting fractions of the ACTUAL shorebird
>> numbers calls into question the official ISS submissions (which now
>> feed into eBird) and cannot be justified by any logical means.
>>
>> People who go to the conscious effort of eBirding purposely incorrect
>> numbers is baffling yet it happens pretty often in my experience.
>>
>> Nathan Dias - Charleston, SC
>>
>> --
>> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.flickr.com_photos_offshorebirder2_&d=DwIFaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=DD_JcPD8rIzwDm-BlGwGQ7naxzlnqQxrug1nYIpk7iU&s=kXhDf6jDGPYmBSdcWS_0HjO-bLi_sLZmoJvbIDJ94yI&e= >>
>>
>> "These days I prefer to hunt with a camera. A good photograph demands
>> more skill from the hunter, better nerves and more patience than the
>> rifle shot." -- Bror Blixen
>>
>>> On Tue, Dec 31, 2019 at 12:47 PM Dwayne Martin <carolinabirds...> wrote:
>>>
>>> I totally agree with that. If you look at Catawba County's list you would think Allen's Hummingbird was a given here in November since about 175 people saw one here. I've always thought this was a flaw in eBird's graphs.
>>>
>>> Dwayne
>>> *************
>>> J. Dwayne Martin
>>> Hickory, NC
>>> <redxbill...>
>>>
>>>
>>> Catawba County Park Ranger
>>> Riverbend Park - Conover, NC
>>> <jdmartin...>
>>> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.catawbacountync.gov_depts_parks_&d=DwIFaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=DD_JcPD8rIzwDm-BlGwGQ7naxzlnqQxrug1nYIpk7iU&s=f4YTa2e0S19vVLAR2iOugig6hupRYgRzxnhiMYo9aOE&e= >>> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.weatherlink.com_user_riverbendpark&d=DwIFaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=DD_JcPD8rIzwDm-BlGwGQ7naxzlnqQxrug1nYIpk7iU&s=cfueopNZVrKFYwKvaYfdqAVUeIdy7WkSCP4x5Hm9FFM&e= >>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Tue, Dec 31, 2019 at 12:14 PM Brian Patteson <carolinabirds...> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> I agree. It’s actually better than you might think it might be considering the scale of it on a county basis. One issue that is a bit misleading is how the repeated observation of a rarity makes it seem more probable than it actually is. I think the projected odds on the bar graphs and the maps are skewed considerably by observer effort directed at birds of interest.
>>>>
>>>> Brian Patteson
>>>> Hatteras, NC
>>>>
>>>> On Dec 31, 2019, at 9:18 AM, Norman Budnitz (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> It's a volunteer workforce, and it takes effort to keep up-to-date. Kudos to those who do that work. When I think of how far eBird has come and how quickly, I'm very impressed.
>>>>
>>>> On Tue, Dec 31, 2019 at 9:06 AM Brian Patteson <patteson1...> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> There are a lot of places where the filters could use some tweaking. Definitely a work in progress. We run up against it frequently on our pelagic trips getting flagged for high numbers.
>>>>>
>>>>> Brian Patteson
>>>>> Hatteras
>>>>>
>>>>> On Dec 31, 2019, at 8:07 AM, Norman Budnitz (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Aha. Thanks for that clarification.
>>>>>
>>>>> On Tue, Dec 31, 2019 at 8:02 AM Kent Fiala <carolinabirds...> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> There are two different reasons why eBird may ask for details, and people often don't recognize the difference. Detail requests are controlled by something called a "filter" which specifies a cutoff number of individuals for that species on that date. So-called "notable" or "rare" species have a cutoff of 0 and for such species eBird wants details confirming the identification. For species that have a non-zero cutoff, eBird isn't so much interested in the identification but in whether you have an accurate count--explain how you counted. You have to read carefully, but the request for details is worded slightly differently for the two cases.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> In the case of Anhinga at Mattamuskeet, the filter cutoff is 1, so what eBird was really asking was not if you identified it correctly, but if you were really sure you had two. I know it sounds silly when worded that way, but it's just kind of trying to heighten your awareness that maybe you are reporting something kind of unusual and that warrants a few words of explanation.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The "notable sightings" application on the CBC website only reports species for which the filter cutoff is 0, so no reports for Anhingas at Mattamuskeet.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Kent Fiala
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On 12/31/2019 7:44 AM, Norman Budnitz (via carolinabirds Mailing List) wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I'm curious to know how notable sightings are chosen for display on the Carolina Bird Club website. A particular example: We found 2 Anhingas on the Mattamuskeet CBC December 29th. eBird asked for details and I supplied 2 photos for documentation. The birds also required details from the compiler and photos were sent to her. And yet those birds don't show up in the 'sightings' list. Should I have done something else? Or are Anhingas not unusual enough at this time of year to be included?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> This is not a complaint. I'm just curious to know how the system works.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> Norm Budnitz
>>>>>> Orange County
>>>>>> North Carolina
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> Norm Budnitz
>>>>> Orange County
>>>>> North Carolina
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Norm Budnitz
>>>> Orange County
>>>> North Carolina
>>>>
>>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.flickr.com_photos_offshorebirder2_&d=DwIFaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=DD_JcPD8rIzwDm-BlGwGQ7naxzlnqQxrug1nYIpk7iU&s=kXhDf6jDGPYmBSdcWS_0HjO-bLi_sLZmoJvbIDJ94yI&e= >>
>>
>> "These days I prefer to hunt with a camera. A good photograph demands
>> more skill from the hunter, better nerves and more patience than the
>> rifle shot." -- Bror Blixen
Date: 12/31/19 1:42 pm From: Christopher Hill (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Re: Yellow-throated Warbler - Simpsonville
> On Dec 31, 2019, at 4:35 PM, Caroline Harvey <carolinabirds...> wrote:
>
> I had one of these feeding at my suet this afternoon.
> Late record for the upstate.
This is an interesting thread and raises issues I have always wondered about with regard to data quality:
1: False Impression of Density of Rare Birds
Perhaps research could develop an adjustment factor that is a function of how close the sitings are, the time differences. and the species plus other factors. Thesis Project utilizing the GPS information in E-Bird?
2. How well does the editing work? Seems to me it creates an undercount bias because all species do not get the same level of scrutiny (rare birds get more review).
3. Reporting bias- how many birds are not reported because of the trouble of dealing with the editors? This strikes me as an undercount bias. How many rare birds are rejected because of editor bias? Reminds me of Justice Sanders saying he heard the Ivory Bill when he needed it to help
get Congaree National Park.
4. Reporting Back up
Seems to me that without a photo, it is hard to win an argument with an editor over a rare bird. I just bird with an IPhone and its camera and binoculars.
5. Perhaps credibility factors could be assigned to age, experience, etc.
And on and on. Sorry for long post. I assume the ornithologists on this list know what has been studied. Lots of testable hypotheses.
Seems to me a statistical framework would be more appropriate since dealing with imperfect information.
Parkin Hunter
Columbia, Garden City Beach and Ridgeway SC
Sent from my iPhone
> On Dec 31, 2019, at 2:31 PM, Nate Dias (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> wrote:
>
> Thanks Steve,
>
> But to clarify - I wasn't so much talking about people who under-count
> or estimate "low". Rather, it's people who willfully reduce their
> original count/estimate by significant amounts.
>
> From talking to them, the thinking seems to be that it is a much
> greater "sin" to over-report than under-report - so they radically
> under-report ON PURPOSE, consistently. To me, this seems different
> than what you and the 1st eBird article mention. Something along the
> lines of "better to be a few thousand birds low, than to risk being
> couple of dozen birds high".
>
> Nathan Dias - Charleston, SC
>
> --
> flickr.com/photos/offshorebirder2/
>
>
>> On Tue, Dec 31, 2019 at 2:08 PM "Shultz, Steven" <carolinabirds...> wrote:
>>
>> As someone who submitted a single hotspot checklist with more than 100,000 birds recently (on the Mattamuskeet NWR CBC... 5 species were each in the 5 digits) I can empathize with some of the things Nate shares. I consistently tend to undercount, and having an experienced/trained counter along with me helped to "normalize" some of my numbers to be more accurate.
>>
>> It may seem like counting is something we stop learning to do after kindergarten, but it really is something that can be learned/improved with effort.
>>
>> The links below provide some introduction. The FWS link also has a "game" that lets one practice!
>>
>> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__ebird.org_news_counting-2D101_&d=DwIGaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=B0ON6QIM3WmsPZr7ogt2DRvZmd8g8C9xmdNtpQGlR_8&s=AkWyRD7af8PBLbDrqoPAwlCKEfo4p4NRpGLkH4QZ4f4&e= >>
>> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__ebird.org_news_counting-2D201&d=DwIGaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=B0ON6QIM3WmsPZr7ogt2DRvZmd8g8C9xmdNtpQGlR_8&s=Zy-ag9wxTo_PpH2joEZ2io60Nq9aaRdvHfuzwxJo69A&e= >>
>> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.fws.gov_waterfowlsurveys_forms_counting.jsp-3Fmenu-3Dcounting&d=DwIGaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=B0ON6QIM3WmsPZr7ogt2DRvZmd8g8C9xmdNtpQGlR_8&s=plIbHP__71Fbqquoq1F_HD7zC2Qb_WLqx0SZxtNajoM&e= >>
>> Are you an under counter or an over counter??
>>
>>
>> Steve Shultz
>> RTP NC
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: <carolinabirds-request...> [mailto:<carolinabirds-request...>] On Behalf Of Nate Dias
>> Sent: Tuesday, December 31, 2019 1:31 PM
>> To: CarolinaBirds
>> Subject: Re: sightings
>>
>> This email is from an external source - exercise caution regarding links and attachments.
>>
>>
>> Brian and Dwayne are correct - and that implies the UNDERLYING DATA
>> behind the graphs and maps is skewed by "observer effort directed at
>> birds of interest". -- Not to mention birders' tendency to eBird
>> every single rarity they see - but not every trash bird.
>>
>> And how many birders are going to rush out in the next few days (after
>> midnight January 1) to see the same rare stakeout birds they saw this
>> week, in order to get them in their total for the "eBird Top 100"
>> list as quickly as possible?
>>
>> Another thing that is puzzling about how people use eBird is the
>> chronic tendency of so many birders to under-report numbers. MANY is
>> the time I bird right next to people, see exactly the same birds and
>> flocks, we often talk about and agree upon numbers - then I see their
>> checklist which reports 1/2, 1/3, or less of the numbers actually
>> seen. When I ask them about it (sometimes showing them a single
>> photo with more individuals than they reported) they admit to severe
>> under-reporting because "I wanted to be sure and submit conservative
>> numbers".
>>
>> Many say they estimate and then reduce by half or a third just to be
>> "safe". Weird but true. As a result, I forbid people to submit
>> eBird checklists when they tag along on my ISS shorebird surveys
>> because their habitually reporting fractions of the ACTUAL shorebird
>> numbers calls into question the official ISS submissions (which now
>> feed into eBird) and cannot be justified by any logical means.
>>
>> People who go to the conscious effort of eBirding purposely incorrect
>> numbers is baffling yet it happens pretty often in my experience.
>>
>> Nathan Dias - Charleston, SC
>>
>> --
>> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.flickr.com_photos_offshorebirder2_&d=DwIFaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=DD_JcPD8rIzwDm-BlGwGQ7naxzlnqQxrug1nYIpk7iU&s=kXhDf6jDGPYmBSdcWS_0HjO-bLi_sLZmoJvbIDJ94yI&e= >>
>>
>> "These days I prefer to hunt with a camera. A good photograph demands
>> more skill from the hunter, better nerves and more patience than the
>> rifle shot." -- Bror Blixen
>>
>>> On Tue, Dec 31, 2019 at 12:47 PM Dwayne Martin <carolinabirds...> wrote:
>>>
>>> I totally agree with that. If you look at Catawba County's list you would think Allen's Hummingbird was a given here in November since about 175 people saw one here. I've always thought this was a flaw in eBird's graphs.
>>>
>>> Dwayne
>>> *************
>>> J. Dwayne Martin
>>> Hickory, NC
>>> <redxbill...>
>>>
>>>
>>> Catawba County Park Ranger
>>> Riverbend Park - Conover, NC
>>> <jdmartin...>
>>> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.catawbacountync.gov_depts_parks_&d=DwIFaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=DD_JcPD8rIzwDm-BlGwGQ7naxzlnqQxrug1nYIpk7iU&s=f4YTa2e0S19vVLAR2iOugig6hupRYgRzxnhiMYo9aOE&e= >>> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.weatherlink.com_user_riverbendpark&d=DwIFaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=DD_JcPD8rIzwDm-BlGwGQ7naxzlnqQxrug1nYIpk7iU&s=cfueopNZVrKFYwKvaYfdqAVUeIdy7WkSCP4x5Hm9FFM&e= >>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Tue, Dec 31, 2019 at 12:14 PM Brian Patteson <carolinabirds...> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> I agree. It’s actually better than you might think it might be considering the scale of it on a county basis. One issue that is a bit misleading is how the repeated observation of a rarity makes it seem more probable than it actually is. I think the projected odds on the bar graphs and the maps are skewed considerably by observer effort directed at birds of interest.
>>>>
>>>> Brian Patteson
>>>> Hatteras, NC
>>>>
>>>> On Dec 31, 2019, at 9:18 AM, Norman Budnitz (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> It's a volunteer workforce, and it takes effort to keep up-to-date. Kudos to those who do that work. When I think of how far eBird has come and how quickly, I'm very impressed.
>>>>
>>>> On Tue, Dec 31, 2019 at 9:06 AM Brian Patteson <patteson1...> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> There are a lot of places where the filters could use some tweaking. Definitely a work in progress. We run up against it frequently on our pelagic trips getting flagged for high numbers.
>>>>>
>>>>> Brian Patteson
>>>>> Hatteras
>>>>>
>>>>> On Dec 31, 2019, at 8:07 AM, Norman Budnitz (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Aha. Thanks for that clarification.
>>>>>
>>>>> On Tue, Dec 31, 2019 at 8:02 AM Kent Fiala <carolinabirds...> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> There are two different reasons why eBird may ask for details, and people often don't recognize the difference. Detail requests are controlled by something called a "filter" which specifies a cutoff number of individuals for that species on that date. So-called "notable" or "rare" species have a cutoff of 0 and for such species eBird wants details confirming the identification. For species that have a non-zero cutoff, eBird isn't so much interested in the identification but in whether you have an accurate count--explain how you counted. You have to read carefully, but the request for details is worded slightly differently for the two cases.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> In the case of Anhinga at Mattamuskeet, the filter cutoff is 1, so what eBird was really asking was not if you identified it correctly, but if you were really sure you had two. I know it sounds silly when worded that way, but it's just kind of trying to heighten your awareness that maybe you are reporting something kind of unusual and that warrants a few words of explanation.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The "notable sightings" application on the CBC website only reports species for which the filter cutoff is 0, so no reports for Anhingas at Mattamuskeet.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Kent Fiala
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On 12/31/2019 7:44 AM, Norman Budnitz (via carolinabirds Mailing List) wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I'm curious to know how notable sightings are chosen for display on the Carolina Bird Club website. A particular example: We found 2 Anhingas on the Mattamuskeet CBC December 29th. eBird asked for details and I supplied 2 photos for documentation. The birds also required details from the compiler and photos were sent to her. And yet those birds don't show up in the 'sightings' list. Should I have done something else? Or are Anhingas not unusual enough at this time of year to be included?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> This is not a complaint. I'm just curious to know how the system works.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> Norm Budnitz
>>>>>> Orange County
>>>>>> North Carolina
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> Norm Budnitz
>>>>> Orange County
>>>>> North Carolina
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Norm Budnitz
>>>> Orange County
>>>> North Carolina
>>>>
>>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.flickr.com_photos_offshorebirder2_&d=DwIFaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=DD_JcPD8rIzwDm-BlGwGQ7naxzlnqQxrug1nYIpk7iU&s=kXhDf6jDGPYmBSdcWS_0HjO-bLi_sLZmoJvbIDJ94yI&e= >>
>>
>> "These days I prefer to hunt with a camera. A good photograph demands
>> more skill from the hunter, better nerves and more patience than the
>> rifle shot." -- Bror Blixen
Date: 12/31/19 11:41 am From: Harry LeGrand (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Re: sightings
Thanks, Paul. I pretended to start an eBird list, followed your instructions, and indeed I deleted several lists I had not submitted, all with 0 species but still in my checklist queue. Not knowing how to get rid of them.
It’s that damned “swipe left” thing! If you aren’t familiar with swiping left or right on your smartphones, then you’d never get this tricky but key move!
Harry LeGrand
Sent from my iPhone
> On Dec 31, 2019, at 2:30 PM, Nate Dias (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> wrote:
>
> Thanks Steve,
>
> But to clarify - I wasn't so much talking about people who under-count
> or estimate "low". Rather, it's people who willfully reduce their
> original count/estimate by significant amounts.
>
> From talking to them, the thinking seems to be that it is a much
> greater "sin" to over-report than under-report - so they radically
> under-report ON PURPOSE, consistently. To me, this seems different
> than what you and the 1st eBird article mention. Something along the
> lines of "better to be a few thousand birds low, than to risk being
> couple of dozen birds high".
>
> Nathan Dias - Charleston, SC
>
> --
> flickr.com/photos/offshorebirder2/
>
>
>> On Tue, Dec 31, 2019 at 2:08 PM "Shultz, Steven" <carolinabirds...> wrote:
>>
>> As someone who submitted a single hotspot checklist with more than 100,000 birds recently (on the Mattamuskeet NWR CBC... 5 species were each in the 5 digits) I can empathize with some of the things Nate shares. I consistently tend to undercount, and having an experienced/trained counter along with me helped to "normalize" some of my numbers to be more accurate.
>>
>> It may seem like counting is something we stop learning to do after kindergarten, but it really is something that can be learned/improved with effort.
>>
>> The links below provide some introduction. The FWS link also has a "game" that lets one practice!
>>
>> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__ebird.org_news_counting-2D101_&d=DwIGaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=B0ON6QIM3WmsPZr7ogt2DRvZmd8g8C9xmdNtpQGlR_8&s=AkWyRD7af8PBLbDrqoPAwlCKEfo4p4NRpGLkH4QZ4f4&e= >>
>> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__ebird.org_news_counting-2D201&d=DwIGaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=B0ON6QIM3WmsPZr7ogt2DRvZmd8g8C9xmdNtpQGlR_8&s=Zy-ag9wxTo_PpH2joEZ2io60Nq9aaRdvHfuzwxJo69A&e= >>
>> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.fws.gov_waterfowlsurveys_forms_counting.jsp-3Fmenu-3Dcounting&d=DwIGaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=B0ON6QIM3WmsPZr7ogt2DRvZmd8g8C9xmdNtpQGlR_8&s=plIbHP__71Fbqquoq1F_HD7zC2Qb_WLqx0SZxtNajoM&e= >>
>> Are you an under counter or an over counter??
>>
>>
>> Steve Shultz
>> RTP NC
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: <carolinabirds-request...> [mailto:<carolinabirds-request...>] On Behalf Of Nate Dias
>> Sent: Tuesday, December 31, 2019 1:31 PM
>> To: CarolinaBirds
>> Subject: Re: sightings
>>
>> This email is from an external source - exercise caution regarding links and attachments.
>>
>>
>> Brian and Dwayne are correct - and that implies the UNDERLYING DATA
>> behind the graphs and maps is skewed by "observer effort directed at
>> birds of interest". -- Not to mention birders' tendency to eBird
>> every single rarity they see - but not every trash bird.
>>
>> And how many birders are going to rush out in the next few days (after
>> midnight January 1) to see the same rare stakeout birds they saw this
>> week, in order to get them in their total for the "eBird Top 100"
>> list as quickly as possible?
>>
>> Another thing that is puzzling about how people use eBird is the
>> chronic tendency of so many birders to under-report numbers. MANY is
>> the time I bird right next to people, see exactly the same birds and
>> flocks, we often talk about and agree upon numbers - then I see their
>> checklist which reports 1/2, 1/3, or less of the numbers actually
>> seen. When I ask them about it (sometimes showing them a single
>> photo with more individuals than they reported) they admit to severe
>> under-reporting because "I wanted to be sure and submit conservative
>> numbers".
>>
>> Many say they estimate and then reduce by half or a third just to be
>> "safe". Weird but true. As a result, I forbid people to submit
>> eBird checklists when they tag along on my ISS shorebird surveys
>> because their habitually reporting fractions of the ACTUAL shorebird
>> numbers calls into question the official ISS submissions (which now
>> feed into eBird) and cannot be justified by any logical means.
>>
>> People who go to the conscious effort of eBirding purposely incorrect
>> numbers is baffling yet it happens pretty often in my experience.
>>
>> Nathan Dias - Charleston, SC
>>
>> --
>> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.flickr.com_photos_offshorebirder2_&d=DwIFaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=DD_JcPD8rIzwDm-BlGwGQ7naxzlnqQxrug1nYIpk7iU&s=kXhDf6jDGPYmBSdcWS_0HjO-bLi_sLZmoJvbIDJ94yI&e= >>
>>
>> "These days I prefer to hunt with a camera. A good photograph demands
>> more skill from the hunter, better nerves and more patience than the
>> rifle shot." -- Bror Blixen
>>
>>> On Tue, Dec 31, 2019 at 12:47 PM Dwayne Martin <carolinabirds...> wrote:
>>>
>>> I totally agree with that. If you look at Catawba County's list you would think Allen's Hummingbird was a given here in November since about 175 people saw one here. I've always thought this was a flaw in eBird's graphs.
>>>
>>> Dwayne
>>> *************
>>> J. Dwayne Martin
>>> Hickory, NC
>>> <redxbill...>
>>>
>>>
>>> Catawba County Park Ranger
>>> Riverbend Park - Conover, NC
>>> <jdmartin...>
>>> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.catawbacountync.gov_depts_parks_&d=DwIFaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=DD_JcPD8rIzwDm-BlGwGQ7naxzlnqQxrug1nYIpk7iU&s=f4YTa2e0S19vVLAR2iOugig6hupRYgRzxnhiMYo9aOE&e= >>> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.weatherlink.com_user_riverbendpark&d=DwIFaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=DD_JcPD8rIzwDm-BlGwGQ7naxzlnqQxrug1nYIpk7iU&s=cfueopNZVrKFYwKvaYfdqAVUeIdy7WkSCP4x5Hm9FFM&e= >>>
>>>
>>>
>>>> On Tue, Dec 31, 2019 at 12:14 PM Brian Patteson <carolinabirds...> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> I agree. It’s actually better than you might think it might be considering the scale of it on a county basis. One issue that is a bit misleading is how the repeated observation of a rarity makes it seem more probable than it actually is. I think the projected odds on the bar graphs and the maps are skewed considerably by observer effort directed at birds of interest.
>>>>
>>>> Brian Patteson
>>>> Hatteras, NC
>>>>
>>>> On Dec 31, 2019, at 9:18 AM, Norman Budnitz (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> It's a volunteer workforce, and it takes effort to keep up-to-date. Kudos to those who do that work. When I think of how far eBird has come and how quickly, I'm very impressed.
>>>>
>>>>> On Tue, Dec 31, 2019 at 9:06 AM Brian Patteson <patteson1...> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> There are a lot of places where the filters could use some tweaking. Definitely a work in progress. We run up against it frequently on our pelagic trips getting flagged for high numbers.
>>>>>
>>>>> Brian Patteson
>>>>> Hatteras
>>>>>
>>>>> On Dec 31, 2019, at 8:07 AM, Norman Budnitz (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Aha. Thanks for that clarification.
>>>>>
>>>>>> On Tue, Dec 31, 2019 at 8:02 AM Kent Fiala <carolinabirds...> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> There are two different reasons why eBird may ask for details, and people often don't recognize the difference. Detail requests are controlled by something called a "filter" which specifies a cutoff number of individuals for that species on that date. So-called "notable" or "rare" species have a cutoff of 0 and for such species eBird wants details confirming the identification. For species that have a non-zero cutoff, eBird isn't so much interested in the identification but in whether you have an accurate count--explain how you counted. You have to read carefully, but the request for details is worded slightly differently for the two cases.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> In the case of Anhinga at Mattamuskeet, the filter cutoff is 1, so what eBird was really asking was not if you identified it correctly, but if you were really sure you had two. I know it sounds silly when worded that way, but it's just kind of trying to heighten your awareness that maybe you are reporting something kind of unusual and that warrants a few words of explanation.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The "notable sightings" application on the CBC website only reports species for which the filter cutoff is 0, so no reports for Anhingas at Mattamuskeet.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Kent Fiala
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On 12/31/2019 7:44 AM, Norman Budnitz (via carolinabirds Mailing List) wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I'm curious to know how notable sightings are chosen for display on the Carolina Bird Club website. A particular example: We found 2 Anhingas on the Mattamuskeet CBC December 29th. eBird asked for details and I supplied 2 photos for documentation. The birds also required details from the compiler and photos were sent to her. And yet those birds don't show up in the 'sightings' list. Should I have done something else? Or are Anhingas not unusual enough at this time of year to be included?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> This is not a complaint. I'm just curious to know how the system works.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> Norm Budnitz
>>>>>> Orange County
>>>>>> North Carolina
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> Norm Budnitz
>>>>> Orange County
>>>>> North Carolina
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Norm Budnitz
>>>> Orange County
>>>> North Carolina
>>>>
>>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.flickr.com_photos_offshorebirder2_&d=DwIFaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=DD_JcPD8rIzwDm-BlGwGQ7naxzlnqQxrug1nYIpk7iU&s=kXhDf6jDGPYmBSdcWS_0HjO-bLi_sLZmoJvbIDJ94yI&e= >>
>>
>> "These days I prefer to hunt with a camera. A good photograph demands
>> more skill from the hunter, better nerves and more patience than the
>> rifle shot." -- Bror Blixen
Date: 12/31/19 11:31 am From: Nate Dias (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Re: sightings
Thanks Steve,
But to clarify - I wasn't so much talking about people who under-count
or estimate "low". Rather, it's people who willfully reduce their
original count/estimate by significant amounts.
From talking to them, the thinking seems to be that it is a much
greater "sin" to over-report than under-report - so they radically
under-report ON PURPOSE, consistently. To me, this seems different
than what you and the 1st eBird article mention. Something along the
lines of "better to be a few thousand birds low, than to risk being
couple of dozen birds high".
Nathan Dias - Charleston, SC
--
flickr.com/photos/offshorebirder2/
On Tue, Dec 31, 2019 at 2:08 PM "Shultz, Steven" <carolinabirds...> wrote:
>
> As someone who submitted a single hotspot checklist with more than 100,000 birds recently (on the Mattamuskeet NWR CBC... 5 species were each in the 5 digits) I can empathize with some of the things Nate shares. I consistently tend to undercount, and having an experienced/trained counter along with me helped to "normalize" some of my numbers to be more accurate.
>
> It may seem like counting is something we stop learning to do after kindergarten, but it really is something that can be learned/improved with effort.
>
> The links below provide some introduction. The FWS link also has a "game" that lets one practice!
>
> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__ebird.org_news_counting-2D101_&d=DwIGaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=B0ON6QIM3WmsPZr7ogt2DRvZmd8g8C9xmdNtpQGlR_8&s=AkWyRD7af8PBLbDrqoPAwlCKEfo4p4NRpGLkH4QZ4f4&e= >
> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__ebird.org_news_counting-2D201&d=DwIGaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=B0ON6QIM3WmsPZr7ogt2DRvZmd8g8C9xmdNtpQGlR_8&s=Zy-ag9wxTo_PpH2joEZ2io60Nq9aaRdvHfuzwxJo69A&e= >
> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.fws.gov_waterfowlsurveys_forms_counting.jsp-3Fmenu-3Dcounting&d=DwIGaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=B0ON6QIM3WmsPZr7ogt2DRvZmd8g8C9xmdNtpQGlR_8&s=plIbHP__71Fbqquoq1F_HD7zC2Qb_WLqx0SZxtNajoM&e= >
> Are you an under counter or an over counter??
>
>
> Steve Shultz
> RTP NC
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: <carolinabirds-request...> [mailto:<carolinabirds-request...>] On Behalf Of Nate Dias
> Sent: Tuesday, December 31, 2019 1:31 PM
> To: CarolinaBirds
> Subject: Re: sightings
>
> This email is from an external source - exercise caution regarding links and attachments.
>
>
> Brian and Dwayne are correct - and that implies the UNDERLYING DATA
> behind the graphs and maps is skewed by "observer effort directed at
> birds of interest". -- Not to mention birders' tendency to eBird
> every single rarity they see - but not every trash bird.
>
> And how many birders are going to rush out in the next few days (after
> midnight January 1) to see the same rare stakeout birds they saw this
> week, in order to get them in their total for the "eBird Top 100"
> list as quickly as possible?
>
> Another thing that is puzzling about how people use eBird is the
> chronic tendency of so many birders to under-report numbers. MANY is
> the time I bird right next to people, see exactly the same birds and
> flocks, we often talk about and agree upon numbers - then I see their
> checklist which reports 1/2, 1/3, or less of the numbers actually
> seen. When I ask them about it (sometimes showing them a single
> photo with more individuals than they reported) they admit to severe
> under-reporting because "I wanted to be sure and submit conservative
> numbers".
>
> Many say they estimate and then reduce by half or a third just to be
> "safe". Weird but true. As a result, I forbid people to submit
> eBird checklists when they tag along on my ISS shorebird surveys
> because their habitually reporting fractions of the ACTUAL shorebird
> numbers calls into question the official ISS submissions (which now
> feed into eBird) and cannot be justified by any logical means.
>
> People who go to the conscious effort of eBirding purposely incorrect
> numbers is baffling yet it happens pretty often in my experience.
>
> Nathan Dias - Charleston, SC
>
> --
> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.flickr.com_photos_offshorebirder2_&d=DwIFaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=DD_JcPD8rIzwDm-BlGwGQ7naxzlnqQxrug1nYIpk7iU&s=kXhDf6jDGPYmBSdcWS_0HjO-bLi_sLZmoJvbIDJ94yI&e= >
>
> "These days I prefer to hunt with a camera. A good photograph demands
> more skill from the hunter, better nerves and more patience than the
> rifle shot." -- Bror Blixen
>
> On Tue, Dec 31, 2019 at 12:47 PM Dwayne Martin <carolinabirds...> wrote:
> >
> > I totally agree with that. If you look at Catawba County's list you would think Allen's Hummingbird was a given here in November since about 175 people saw one here. I've always thought this was a flaw in eBird's graphs.
> >
> > Dwayne
> > *************
> > J. Dwayne Martin
> > Hickory, NC
> > <redxbill...>
> >
> >
> > Catawba County Park Ranger
> > Riverbend Park - Conover, NC
> > <jdmartin...>
> > https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.catawbacountync.gov_depts_parks_&d=DwIFaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=DD_JcPD8rIzwDm-BlGwGQ7naxzlnqQxrug1nYIpk7iU&s=f4YTa2e0S19vVLAR2iOugig6hupRYgRzxnhiMYo9aOE&e= > > https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.weatherlink.com_user_riverbendpark&d=DwIFaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=DD_JcPD8rIzwDm-BlGwGQ7naxzlnqQxrug1nYIpk7iU&s=cfueopNZVrKFYwKvaYfdqAVUeIdy7WkSCP4x5Hm9FFM&e= > >
> >
> >
> > On Tue, Dec 31, 2019 at 12:14 PM Brian Patteson <carolinabirds...> wrote:
> >>
> >> I agree. It’s actually better than you might think it might be considering the scale of it on a county basis. One issue that is a bit misleading is how the repeated observation of a rarity makes it seem more probable than it actually is. I think the projected odds on the bar graphs and the maps are skewed considerably by observer effort directed at birds of interest.
> >>
> >> Brian Patteson
> >> Hatteras, NC
> >>
> >> On Dec 31, 2019, at 9:18 AM, Norman Budnitz (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> wrote:
> >>
> >> It's a volunteer workforce, and it takes effort to keep up-to-date. Kudos to those who do that work. When I think of how far eBird has come and how quickly, I'm very impressed.
> >>
> >> On Tue, Dec 31, 2019 at 9:06 AM Brian Patteson <patteson1...> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> There are a lot of places where the filters could use some tweaking. Definitely a work in progress. We run up against it frequently on our pelagic trips getting flagged for high numbers.
> >>>
> >>> Brian Patteson
> >>> Hatteras
> >>>
> >>> On Dec 31, 2019, at 8:07 AM, Norman Budnitz (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> Aha. Thanks for that clarification.
> >>>
> >>> On Tue, Dec 31, 2019 at 8:02 AM Kent Fiala <carolinabirds...> wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>> There are two different reasons why eBird may ask for details, and people often don't recognize the difference. Detail requests are controlled by something called a "filter" which specifies a cutoff number of individuals for that species on that date. So-called "notable" or "rare" species have a cutoff of 0 and for such species eBird wants details confirming the identification. For species that have a non-zero cutoff, eBird isn't so much interested in the identification but in whether you have an accurate count--explain how you counted. You have to read carefully, but the request for details is worded slightly differently for the two cases.
> >>>>
> >>>> In the case of Anhinga at Mattamuskeet, the filter cutoff is 1, so what eBird was really asking was not if you identified it correctly, but if you were really sure you had two. I know it sounds silly when worded that way, but it's just kind of trying to heighten your awareness that maybe you are reporting something kind of unusual and that warrants a few words of explanation.
> >>>>
> >>>> The "notable sightings" application on the CBC website only reports species for which the filter cutoff is 0, so no reports for Anhingas at Mattamuskeet.
> >>>>
> >>>> Kent Fiala
> >>>>
> >>>> On 12/31/2019 7:44 AM, Norman Budnitz (via carolinabirds Mailing List) wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>> I'm curious to know how notable sightings are chosen for display on the Carolina Bird Club website. A particular example: We found 2 Anhingas on the Mattamuskeet CBC December 29th. eBird asked for details and I supplied 2 photos for documentation. The birds also required details from the compiler and photos were sent to her. And yet those birds don't show up in the 'sightings' list. Should I have done something else? Or are Anhingas not unusual enough at this time of year to be included?
> >>>>
> >>>> This is not a complaint. I'm just curious to know how the system works.
> >>>>
> >>>> --
> >>>> Norm Budnitz
> >>>> Orange County
> >>>> North Carolina
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> --
> >>> Norm Budnitz
> >>> Orange County
> >>> North Carolina
> >>>
> >>>
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >> Norm Budnitz
> >> Orange County
> >> North Carolina
> >>
> >>
>
>
> --
> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.flickr.com_photos_offshorebirder2_&d=DwIFaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=DD_JcPD8rIzwDm-BlGwGQ7naxzlnqQxrug1nYIpk7iU&s=kXhDf6jDGPYmBSdcWS_0HjO-bLi_sLZmoJvbIDJ94yI&e= >
>
> "These days I prefer to hunt with a camera. A good photograph demands
> more skill from the hunter, better nerves and more patience than the
> rifle shot." -- Bror Blixen
Date: 12/31/19 11:29 am From: Paul Glass <pag...> Subject: RE: sightings
Regarding getting out of a checklist in Ebird on IOS:
Hit the "Home" button in the upper right (little house)
Hit "Checklists" at the bottom
Swipe left on the checklist
Hit "Delete"
Hit the left arrow in the top left to get back to the Ebird home screen
Paul Glass
South Boston, VA
-----Original Message-----
From: Harry LeGrand [mailto:<carolinabirds...>]
Sent: Tuesday, December 31, 2019 12:38 PM
To: Kent Fiala; <carolinabirds...>
Subject: Re: sightings
Kent’s first response may well have answered Norm’s question, but not quite
in as simple a phrase as I mention — if your species is already on the
preset checklist you are about to complete, your “rare bird” isn’t going to
be on the CBC Sightings listing. ☹️
Harry LeGrand
Sent from my iPhone
On Dec 31, 2019, at 12:23 PM, Kent Fiala (via carolinabirds Mailing List)
<carolinabirds...> <mailto:<carolinabirds...> > wrote:
Hold on about what? This is more or less a different way of saying what I
explained before.
On Android it is quite simple to get out of a checklist. I can't answer
about iPhone.
Kent Fiala
On 12/31/2019 12:17 PM, Harry LeGrand (via carolinabirds Mailing List)
wrote:
Hold on here.
I just called up a new eBird checklist for Mattamuskeet NWR — Lake Landing,
as an example. Anhinga, surprisingly, is NOT a write-in, as a rare bird for
the area in winter. I would disagree with that. This is why your Anhinga or
2 of them, do Not show up on Sightings on the CBC website. Even one bird
would not do it.
If your bird is already showing on the eBird checklist — such as Anhinga
there for this time of year — IT WONT MAKE THE CBC SIGHTINGS. Kent’s
response had more to do with the number of birds, not presence or absence.
One thing I hate about EBird is simply getting OUT of a checklist you don’t
want to submit. They don’t have an Escape or Quit tab. I’m stuck on the
Mattamuskeet list and having trouble getting out unless i turn off my
iphone.!! I want to submit a real list for Mid-Pines Road, and I cannot
right now on my iPhone. Oy.
Harry LeGrand
Sent from my iPhone
On Dec 31, 2019, at 9:18 AM, Norman Budnitz (via carolinabirds Mailing List)
<carolinabirds...> <mailto:<carolinabirds...> > wrote:
It's a volunteer workforce, and it takes effort to keep up-to-date. Kudos
to those who do that work. When I think of how far eBird has come and how
quickly, I'm very impressed.
On Tue, Dec 31, 2019 at 9:06 AM Brian Patteson <patteson1...>
<mailto:<patteson1...> > wrote:
There are a lot of places where the filters could use some tweaking.
Definitely a work in progress. We run up against it frequently on our
pelagic trips getting flagged for high numbers.
Brian Patteson
Hatteras
On Dec 31, 2019, at 8:07 AM, Norman Budnitz (via carolinabirds Mailing List)
<carolinabirds...> <mailto:<carolinabirds...> > wrote:
There are two different reasons why eBird may ask for details, and people
often don't recognize the difference. Detail requests are controlled by
something called a "filter" which specifies a cutoff number of individuals
for that species on that date. So-called "notable" or "rare" species have a
cutoff of 0 and for such species eBird wants details confirming the
identification. For species that have a non-zero cutoff, eBird isn't so much
interested in the identification but in whether you have an accurate
count--explain how you counted. You have to read carefully, but the request
for details is worded slightly differently for the two cases.
In the case of Anhinga at Mattamuskeet, the filter cutoff is 1, so what
eBird was really asking was not if you identified it correctly, but if you
were really sure you had two. I know it sounds silly when worded that way,
but it's just kind of trying to heighten your awareness that maybe you are
reporting something kind of unusual and that warrants a few words of
explanation.
The "notable sightings" application on the CBC website only reports species
for which the filter cutoff is 0, so no reports for Anhingas at
Mattamuskeet.
Kent Fiala
On 12/31/2019 7:44 AM, Norman Budnitz (via carolinabirds Mailing List)
wrote:
I'm curious to know how notable sightings are chosen for display on the
Carolina Bird Club website. A particular example: We found 2 Anhingas on
the Mattamuskeet CBC December 29th. eBird asked for details and I supplied
2 photos for documentation. The birds also required details from the
compiler and photos were sent to her. And yet those birds don't show up in
the 'sightings' list. Should I have done something else? Or are Anhingas
not unusual enough at this time of year to be included?
This is not a complaint. I'm just curious to know how the system works.
i'm an undercounter, thought i was erring on the side of caution.
On Tue, Dec 31, 2019 at 2:08 PM "Shultz, Steven" <carolinabirds...>
wrote:
> As someone who submitted a single hotspot checklist with more than 100,000
> birds recently (on the Mattamuskeet NWR CBC... 5 species were each in the 5
> digits) I can empathize with some of the things Nate shares. I
> consistently tend to undercount, and having an experienced/trained counter
> along with me helped to "normalize" some of my numbers to be more accurate.
>
> It may seem like counting is something we stop learning to do after
> kindergarten, but it really is something that can be learned/improved with
> effort.
>
> The links below provide some introduction. The FWS link also has a "game"
> that lets one practice!
>
>
> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__ebird.org_news_counting-2D101_&d=DwIGaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=B0ON6QIM3WmsPZr7ogt2DRvZmd8g8C9xmdNtpQGlR_8&s=AkWyRD7af8PBLbDrqoPAwlCKEfo4p4NRpGLkH4QZ4f4&e= >
>
> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__ebird.org_news_counting-2D201&d=DwIGaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=B0ON6QIM3WmsPZr7ogt2DRvZmd8g8C9xmdNtpQGlR_8&s=Zy-ag9wxTo_PpH2joEZ2io60Nq9aaRdvHfuzwxJo69A&e= >
>
> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.fws.gov_waterfowlsurveys_forms_counting.jsp-3Fmenu-3Dcounting&d=DwIGaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=B0ON6QIM3WmsPZr7ogt2DRvZmd8g8C9xmdNtpQGlR_8&s=plIbHP__71Fbqquoq1F_HD7zC2Qb_WLqx0SZxtNajoM&e= >
> Are you an under counter or an over counter??
>
>
> Steve Shultz
> RTP NC
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: <carolinabirds-request...> [mailto:
> <carolinabirds-request...>] On Behalf Of Nate Dias
> Sent: Tuesday, December 31, 2019 1:31 PM
> To: CarolinaBirds
> Subject: Re: sightings
>
> This email is from an external source - exercise caution regarding links
> and attachments.
>
>
> Brian and Dwayne are correct - and that implies the UNDERLYING DATA
> behind the graphs and maps is skewed by "observer effort directed at
> birds of interest". -- Not to mention birders' tendency to eBird
> every single rarity they see - but not every trash bird.
>
> And how many birders are going to rush out in the next few days (after
> midnight January 1) to see the same rare stakeout birds they saw this
> week, in order to get them in their total for the "eBird Top 100"
> list as quickly as possible?
>
> Another thing that is puzzling about how people use eBird is the
> chronic tendency of so many birders to under-report numbers. MANY is
> the time I bird right next to people, see exactly the same birds and
> flocks, we often talk about and agree upon numbers - then I see their
> checklist which reports 1/2, 1/3, or less of the numbers actually
> seen. When I ask them about it (sometimes showing them a single
> photo with more individuals than they reported) they admit to severe
> under-reporting because "I wanted to be sure and submit conservative
> numbers".
>
> Many say they estimate and then reduce by half or a third just to be
> "safe". Weird but true. As a result, I forbid people to submit
> eBird checklists when they tag along on my ISS shorebird surveys
> because their habitually reporting fractions of the ACTUAL shorebird
> numbers calls into question the official ISS submissions (which now
> feed into eBird) and cannot be justified by any logical means.
>
> People who go to the conscious effort of eBirding purposely incorrect
> numbers is baffling yet it happens pretty often in my experience.
>
> Nathan Dias - Charleston, SC
>
> --
>
> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.flickr.com_photos_offshorebirder2_&d=DwIFaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=DD_JcPD8rIzwDm-BlGwGQ7naxzlnqQxrug1nYIpk7iU&s=kXhDf6jDGPYmBSdcWS_0HjO-bLi_sLZmoJvbIDJ94yI&e= >
>
> "These days I prefer to hunt with a camera. A good photograph demands
> more skill from the hunter, better nerves and more patience than the
> rifle shot." -- Bror Blixen
>
> On Tue, Dec 31, 2019 at 12:47 PM Dwayne Martin <carolinabirds...>
> wrote:
> >
> > I totally agree with that. If you look at Catawba County's list you
> would think Allen's Hummingbird was a given here in November since about
> 175 people saw one here. I've always thought this was a flaw in eBird's
> graphs.
> >
> > Dwayne
> > *************
> > J. Dwayne Martin
> > Hickory, NC
> > <redxbill...>
> >
> >
> > Catawba County Park Ranger
> > Riverbend Park - Conover, NC
> > <jdmartin...>
> >
> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.catawbacountync.gov_depts_parks_&d=DwIFaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=DD_JcPD8rIzwDm-BlGwGQ7naxzlnqQxrug1nYIpk7iU&s=f4YTa2e0S19vVLAR2iOugig6hupRYgRzxnhiMYo9aOE&e= > >
> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.weatherlink.com_user_riverbendpark&d=DwIFaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=DD_JcPD8rIzwDm-BlGwGQ7naxzlnqQxrug1nYIpk7iU&s=cfueopNZVrKFYwKvaYfdqAVUeIdy7WkSCP4x5Hm9FFM&e= > >
> >
> >
> > On Tue, Dec 31, 2019 at 12:14 PM Brian Patteson <carolinabirds...>
> wrote:
> >>
> >> I agree. It’s actually better than you might think it might be
> considering the scale of it on a county basis. One issue that is a bit
> misleading is how the repeated observation of a rarity makes it seem more
> probable than it actually is. I think the projected odds on the bar graphs
> and the maps are skewed considerably by observer effort directed at birds
> of interest.
> >>
> >> Brian Patteson
> >> Hatteras, NC
> >>
> >> On Dec 31, 2019, at 9:18 AM, Norman Budnitz (via carolinabirds Mailing
> List) <carolinabirds...> wrote:
> >>
> >> It's a volunteer workforce, and it takes effort to keep up-to-date.
> Kudos to those who do that work. When I think of how far eBird has come
> and how quickly, I'm very impressed.
> >>
> >> On Tue, Dec 31, 2019 at 9:06 AM Brian Patteson <
> <patteson1...> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> There are a lot of places where the filters could use some tweaking.
> Definitely a work in progress. We run up against it frequently on our
> pelagic trips getting flagged for high numbers.
> >>>
> >>> Brian Patteson
> >>> Hatteras
> >>>
> >>> On Dec 31, 2019, at 8:07 AM, Norman Budnitz (via carolinabirds Mailing
> List) <carolinabirds...> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> Aha. Thanks for that clarification.
> >>>
> >>> On Tue, Dec 31, 2019 at 8:02 AM Kent Fiala <carolinabirds...>
> wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>> There are two different reasons why eBird may ask for details, and
> people often don't recognize the difference. Detail requests are controlled
> by something called a "filter" which specifies a cutoff number of
> individuals for that species on that date. So-called "notable" or "rare"
> species have a cutoff of 0 and for such species eBird wants details
> confirming the identification. For species that have a non-zero cutoff,
> eBird isn't so much interested in the identification but in whether you
> have an accurate count--explain how you counted. You have to read
> carefully, but the request for details is worded slightly differently for
> the two cases.
> >>>>
> >>>> In the case of Anhinga at Mattamuskeet, the filter cutoff is 1, so
> what eBird was really asking was not if you identified it correctly, but if
> you were really sure you had two. I know it sounds silly when worded that
> way, but it's just kind of trying to heighten your awareness that maybe you
> are reporting something kind of unusual and that warrants a few words of
> explanation.
> >>>>
> >>>> The "notable sightings" application on the CBC website only reports
> species for which the filter cutoff is 0, so no reports for Anhingas at
> Mattamuskeet.
> >>>>
> >>>> Kent Fiala
> >>>>
> >>>> On 12/31/2019 7:44 AM, Norman Budnitz (via carolinabirds Mailing
> List) wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>> I'm curious to know how notable sightings are chosen for display on
> the Carolina Bird Club website. A particular example: We found 2 Anhingas
> on the Mattamuskeet CBC December 29th. eBird asked for details and I
> supplied 2 photos for documentation. The birds also required details from
> the compiler and photos were sent to her. And yet those birds don't show
> up in the 'sightings' list. Should I have done something else? Or are
> Anhingas not unusual enough at this time of year to be included?
> >>>>
> >>>> This is not a complaint. I'm just curious to know how the system
> works.
> >>>>
> >>>> --
> >>>> Norm Budnitz
> >>>> Orange County
> >>>> North Carolina
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> --
> >>> Norm Budnitz
> >>> Orange County
> >>> North Carolina
> >>>
> >>>
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >> Norm Budnitz
> >> Orange County
> >> North Carolina
> >>
> >>
>
>
> --
>
> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.flickr.com_photos_offshorebirder2_&d=DwIFaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=DD_JcPD8rIzwDm-BlGwGQ7naxzlnqQxrug1nYIpk7iU&s=kXhDf6jDGPYmBSdcWS_0HjO-bLi_sLZmoJvbIDJ94yI&e= >
>
> "These days I prefer to hunt with a camera. A good photograph demands
> more skill from the hunter, better nerves and more patience than the
> rifle shot." -- Bror Blixen
>
--
~Tracee 843/425-7630
As someone who submitted a single hotspot checklist with more than 100,000 birds recently (on the Mattamuskeet NWR CBC... 5 species were each in the 5 digits) I can empathize with some of the things Nate shares. I consistently tend to undercount, and having an experienced/trained counter along with me helped to "normalize" some of my numbers to be more accurate.
It may seem like counting is something we stop learning to do after kindergarten, but it really is something that can be learned/improved with effort.
The links below provide some introduction. The FWS link also has a "game" that lets one practice!
-----Original Message-----
From: <carolinabirds-request...> [mailto:<carolinabirds-request...>] On Behalf Of Nate Dias
Sent: Tuesday, December 31, 2019 1:31 PM
To: CarolinaBirds
Subject: Re: sightings
This email is from an external source - exercise caution regarding links and attachments.
Brian and Dwayne are correct - and that implies the UNDERLYING DATA
behind the graphs and maps is skewed by "observer effort directed at
birds of interest". -- Not to mention birders' tendency to eBird
every single rarity they see - but not every trash bird.
And how many birders are going to rush out in the next few days (after
midnight January 1) to see the same rare stakeout birds they saw this
week, in order to get them in their total for the "eBird Top 100"
list as quickly as possible?
Another thing that is puzzling about how people use eBird is the
chronic tendency of so many birders to under-report numbers. MANY is
the time I bird right next to people, see exactly the same birds and
flocks, we often talk about and agree upon numbers - then I see their
checklist which reports 1/2, 1/3, or less of the numbers actually
seen. When I ask them about it (sometimes showing them a single
photo with more individuals than they reported) they admit to severe
under-reporting because "I wanted to be sure and submit conservative
numbers".
Many say they estimate and then reduce by half or a third just to be
"safe". Weird but true. As a result, I forbid people to submit
eBird checklists when they tag along on my ISS shorebird surveys
because their habitually reporting fractions of the ACTUAL shorebird
numbers calls into question the official ISS submissions (which now
feed into eBird) and cannot be justified by any logical means.
People who go to the conscious effort of eBirding purposely incorrect
numbers is baffling yet it happens pretty often in my experience.
"These days I prefer to hunt with a camera. A good photograph demands
more skill from the hunter, better nerves and more patience than the
rifle shot." -- Bror Blixen
On Tue, Dec 31, 2019 at 12:47 PM Dwayne Martin <carolinabirds...> wrote:
>
> I totally agree with that. If you look at Catawba County's list you would think Allen's Hummingbird was a given here in November since about 175 people saw one here. I've always thought this was a flaw in eBird's graphs.
>
> Dwayne
> *************
> J. Dwayne Martin
> Hickory, NC
> <redxbill...>
>
>
> Catawba County Park Ranger
> Riverbend Park - Conover, NC
> <jdmartin...>
> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.catawbacountync.gov_depts_parks_&d=DwIFaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=DD_JcPD8rIzwDm-BlGwGQ7naxzlnqQxrug1nYIpk7iU&s=f4YTa2e0S19vVLAR2iOugig6hupRYgRzxnhiMYo9aOE&e= > https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.weatherlink.com_user_riverbendpark&d=DwIFaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=DD_JcPD8rIzwDm-BlGwGQ7naxzlnqQxrug1nYIpk7iU&s=cfueopNZVrKFYwKvaYfdqAVUeIdy7WkSCP4x5Hm9FFM&e= >
>
>
> On Tue, Dec 31, 2019 at 12:14 PM Brian Patteson <carolinabirds...> wrote:
>>
>> I agree. It’s actually better than you might think it might be considering the scale of it on a county basis. One issue that is a bit misleading is how the repeated observation of a rarity makes it seem more probable than it actually is. I think the projected odds on the bar graphs and the maps are skewed considerably by observer effort directed at birds of interest.
>>
>> Brian Patteson
>> Hatteras, NC
>>
>> On Dec 31, 2019, at 9:18 AM, Norman Budnitz (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> wrote:
>>
>> It's a volunteer workforce, and it takes effort to keep up-to-date. Kudos to those who do that work. When I think of how far eBird has come and how quickly, I'm very impressed.
>>
>> On Tue, Dec 31, 2019 at 9:06 AM Brian Patteson <patteson1...> wrote:
>>>
>>> There are a lot of places where the filters could use some tweaking. Definitely a work in progress. We run up against it frequently on our pelagic trips getting flagged for high numbers.
>>>
>>> Brian Patteson
>>> Hatteras
>>>
>>> On Dec 31, 2019, at 8:07 AM, Norman Budnitz (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> wrote:
>>>
>>> Aha. Thanks for that clarification.
>>>
>>> On Tue, Dec 31, 2019 at 8:02 AM Kent Fiala <carolinabirds...> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> There are two different reasons why eBird may ask for details, and people often don't recognize the difference. Detail requests are controlled by something called a "filter" which specifies a cutoff number of individuals for that species on that date. So-called "notable" or "rare" species have a cutoff of 0 and for such species eBird wants details confirming the identification. For species that have a non-zero cutoff, eBird isn't so much interested in the identification but in whether you have an accurate count--explain how you counted. You have to read carefully, but the request for details is worded slightly differently for the two cases.
>>>>
>>>> In the case of Anhinga at Mattamuskeet, the filter cutoff is 1, so what eBird was really asking was not if you identified it correctly, but if you were really sure you had two. I know it sounds silly when worded that way, but it's just kind of trying to heighten your awareness that maybe you are reporting something kind of unusual and that warrants a few words of explanation.
>>>>
>>>> The "notable sightings" application on the CBC website only reports species for which the filter cutoff is 0, so no reports for Anhingas at Mattamuskeet.
>>>>
>>>> Kent Fiala
>>>>
>>>> On 12/31/2019 7:44 AM, Norman Budnitz (via carolinabirds Mailing List) wrote:
>>>>
>>>> I'm curious to know how notable sightings are chosen for display on the Carolina Bird Club website. A particular example: We found 2 Anhingas on the Mattamuskeet CBC December 29th. eBird asked for details and I supplied 2 photos for documentation. The birds also required details from the compiler and photos were sent to her. And yet those birds don't show up in the 'sightings' list. Should I have done something else? Or are Anhingas not unusual enough at this time of year to be included?
>>>>
>>>> This is not a complaint. I'm just curious to know how the system works.
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Norm Budnitz
>>>> Orange County
>>>> North Carolina
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Norm Budnitz
>>> Orange County
>>> North Carolina
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Norm Budnitz
>> Orange County
>> North Carolina
>>
>>
"These days I prefer to hunt with a camera. A good photograph demands
more skill from the hunter, better nerves and more patience than the
rifle shot." -- Bror Blixen
Date: 12/31/19 10:31 am From: Nate Dias (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Re: sightings
Brian and Dwayne are correct - and that implies the UNDERLYING DATA
behind the graphs and maps is skewed by "observer effort directed at
birds of interest". -- Not to mention birders' tendency to eBird
every single rarity they see - but not every trash bird.
And how many birders are going to rush out in the next few days (after
midnight January 1) to see the same rare stakeout birds they saw this
week, in order to get them in their total for the "eBird Top 100"
list as quickly as possible?
Another thing that is puzzling about how people use eBird is the
chronic tendency of so many birders to under-report numbers. MANY is
the time I bird right next to people, see exactly the same birds and
flocks, we often talk about and agree upon numbers - then I see their
checklist which reports 1/2, 1/3, or less of the numbers actually
seen. When I ask them about it (sometimes showing them a single
photo with more individuals than they reported) they admit to severe
under-reporting because "I wanted to be sure and submit conservative
numbers".
Many say they estimate and then reduce by half or a third just to be
"safe". Weird but true. As a result, I forbid people to submit
eBird checklists when they tag along on my ISS shorebird surveys
because their habitually reporting fractions of the ACTUAL shorebird
numbers calls into question the official ISS submissions (which now
feed into eBird) and cannot be justified by any logical means.
People who go to the conscious effort of eBirding purposely incorrect
numbers is baffling yet it happens pretty often in my experience.
"These days I prefer to hunt with a camera. A good photograph demands
more skill from the hunter, better nerves and more patience than the
rifle shot." -- Bror Blixen
On Tue, Dec 31, 2019 at 12:47 PM Dwayne Martin <carolinabirds...> wrote:
>
> I totally agree with that. If you look at Catawba County's list you would think Allen's Hummingbird was a given here in November since about 175 people saw one here. I've always thought this was a flaw in eBird's graphs.
>
> Dwayne
> *************
> J. Dwayne Martin
> Hickory, NC
> <redxbill...>
>
>
> Catawba County Park Ranger
> Riverbend Park - Conover, NC
> <jdmartin...>
> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.catawbacountync.gov_depts_parks_&d=DwIFaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=DD_JcPD8rIzwDm-BlGwGQ7naxzlnqQxrug1nYIpk7iU&s=f4YTa2e0S19vVLAR2iOugig6hupRYgRzxnhiMYo9aOE&e= > https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.weatherlink.com_user_riverbendpark&d=DwIFaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=ymRCw6Q-sBitug_rdeO1Tokz-I_SX2LQN2_Ocvlal9U&m=DD_JcPD8rIzwDm-BlGwGQ7naxzlnqQxrug1nYIpk7iU&s=cfueopNZVrKFYwKvaYfdqAVUeIdy7WkSCP4x5Hm9FFM&e= >
>
>
> On Tue, Dec 31, 2019 at 12:14 PM Brian Patteson <carolinabirds...> wrote:
>>
>> I agree. It’s actually better than you might think it might be considering the scale of it on a county basis. One issue that is a bit misleading is how the repeated observation of a rarity makes it seem more probable than it actually is. I think the projected odds on the bar graphs and the maps are skewed considerably by observer effort directed at birds of interest.
>>
>> Brian Patteson
>> Hatteras, NC
>>
>> On Dec 31, 2019, at 9:18 AM, Norman Budnitz (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> wrote:
>>
>> It's a volunteer workforce, and it takes effort to keep up-to-date. Kudos to those who do that work. When I think of how far eBird has come and how quickly, I'm very impressed.
>>
>> On Tue, Dec 31, 2019 at 9:06 AM Brian Patteson <patteson1...> wrote:
>>>
>>> There are a lot of places where the filters could use some tweaking. Definitely a work in progress. We run up against it frequently on our pelagic trips getting flagged for high numbers.
>>>
>>> Brian Patteson
>>> Hatteras
>>>
>>> On Dec 31, 2019, at 8:07 AM, Norman Budnitz (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> wrote:
>>>
>>> Aha. Thanks for that clarification.
>>>
>>> On Tue, Dec 31, 2019 at 8:02 AM Kent Fiala <carolinabirds...> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> There are two different reasons why eBird may ask for details, and people often don't recognize the difference. Detail requests are controlled by something called a "filter" which specifies a cutoff number of individuals for that species on that date. So-called "notable" or "rare" species have a cutoff of 0 and for such species eBird wants details confirming the identification. For species that have a non-zero cutoff, eBird isn't so much interested in the identification but in whether you have an accurate count--explain how you counted. You have to read carefully, but the request for details is worded slightly differently for the two cases.
>>>>
>>>> In the case of Anhinga at Mattamuskeet, the filter cutoff is 1, so what eBird was really asking was not if you identified it correctly, but if you were really sure you had two. I know it sounds silly when worded that way, but it's just kind of trying to heighten your awareness that maybe you are reporting something kind of unusual and that warrants a few words of explanation.
>>>>
>>>> The "notable sightings" application on the CBC website only reports species for which the filter cutoff is 0, so no reports for Anhingas at Mattamuskeet.
>>>>
>>>> Kent Fiala
>>>>
>>>> On 12/31/2019 7:44 AM, Norman Budnitz (via carolinabirds Mailing List) wrote:
>>>>
>>>> I'm curious to know how notable sightings are chosen for display on the Carolina Bird Club website. A particular example: We found 2 Anhingas on the Mattamuskeet CBC December 29th. eBird asked for details and I supplied 2 photos for documentation. The birds also required details from the compiler and photos were sent to her. And yet those birds don't show up in the 'sightings' list. Should I have done something else? Or are Anhingas not unusual enough at this time of year to be included?
>>>>
>>>> This is not a complaint. I'm just curious to know how the system works.
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Norm Budnitz
>>>> Orange County
>>>> North Carolina
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Norm Budnitz
>>> Orange County
>>> North Carolina
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Norm Budnitz
>> Orange County
>> North Carolina
>>
>>
"These days I prefer to hunt with a camera. A good photograph demands
more skill from the hunter, better nerves and more patience than the
rifle shot." -- Bror Blixen
Date: 12/31/19 9:47 am From: Dwayne Martin (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Re: sightings
I totally agree with that. If you look at Catawba County's list you would
think Allen's Hummingbird was a given here in November since about 175
people saw one here. I've always thought this was a flaw in eBird's graphs.
Dwayne
*************
J. Dwayne Martin
Hickory, NC
<redxbill...>
On Tue, Dec 31, 2019 at 12:14 PM Brian Patteson <carolinabirds...>
wrote:
> I agree. It’s actually better than you might think it might be considering
> the scale of it on a county basis. One issue that is a bit misleading is
> how the repeated observation of a rarity makes it seem more probable than
> it actually is. I think the projected odds on the bar graphs and the maps
> are skewed considerably by observer effort directed at birds of interest.
>
> Brian Patteson
> Hatteras, NC
>
> On Dec 31, 2019, at 9:18 AM, Norman Budnitz (via carolinabirds Mailing
> List) <carolinabirds...> wrote:
>
> It's a volunteer workforce, and it takes effort to keep up-to-date. Kudos
> to those who do that work. When I think of how far eBird has come and how
> quickly, I'm very impressed.
>
> On Tue, Dec 31, 2019 at 9:06 AM Brian Patteson <patteson1...>
> wrote:
>
>> There are a lot of places where the filters could use some tweaking.
>> Definitely a work in progress. We run up against it frequently on our
>> pelagic trips getting flagged for high numbers.
>>
>> Brian Patteson
>> Hatteras
>>
>> On Dec 31, 2019, at 8:07 AM, Norman Budnitz (via carolinabirds Mailing
>> List) <carolinabirds...> wrote:
>>
>> Aha. Thanks for that clarification.
>>
>> On Tue, Dec 31, 2019 at 8:02 AM Kent Fiala <carolinabirds...>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> There are two different reasons why eBird may ask for details, and
>>> people often don't recognize the difference. Detail requests are controlled
>>> by something called a "filter" which specifies a cutoff number of
>>> individuals for that species on that date. So-called "notable" or "rare"
>>> species have a cutoff of 0 and for such species eBird wants details
>>> confirming the identification. For species that have a non-zero cutoff,
>>> eBird isn't so much interested in the identification but in whether you
>>> have an accurate count--explain how you counted. You have to read
>>> carefully, but the request for details is worded slightly differently for
>>> the two cases.
>>>
>>> In the case of Anhinga at Mattamuskeet, the filter cutoff is 1, so what
>>> eBird was really asking was not if you identified it correctly, but if you
>>> were really sure you had two. I know it sounds silly when worded that way,
>>> but it's just kind of trying to heighten your awareness that maybe you are
>>> reporting something kind of unusual and that warrants a few words of
>>> explanation.
>>>
>>> The "notable sightings" application on the CBC website only reports
>>> species for which the filter cutoff is 0, so no reports for Anhingas at
>>> Mattamuskeet.
>>>
>>> Kent Fiala
>>>
>>> On 12/31/2019 7:44 AM, Norman Budnitz (via carolinabirds Mailing List)
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>> I'm curious to know how notable sightings are chosen for display on the
>>> Carolina Bird Club website. A particular example: We found 2 Anhingas on
>>> the Mattamuskeet CBC December 29th. eBird asked for details and I supplied
>>> 2 photos for documentation. The birds also required details from the
>>> compiler and photos were sent to her. And yet those birds don't show up in
>>> the 'sightings' list. Should I have done something else? Or are Anhingas
>>> not unusual enough at this time of year to be included?
>>>
>>> This is not a complaint. I'm just curious to know how the system works.
>>>
>>> --
>>> Norm Budnitz
>>> Orange County
>>> North Carolina
>>>
>>>
>>
>> --
>> Norm Budnitz
>> Orange County
>> North Carolina
>>
>>
>>
>
> --
> Norm Budnitz
> Orange County
> North Carolina
>
>
>
Date: 12/31/19 9:38 am From: Harry LeGrand (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Re: sightings
Kent’s first response may well have answered Norm’s question, but not quite in as simple a phrase as I mention — if your species is already on the preset checklist you are about to complete, your “rare bird” isn’t going to be on the CBC Sightings listing. ☹️
Harry LeGrand
Sent from my iPhone
> On Dec 31, 2019, at 12:23 PM, Kent Fiala (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> wrote:
>
> Hold on about what? This is more or less a different way of saying what I explained before.
>
> On Android it is quite simple to get out of a checklist. I can't answer about iPhone.
>
> Kent Fiala
>> On 12/31/2019 12:17 PM, Harry LeGrand (via carolinabirds Mailing List) wrote:
>>
>> Hold on here.
>>
>> I just called up a new eBird checklist for Mattamuskeet NWR — Lake Landing, as an example. Anhinga, surprisingly, is NOT a write-in, as a rare bird for the area in winter. I would disagree with that. This is why your Anhinga or 2 of them, do Not show up on Sightings on the CBC website. Even one bird would not do it.
>>
>> If your bird is already showing on the eBird checklist — such as Anhinga there for this time of year — IT WONT MAKE THE CBC SIGHTINGS. Kent’s response had more to do with the number of birds, not presence or absence.
>>
>> One thing I hate about EBird is simply getting OUT of a checklist you don’t want to submit. They don’t have an Escape or Quit tab. I’m stuck on the Mattamuskeet list and having trouble getting out unless i turn off my iphone.!! I want to submit a real list for Mid-Pines Road, and I cannot right now on my iPhone. Oy.
>>
>> Harry LeGrand
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>> On Dec 31, 2019, at 9:18 AM, Norman Budnitz (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> wrote:
>>
>>> It's a volunteer workforce, and it takes effort to keep up-to-date. Kudos to those who do that work. When I think of how far eBird has come and how quickly, I'm very impressed.
>>>
>>>> On Tue, Dec 31, 2019 at 9:06 AM Brian Patteson <patteson1...> wrote:
>>>> There are a lot of places where the filters could use some tweaking. Definitely a work in progress. We run up against it frequently on our pelagic trips getting flagged for high numbers.
>>>>
>>>> Brian Patteson
>>>> Hatteras
>>>>
>>>>> On Dec 31, 2019, at 8:07 AM, Norman Budnitz (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Aha. Thanks for that clarification.
>>>>>
>>>>>> On Tue, Dec 31, 2019 at 8:02 AM Kent Fiala <carolinabirds...> wrote:
>>>>>> There are two different reasons why eBird may ask for details, and people often don't recognize the difference. Detail requests are controlled by something called a "filter" which specifies a cutoff number of individuals for that species on that date. So-called "notable" or "rare" species have a cutoff of 0 and for such species eBird wants details confirming the identification. For species that have a non-zero cutoff, eBird isn't so much interested in the identification but in whether you have an accurate count--explain how you counted. You have to read carefully, but the request for details is worded slightly differently for the two cases.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> In the case of Anhinga at Mattamuskeet, the filter cutoff is 1, so what eBird was really asking was not if you identified it correctly, but if you were really sure you had two. I know it sounds silly when worded that way, but it's just kind of trying to heighten your awareness that maybe you are reporting something kind of unusual and that warrants a few words of explanation.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The "notable sightings" application on the CBC website only reports species for which the filter cutoff is 0, so no reports for Anhingas at Mattamuskeet.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Kent Fiala
>>>>>>> On 12/31/2019 7:44 AM, Norman Budnitz (via carolinabirds Mailing List) wrote:
>>>>>>> I'm curious to know how notable sightings are chosen for display on the Carolina Bird Club website. A particular example: We found 2 Anhingas on the Mattamuskeet CBC December 29th. eBird asked for details and I supplied 2 photos for documentation. The birds also required details from the compiler and photos were sent to her. And yet those birds don't show up in the 'sightings' list. Should I have done something else? Or are Anhingas not unusual enough at this time of year to be included?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> This is not a complaint. I'm just curious to know how the system works.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>> Norm Budnitz
>>>>>>> Orange County
>>>>>>> North Carolina
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> Norm Budnitz
>>>>> Orange County
>>>>> North Carolina
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Norm Budnitz
>>> Orange County
>>> North Carolina
Date: 12/31/19 9:23 am From: Kent Fiala (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Re: sightings
Hold on about what? This is more or less a different way of saying what I explained before.
On Android it is quite simple to get out of a checklist. I can't answer about iPhone.
Kent Fiala
On 12/31/2019 12:17 PM, Harry LeGrand (via carolinabirds Mailing List) wrote:
>
> Hold on here.
>
> I just called up a new eBird checklist for Mattamuskeet NWR — Lake Landing, as an example. Anhinga, surprisingly, is NOT a write-in, as a rare bird for the area in winter. I would disagree with that. This is why your Anhinga or 2 of them, do Not show up on Sightings on the CBC website. Even one bird would not do it.
>
> If your bird is already showing on the eBird checklist — such as Anhinga there for this time of year — IT WONT MAKE THE CBC SIGHTINGS. Kent’s response had more to do with the number of birds, not presence or absence.
>
> One thing I hate about EBird is simply getting OUT of a checklist you don’t want to submit. They don’t have an Escape or Quit tab. I’m stuck on the Mattamuskeet list and having trouble getting out unless i turn off my iphone.!! I want to submit a real list for Mid-Pines Road, and I cannot right now on my iPhone. Oy.
>
> Harry LeGrand
>
>
>
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Dec 31, 2019, at 9:18 AM, Norman Budnitz (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> <mailto:<carolinabirds...>> wrote:
>
>> It's a volunteer workforce, and it takes effort to keep up-to-date. Kudos to those who do that work. When I think of how far eBird has come and how quickly, I'm very impressed.
>>
>> On Tue, Dec 31, 2019 at 9:06 AM Brian Patteson <patteson1...> <mailto:<patteson1...>> wrote:
>>
>> There are a lot of places where the filters could use some tweaking. Definitely a work in progress. We run up against it frequently on our pelagic trips getting flagged for high numbers.
>>
>> Brian Patteson
>> Hatteras
>>
>>> On Dec 31, 2019, at 8:07 AM, Norman Budnitz (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> <mailto:<carolinabirds...>> wrote:
>>>
>>> Aha. Thanks for that clarification.
>>>
>>> On Tue, Dec 31, 2019 at 8:02 AM Kent Fiala <carolinabirds...> <mailto:<carolinabirds...>> wrote:
>>>
>>> There are two different reasons why eBird may ask for details, and people often don't recognize the difference. Detail requests are controlled by something called a "filter" which specifies a cutoff number of individuals for that species on that date. So-called "notable" or "rare" species have a cutoff of 0 and for such species eBird wants details confirming the identification. For species that have a non-zero cutoff, eBird isn't so much interested in the identification but in whether you have an accurate count--explain how you counted. You have to read carefully, but the request for details is worded slightly differently for the two cases.
>>>
>>> In the case of Anhinga at Mattamuskeet, the filter cutoff is 1, so what eBird was really asking was not if you identified it correctly, but if you were really sure you had two. I know it sounds silly when worded that way, but it's just kind of trying to heighten your awareness that maybe you are reporting something kind of unusual and that warrants a few words of explanation.
>>>
>>> The "notable sightings" application on the CBC website only reports species for which the filter cutoff is 0, so no reports for Anhingas at Mattamuskeet.
>>>
>>> Kent Fiala
>>>
>>> On 12/31/2019 7:44 AM, Norman Budnitz (via carolinabirds Mailing List) wrote:
>>>> I'm curious to know how notable sightings are chosen for display on the Carolina Bird Club website. A particular example: We found 2 Anhingas on the Mattamuskeet CBC December 29th. eBird asked for details and I supplied 2 photos for documentation. The birds also required details from the compiler and photos were sent to her. And yet those birds don't show up in the 'sightings' list. Should I have done something else? Or are Anhingas not unusual enough at this time of year to be included?
>>>>
>>>> This is not a complaint. I'm just curious to know how the system works.
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Norm Budnitz
>>>> Orange County
>>>> North Carolina
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Norm Budnitz
>>> Orange County
>>> North Carolina
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Norm Budnitz
>> Orange County
>> North Carolina
Date: 12/31/19 9:18 am From: Harry LeGrand (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Re: sightings
Hold on here.
I just called up a new eBird checklist for Mattamuskeet NWR — Lake Landing, as an example. Anhinga, surprisingly, is NOT a write-in, as a rare bird for the area in winter. I would disagree with that. This is why your Anhinga or 2 of them, do Not show up on Sightings on the CBC website. Even one bird would not do it.
If your bird is already showing on the eBird checklist — such as Anhinga there for this time of year — IT WONT MAKE THE CBC SIGHTINGS. Kent’s response had more to do with the number of birds, not presence or absence.
One thing I hate about EBird is simply getting OUT of a checklist you don’t want to submit. They don’t have an Escape or Quit tab. I’m stuck on the Mattamuskeet list and having trouble getting out unless i turn off my iphone.!! I want to submit a real list for Mid-Pines Road, and I cannot right now on my iPhone. Oy.
Harry LeGrand
Sent from my iPhone
> On Dec 31, 2019, at 9:18 AM, Norman Budnitz (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> wrote:
>
> It's a volunteer workforce, and it takes effort to keep up-to-date. Kudos to those who do that work. When I think of how far eBird has come and how quickly, I'm very impressed.
>
>> On Tue, Dec 31, 2019 at 9:06 AM Brian Patteson <patteson1...> wrote:
>> There are a lot of places where the filters could use some tweaking. Definitely a work in progress. We run up against it frequently on our pelagic trips getting flagged for high numbers.
>>
>> Brian Patteson
>> Hatteras
>>
>>> On Dec 31, 2019, at 8:07 AM, Norman Budnitz (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> wrote:
>>>
>>> Aha. Thanks for that clarification.
>>>
>>> On Tue, Dec 31, 2019 at 8:02 AM Kent Fiala <carolinabirds...> wrote:
>>>> There are two different reasons why eBird may ask for details, and people often don't recognize the difference. Detail requests are controlled by something called a "filter" which specifies a cutoff number of individuals for that species on that date. So-called "notable" or "rare" species have a cutoff of 0 and for such species eBird wants details confirming the identification. For species that have a non-zero cutoff, eBird isn't so much interested in the identification but in whether you have an accurate count--explain how you counted. You have to read carefully, but the request for details is worded slightly differently for the two cases.
>>>>
>>>> In the case of Anhinga at Mattamuskeet, the filter cutoff is 1, so what eBird was really asking was not if you identified it correctly, but if you were really sure you had two. I know it sounds silly when worded that way, but it's just kind of trying to heighten your awareness that maybe you are reporting something kind of unusual and that warrants a few words of explanation.
>>>>
>>>> The "notable sightings" application on the CBC website only reports species for which the filter cutoff is 0, so no reports for Anhingas at Mattamuskeet.
>>>>
>>>> Kent Fiala
>>>>> On 12/31/2019 7:44 AM, Norman Budnitz (via carolinabirds Mailing List) wrote:
>>>>> I'm curious to know how notable sightings are chosen for display on the Carolina Bird Club website. A particular example: We found 2 Anhingas on the Mattamuskeet CBC December 29th. eBird asked for details and I supplied 2 photos for documentation. The birds also required details from the compiler and photos were sent to her. And yet those birds don't show up in the 'sightings' list. Should I have done something else? Or are Anhingas not unusual enough at this time of year to be included?
>>>>>
>>>>> This is not a complaint. I'm just curious to know how the system works.
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> Norm Budnitz
>>>>> Orange County
>>>>> North Carolina
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Norm Budnitz
>>> Orange County
>>> North Carolina
>>
>
>
> --
> Norm Budnitz
> Orange County
> North Carolina
Date: 12/31/19 9:13 am From: Brian Patteson (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Re: sightings
I agree. It’s actually better than you might think it might be considering the scale of it on a county basis. One issue that is a bit misleading is how the repeated observation of a rarity makes it seem more probable than it actually is. I think the projected odds on the bar graphs and the maps are skewed considerably by observer effort directed at birds of interest.
Brian Patteson
Hatteras, NC
> On Dec 31, 2019, at 9:18 AM, Norman Budnitz (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> wrote:
>
> It's a volunteer workforce, and it takes effort to keep up-to-date. Kudos to those who do that work. When I think of how far eBird has come and how quickly, I'm very impressed.
>
> On Tue, Dec 31, 2019 at 9:06 AM Brian Patteson <patteson1...> <mailto:<patteson1...>> wrote:
> There are a lot of places where the filters could use some tweaking. Definitely a work in progress. We run up against it frequently on our pelagic trips getting flagged for high numbers.
>
> Brian Patteson
> Hatteras
>
>> On Dec 31, 2019, at 8:07 AM, Norman Budnitz (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> <mailto:<carolinabirds...>> wrote:
>>
>> Aha. Thanks for that clarification.
>>
>> On Tue, Dec 31, 2019 at 8:02 AM Kent Fiala <carolinabirds...> <mailto:<carolinabirds...>> wrote:
>> There are two different reasons why eBird may ask for details, and people often don't recognize the difference. Detail requests are controlled by something called a "filter" which specifies a cutoff number of individuals for that species on that date. So-called "notable" or "rare" species have a cutoff of 0 and for such species eBird wants details confirming the identification. For species that have a non-zero cutoff, eBird isn't so much interested in the identification but in whether you have an accurate count--explain how you counted. You have to read carefully, but the request for details is worded slightly differently for the two cases.
>>
>> In the case of Anhinga at Mattamuskeet, the filter cutoff is 1, so what eBird was really asking was not if you identified it correctly, but if you were really sure you had two. I know it sounds silly when worded that way, but it's just kind of trying to heighten your awareness that maybe you are reporting something kind of unusual and that warrants a few words of explanation.
>> The "notable sightings" application on the CBC website only reports species for which the filter cutoff is 0, so no reports for Anhingas at Mattamuskeet.
>> Kent Fiala
>> On 12/31/2019 7:44 AM, Norman Budnitz (via carolinabirds Mailing List) wrote:
>>> I'm curious to know how notable sightings are chosen for display on the Carolina Bird Club website. A particular example: We found 2 Anhingas on the Mattamuskeet CBC December 29th. eBird asked for details and I supplied 2 photos for documentation. The birds also required details from the compiler and photos were sent to her. And yet those birds don't show up in the 'sightings' list. Should I have done something else? Or are Anhingas not unusual enough at this time of year to be included?
>>>
>>> This is not a complaint. I'm just curious to know how the system works.
>>>
>>> --
>>> Norm Budnitz
>>> Orange County
>>> North Carolina
>>
>>
>> --
>> Norm Budnitz
>> Orange County
>> North Carolina
>
>
>
> --
> Norm Budnitz
> Orange County
> North Carolina
11:06. Departed to the NEWayne Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone
-------- Original message --------From: "whoffman(via carolinabirds Mailing List)" <carolinabirds...> Date: 12/31/19 10:58 AM (GMT-05:00) To: CarolinaBirds <carolinabirds...> Subject: BH Gull Currently present at Carolina Beach Lake.10:50 AM Dec. 31Wayne Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone
Date: 12/31/19 6:19 am From: Norman Budnitz (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Re: sightings
It's a volunteer workforce, and it takes effort to keep up-to-date. Kudos to those who do that work. When I think of how far eBird has come and how quickly, I'm very impressed.
On Tue, Dec 31, 2019 at 9:06 AM Brian Patteson <patteson1...> wrote:
> There are a lot of places where the filters could use some tweaking. > Definitely a work in progress. We run up against it frequently on our > pelagic trips getting flagged for high numbers. > > Brian Patteson > Hatteras > > On Dec 31, 2019, at 8:07 AM, Norman Budnitz (via carolinabirds Mailing > List) <carolinabirds...> wrote: > > Aha. Thanks for that clarification. > > On Tue, Dec 31, 2019 at 8:02 AM Kent Fiala <carolinabirds...> wrote: > >> There are two different reasons why eBird may ask for details, and people >> often don't recognize the difference. Detail requests are controlled by >> something called a "filter" which specifies a cutoff number of individuals >> for that species on that date. So-called "notable" or "rare" species have a >> cutoff of 0 and for such species eBird wants details confirming the >> identification. For species that have a non-zero cutoff, eBird isn't so >> much interested in the identification but in whether you have an accurate >> count--explain how you counted. You have to read carefully, but the request >> for details is worded slightly differently for the two cases. >> >> In the case of Anhinga at Mattamuskeet, the filter cutoff is 1, so what >> eBird was really asking was not if you identified it correctly, but if you >> were really sure you had two. I know it sounds silly when worded that way, >> but it's just kind of trying to heighten your awareness that maybe you are >> reporting something kind of unusual and that warrants a few words of >> explanation. >> >> The "notable sightings" application on the CBC website only reports >> species for which the filter cutoff is 0, so no reports for Anhingas at >> Mattamuskeet. >> >> Kent Fiala >> >> On 12/31/2019 7:44 AM, Norman Budnitz (via carolinabirds Mailing List) >> wrote: >> >> I'm curious to know how notable sightings are chosen for display on the >> Carolina Bird Club website. A particular example: We found 2 Anhingas on >> the Mattamuskeet CBC December 29th. eBird asked for details and I supplied >> 2 photos for documentation. The birds also required details from the >> compiler and photos were sent to her. And yet those birds don't show up in >> the 'sightings' list. Should I have done something else? Or are Anhingas >> not unusual enough at this time of year to be included? >> >> This is not a complaint. I'm just curious to know how the system works. >> >> -- >> Norm Budnitz >> Orange County >> North Carolina >> >> > > -- > Norm Budnitz > Orange County > North Carolina > > >
Date: 12/31/19 6:07 am From: Brian Patteson (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Re: sightings
There are a lot of places where the filters could use some tweaking. Definitely a work in progress. We run up against it frequently on our pelagic trips getting flagged for high numbers.
Brian Patteson
Hatteras
> On Dec 31, 2019, at 8:07 AM, Norman Budnitz (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> wrote:
>
> Aha. Thanks for that clarification.
>
> On Tue, Dec 31, 2019 at 8:02 AM Kent Fiala <carolinabirds...> <mailto:<carolinabirds...>> wrote:
> There are two different reasons why eBird may ask for details, and people often don't recognize the difference. Detail requests are controlled by something called a "filter" which specifies a cutoff number of individuals for that species on that date. So-called "notable" or "rare" species have a cutoff of 0 and for such species eBird wants details confirming the identification. For species that have a non-zero cutoff, eBird isn't so much interested in the identification but in whether you have an accurate count--explain how you counted. You have to read carefully, but the request for details is worded slightly differently for the two cases.
>
> In the case of Anhinga at Mattamuskeet, the filter cutoff is 1, so what eBird was really asking was not if you identified it correctly, but if you were really sure you had two. I know it sounds silly when worded that way, but it's just kind of trying to heighten your awareness that maybe you are reporting something kind of unusual and that warrants a few words of explanation.
> The "notable sightings" application on the CBC website only reports species for which the filter cutoff is 0, so no reports for Anhingas at Mattamuskeet.
> Kent Fiala
> On 12/31/2019 7:44 AM, Norman Budnitz (via carolinabirds Mailing List) wrote:
>> I'm curious to know how notable sightings are chosen for display on the Carolina Bird Club website. A particular example: We found 2 Anhingas on the Mattamuskeet CBC December 29th. eBird asked for details and I supplied 2 photos for documentation. The birds also required details from the compiler and photos were sent to her. And yet those birds don't show up in the 'sightings' list. Should I have done something else? Or are Anhingas not unusual enough at this time of year to be included?
>>
>> This is not a complaint. I'm just curious to know how the system works.
>>
>> --
>> Norm Budnitz
>> Orange County
>> North Carolina
>
>
> --
> Norm Budnitz
> Orange County
> North Carolina
Date: 12/31/19 5:09 am From: Norman Budnitz (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Re: sightings
Aha. Thanks for that clarification.
On Tue, Dec 31, 2019 at 8:02 AM Kent Fiala <carolinabirds...> wrote:
> There are two different reasons why eBird may ask for details, and people > often don't recognize the difference. Detail requests are controlled by > something called a "filter" which specifies a cutoff number of individuals > for that species on that date. So-called "notable" or "rare" species have a > cutoff of 0 and for such species eBird wants details confirming the > identification. For species that have a non-zero cutoff, eBird isn't so > much interested in the identification but in whether you have an accurate > count--explain how you counted. You have to read carefully, but the request > for details is worded slightly differently for the two cases. > > In the case of Anhinga at Mattamuskeet, the filter cutoff is 1, so what > eBird was really asking was not if you identified it correctly, but if you > were really sure you had two. I know it sounds silly when worded that way, > but it's just kind of trying to heighten your awareness that maybe you are > reporting something kind of unusual and that warrants a few words of > explanation. > > The "notable sightings" application on the CBC website only reports > species for which the filter cutoff is 0, so no reports for Anhingas at > Mattamuskeet. > > Kent Fiala > > On 12/31/2019 7:44 AM, Norman Budnitz (via carolinabirds Mailing List) > wrote: > > I'm curious to know how notable sightings are chosen for display on the > Carolina Bird Club website. A particular example: We found 2 Anhingas on > the Mattamuskeet CBC December 29th. eBird asked for details and I supplied > 2 photos for documentation. The birds also required details from the > compiler and photos were sent to her. And yet those birds don't show up in > the 'sightings' list. Should I have done something else? Or are Anhingas > not unusual enough at this time of year to be included? > > This is not a complaint. I'm just curious to know how the system works. > > -- > Norm Budnitz > Orange County > North Carolina > >
Date: 12/31/19 5:02 am From: Kent Fiala (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Re: sightings
There are two different reasons why eBird may ask for details, and people often don't recognize the difference. Detail requests are controlled by something called a "filter" which specifies a cutoff number of individuals for that species on that date. So-called "notable" or "rare" species have a cutoff of 0 and for such species eBird wants details confirming the identification. For species that have a non-zero cutoff, eBird isn't so much interested in the identification but in whether you have an accurate count--explain how you counted. You have to read carefully, but the request for details is worded slightly differently for the two cases.
In the case of Anhinga at Mattamuskeet, the filter cutoff is 1, so what eBird was really asking was not if you identified it correctly, but if you were really sure you had two. I know it sounds silly when worded that way, but it's just kind of trying to heighten your awareness that maybe you are reporting something kind of unusual and that warrants a few words of explanation.
The "notable sightings" application on the CBC website only reports species for which the filter cutoff is 0, so no reports for Anhingas at Mattamuskeet.
Kent Fiala
On 12/31/2019 7:44 AM, Norman Budnitz (via carolinabirds Mailing List) wrote:
> I'm curious to know how notable sightings are chosen for display on the Carolina Bird Club website. A particular example: We found 2 Anhingas on the Mattamuskeet CBC December 29th. eBird asked for details and I supplied 2 photos for documentation. The birds also required details from the compiler and photos were sent to her. And yet those birds don't show up in the 'sightings' list. Should I have done something else? Or are Anhingas not unusual enough at this time of year to be included?
>
> This is not a complaint. I'm just curious to know how the system works.
>
> --
> Norm Budnitz
> Orange County
> North Carolina
Date: 12/31/19 4:45 am From: Norman Budnitz (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: sightings
I'm curious to know how notable sightings are chosen for display on the Carolina Bird Club website. A particular example: We found 2 Anhingas on the Mattamuskeet CBC December 29th. eBird asked for details and I supplied 2 photos for documentation. The birds also required details from the compiler and photos were sent to her. And yet those birds don't show up in the 'sightings' list. Should I have done something else? Or are Anhingas not unusual enough at this time of year to be included?
This is not a complaint. I'm just curious to know how the system works.
Date: 12/30/19 7:59 pm From: piephofft (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Southern Lake Norman CBC
The Southern Lake Norman CBC was held Sunday December 15, 2019. Despite good weather and fine participation, the combination of a non irruptive year and a very small fraction of waterfowl in our area of the Piedmont compared to most years, made for the lowest species count in 12 years. Thirty-two observers in ten parties tallied 95 species. Multiple parties reported blue-headed vireo (5 birds) and black- and- white warbler (2 birds), (more on these species later); the only notable swimming bird was a single redhead. The rarest bird reported was a prairie warbler.Once again Marsha Wright opened her home up for the tally-up supper provided by Marsha and Lorraine Piephoff. Delicious.
On Saturday December 14 I participated in the Gastonia CBC and found what is perhaps my most unexpected bird in 40 years of CBC's. I repeatedly flushed and obtained great views of a bobolink in a broomsedge field, less than 50 yards from where Leconte's sparrows were found some years ago. Needless to say there will be a very detailed write-up delivered to Ricky Davis and the NCBRC. I also tallied a blue-headed vireo on that CBC.This past Saturday I participated in the Charlotte CBC where multiple groups also had black-and-white warbler and blue-headed vireo. Perhaps the number of reports of these two species is due to the extremely mild weather thus far this season, but wintering reports of these two species have been steadily increasing in the Charlotte-Mecklenburg area over the past decade. I now expect to be able to find vireos in appropriate habitat, and the warbler is frequent enough to warrant a try whenever I'm in the field too.What is notable this year is the number of birds of both species being reported from the northern areas of Mecklenburg County. In the past I was used to seeing these two occasionally in the southern portions, and very rarely in the northern. The numbers are about even these days.Another species that has shown dramatic increase as a wintering species in the southern Piedmont is the orange-crowned warbler. Greg Hays and I tallied 5 individuals on the Charlotte CBC. The site is a golf course built on an old landfill where Baccharis thickets are plentiful, and hold the orange-crowneds every year. This species was also tallied by multiple groups on the Charlotte CBC, and was tallied on the Southern Lake Norman CBC too. I am sure everyone who has been seriously birding the state for a few decades has noted changes in the wintering numbers of other species; both in declines and increases.
Taylor Piephoff
Matthews, NC
<PiephoffT...>
We’ve had two green (first yr male most likely) at our millet feeder for the past two days. A ruby crowned kinglet is a regular daily visitor to the suet feeder Cheerful sight!
Peggy Schachte
Sullivan’s Island SC
It was indeed a terrific day around Mattamuskeet yesterday! Both the weather and the birds cooperated to make it a memorable CBC!! Numbers of waterfowl on the lake as well as in the refuge impoundments was impressive-- tallying waterfowl numbers was sure a challenge for Steve and me!!
I only wish we had managed an on-site countdown in order to share all of the "finds" our two dozen volunteers made during the 24 hour period.
I plan on reporting more count details here as soon as I have all lists in hand: both for the benefit of Carolina birders who may be planning a trip that way in the coming weeks-- or perhaps those who are considering joining the fun on December 29th, 2020 (hint,hint!).
Susan Campbell Mattamuskeet Compiler
________________________________ From: <carolinabirds-request...> <carolinabirds-request...> on behalf of Marc Ribaudo <carolinabirds...> Sent: Monday, December 30, 2019 6:27 AM To: <carolinabirds...> <carolinabirds...> Subject: Mattamuskeet CBC
Yesterday, Allen Bryan and I participated in the Mattamuskeet CBC, covering the eastern side of the lake, from Lake Landing around to the causeway, and including the communities(?) of Middletown and Nebraska. We started at 5am, ended at 3:15pm, and racked up 100 species. Allen really knows the area and we visited lots of very productive thickets that on my own I would have passed by. Most of our territory is ag fields, thickets, small woodlots, and private impoundments. Highlights are many. We found 8 warbler species including American redstart, Nashville, and black-and-white, a dickcissel, a Baltimore oriole, 2 white-eyed vireos, 3 gnatcatchers, 5 wren species, Virginia rail, displaying woodcock, an osprey, a great egret roost containing 140 birds, and a party of black-crowned night herons along a canal that topped 25 birds. We also had a cool owl encounter. While we were scanning a large field for short-eared owls just before dawn we w ere surprised by a rush of wings overhe ad. Allen saw something in the road and I was able to see through my binoculars a great-horned owl with something in its talons. When it flew up the prey appeared to be a duck of some kind, apparently captured at a nearby impoundment.
On 12/30/2019 3:02 PM, Linda Ward (via carolinabirds Mailing List) wrote:
> After seeing a few sightings of N. Parula listed on Caro Birds, I realized I had failed to post our sighting from Dec. 24. We had a male parula visit the water spray on our goldfish pond.
>
> BTW, so glad to learn that we could visit Caro Bird Club website and click/tap on "sightings" to view these, with no need to access ebird. Thanks for this info.
>
> Linda Ward
> Skip Hancock
> Coinjock, NC
>
> For direct contact: <tankapoet...> <mailto:<tankapoet...>
Date: 12/30/19 12:03 pm From: Linda Ward (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: N. Parula, Coinjock, NC
After seeing a few sightings of N. Parula listed on Caro Birds, I realized I had failed to post our sighting from Dec. 24. We had a male parula visit the water spray on our goldfish pond.
BTW, so glad to learn that we could visit Caro Bird Club website and click/tap on "sightings" to view these, with no need to access ebird. Thanks for this info.
Date: 12/30/19 7:02 am From: Harry LeGrand (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Re: NORTHERN PARULA male at suet, Raleigh, Wake County, NC
Why not do the easy thing and simply go to the Carolina Bird Club website? Click Sightings, and you see that Northern Parula was already showing a half hour ago. Click on “checklist” to see the two photos. You don’t have to wait on reviewers for EBird write-ins to appear here.
Don’t need to bother going into EBird.
I go to this site and link several times a day. Thanks, Kent, for having this set up for several years now.
Date: 12/30/19 6:31 am From: Lynn Erla Beegle (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: NORTHERN PARULA male at suet, Raleigh, Wake County, NC
Date: 12/30/19 3:28 am From: Marc Ribaudo (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Mattamuskeet CBC
Yesterday, Allen Bryan and I participated in the Mattamuskeet CBC, covering the eastern side of the lake, from Lake Landing around to the causeway, and including the communities(?) of Middletown and Nebraska. We started at 5am, ended at 3:15pm, and racked up 100 species. Allen really knows the area and we visited lots of very productive thickets that on my own I would have passed by. Most of our territory is ag fields, thickets, small woodlots, and private impoundments. Highlights are many. We found 8 warbler species including American redstart, Nashville, and black-and-white, a dickcissel, a Baltimore oriole, 2 white-eyed vireos, 3 gnatcatchers, 5 wren species, Virginia rail, displaying woodcock, an osprey, a great egret roost containing 140 birds, and a party of black-crowned night herons along a canal that topped 25 birds. We also had a cool owl encounter. While we were scanning a large field for short-eared owls just before dawn we were surprised by a rush of wings overhead. Allen saw something in the road and I was able to see through my binoculars a great-horned owl with something in its talons. When it flew up the prey appeared to be a duck of some kind, apparently captured at a nearby impoundment.
Marc RibaudoGarner
I did not put much detail into my report yesterday of the Black-headed Gull at the Carolina Beach Lake, mainly because my fat arthritic thumbs do not work that well on the mini-keypad on my cell phone.
When I first spotted the bird, just before 2 PM it was bathing just out from the island in the northeast corner of the lake. It was with about 35 Ring-billed Gulls, some on the water and others on the island. The island also had about 30 Canada Geese, and 3 White Ibis were wading just off the edge. After about 10 minutes it swam over to the shore and stood on the exposed mud below the grass. It stayed there and preened for 30 minutes or so. I was able to walk across the footbridge onto the island and approach to within 20 feet for photographs. The bird remained calm and did not flush. After I left the Island and stopped to send my original post, 3 young women with 2 pre-school children walked onto the island and began feeding birds. The Black-headed Gull initially flushed and flew out over the lake, but then circled back and joined the swarm of Ring-billed Gulls being fed, and obtained at least one piece of food. After the women left, the gull returned to the island edge at nearly th e same spot where it has previously been, and remained there until after I left. I got the impression that it had been visiting the lake for a while, as it was very comfortable with the human traffic present.
I returned today, but did not see it in 2 visits, at 12:50 PM, and again at 2 PM. Today there were fewer gulls present, although 2 Laughing Gulls and an adult Bonaparte's Gull did join the Ring-bills. I left when rain began in earnest, about 2:30. Other birds present both days included 4 White-winged Scoters (2 appeared in Nov. then a third in early Dec.), Buffleheads, Lesser Scaup, Mallards, White Ibis, and Canada Geese.
Appearance. The bird appeared extremely similar to the "first winter" illustration in Sibley 2nd Edition and birding app., except that the feet were brighter orange, and the dark parts of the wings (carpal bar, tips of secondaries, and outer primaries) were more worn and faded to a brownish hue.
The bird was enough larger than a Bonaparte's Gull that I did not even consider that species when I first saw it and began working out the identification.
At least one Cackling Goose at Beasley Rd. No white geese unfortunately.
The CBC group tasked with covering Gull Rock had over 100 species today, including Saltmarsh and Nelson’s Sparrows, King Rail, White-eyed Vireo, and many scoters and loons.
Date: 12/29/19 8:56 am From: Judi Durr (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Re: early spring arrival--Fish Crows 12/29/19 (Durham NC)
Heard 1 or 2 in Clemmons, NC yesterday.
Judi Durr
Sent from my iPhone
> On Dec 29, 2019, at 10:48 AM, Patrick Coin (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> wrote:
>
>
> In the earliest spring arrival I can recall, several of the local Parkwood Lake (southern Durham NC) Fish Crows have returned and were calling repeatedly today. I have usually seen them return in January--cannot recall seeing them in December previously. (I am presuming these are the local breeding birds, as they are calling from their usual hangout where I believe they nest.)
>
> --
> Patrick Coin
> Durham, NC
> <patrickcoin1...>
Date: 12/29/19 7:48 am From: Patrick Coin (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: early spring arrival--Fish Crows 12/29/19 (Durham NC)
In the earliest spring arrival I can recall, several of the local Parkwood Lake (southern Durham NC) Fish Crows have returned and were calling repeatedly today. I have usually seen them return in January--cannot recall seeing them in December previously. (I am presuming these are the local breeding birds, as they are calling from their usual hangout where I believe they nest.)
Date: 12/29/19 5:42 am From: William Majoros <bmajoros...> Subject: White-eyed Vireo in Durham County
I was surprised to see a White-Eyed Vireo at Butner Gamelands on Brickhouse Road in Durham County yesterday morning. The bird was foraging in the bushes next to the last parking lot. This is where I often see them in spring.
On Friday at the same site I also enjoyed good views of an American Kestrel and a Fox Sparrow. The Kestrel was hunting along the power lines near the Flat River, and the Fox Sparrow was along the road that leads to the lake.
--- Bill Majoros, PhD Durham, NC ThirdBirdFromTheSun.com
Date: 12/28/19 4:48 pm From: Steve <sshultz...> Subject: Pungo Snows
The Pungo Snow Geese were in a refuge field just north of the lake this morning. 1 mile east from the gate at D Canal and North Lake Rd. Only spotted about 4 Rossers among the chunky Snows.
Maybe 15,000 birds in the field. More headed farther north.
Date: 12/28/19 11:23 am From: whoffman (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: 1st winter Black-headed Gull Carolina Beach lake
Bird is on beach of island by restrooms, with Ring-bills.Orange legs, pinkish bill with black tip. Larger than Bonaparte's, with more black in wings. Wayne Hoffman Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone
Date: 12/28/19 7:32 am From: Stacy and Natalie Barbour (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Lapland Longspur present- wake nc
This bird is still present on mid Pines Road near Raleigh associating with a flock of pipits. Seven of us had a visual on it a few minutes ago. The flock just flew across the road unfortunately
Date: 12/27/19 12:52 pm From: whoffman (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: My reported "Mottled Duck" is a Black Duck
Mea Culpa!
The "probable Mottled Duck" I reported from a pond SE of Greenfield Lake is a Black Duck.
I went back this morning, this time equipped with binocs and cameras, and found Derb Carter studying the bird. He concluded that it was a Black Duck. I stayed after he left and took numerous photos, and have come to the same conclusion.
It does have a number of mild anomalies in its appearance that contributed to my mis-identification. I do not think any of these are indicative of hybridization with a Mallard. On the other hand, Sebastian Reeber (Waterfowl of North America, Europe, and Asia [2015]) suggested the possibility of occasional hybridization between Black Ducks and Mottled Ducks where their ranges approach (i.e., coastal Carolinas).
First, the bill seems unusually clear yellow for a Black Duck, second, the tertials are paler than typical for a Black Duck, and third the feet are about the same color as those of its companion, female Mallard - (usually a bit redder on Black Duck).
Subtle characters that fit Black Duck better than Mottled Duck include fine streaking on face and throat, no black spot at the gape, a longer, heavier dark eyeline, and no white margin at all showing on the speculum.
Date: 12/27/19 10:00 am From: Caroline Harvey (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Limpkins - not for me:)
left the site for the Limpkins and read Craig’s posting of the dual sighting yesterday.
I had to laugh, as I visited for the third time with no luck. I did get great looks at various Anhingas but not in the company of any Limpkins.
This is a great place and good luck for those that try.
Date: 12/26/19 2:56 pm From: Derb Carter <derbc...> Subject: Wilmington area birds
Common Eider remains at Masonboro Inlet, locked in to the north side of the north jetty when I was there. At the south end of Wrightsville, the adult Black-headed Gull was roosting with the gull flock at Mason Inlet this afternoon. The nearshore ocean had very few birds for this time of year, and I could not locate the Common Loon flock usually present. Also could not find the Lark Sparrow present at Laurel Lea subdivision a few days ago, but 5 Anhinga and the possible MallardxMottled Duck remain on the pond.
Two Limpkins continue at 44N Basilica St, Hanahan, SC. They were first observed in July at this location. One was not observed for a few months, however, both were observed and photographed together about an hour ago with Pam Ford, and Barbara Alexander, the homeowner who first reported the Limpkins.
I saw a probable Mottled Duck in an infiltration/retention pond behind the parking lot at Delaney Radiology, 1025 Medical Center Drive. This is close to the SE end of Greenfield Lake.
It was with a hen Mallard and 4 Hooded mergansers. I was without binoculars or camera, but it looked pretty good - all-yellow bill, pale head and neck was a shade more straw-colored than Black Duck. Body and wings much darker than hen Mallard, nearly as dark but not as cold as Black Duck.
It was another great day to be out all day birding in Durham Co NC today.
I was able to relocated an Immature White-Crowned Sparrow that had been reported earlier in the week. It was #171 for Durham County for me and #161 for the year in Durham Co.
I spent time at Beaver Marsh and Sandy Creek Park looking for others birds needed for Durham Co but no luck.
I was able to get home at 1550 hrs and within 20 minutes I saw my Baltimore Oriole for the day. He is such a beautiful colorful bird.
jeffblalock
eBird Checklist Summary for: Dec 25, 2019
Number of Checklists: 5
Number of Taxa: 49
Checklists included in this summary:
(1): Patrick Rd, Bahama US-NC
Date: Dec 25, 2019 at 6:50 AM
(2): 17 Acre Woods
Date: Dec 25, 2019 at 8:15 AM
(3): Beaver Marsh
Date: Dec 25, 2019 at 11:15 AM
(4): Sandy Creek Park
Date: Dec 25, 2019 at 12:30 PM
(5): Moores Mill Rd, Rougemont US-NC
Date: Dec 25, 2019 at 2:20 PM
Date: 12/25/19 9:13 am From: Harry LeGrand (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Lapland Longspur and Corvus quadfecta near Raleigh
This morning I saw the Greater White-fronted Goose in flight with Ryan and cohorts along Mid-Pines Road. I refound it in the back pond behind The Point Church, but it is hard to see there.
About 1015 I heard a Lapland Longspur call overhead with some Horned Larks and Am. Pipits but could not relocate the birds on the ground. It gave about 3 TEW notes and several short rattles.
I did manage to hear a Fish Crow from the right angle bend. And Phil Doerr got me onto the pair of Common Ravens around 1130 from the same spot, as they flew to the south over Yates Pond, calling back to my tape. They have been around for over a month! Of course I had plenty of American Crows and Blue Jays.
None of the 6 other birders I ran into at the farm fields could find the elusive Peregrine Falcon. It was seen a day or two ago, and has been around for the fourth winter here, assuming the same bird.
Also saw a few Palm Warblers and a huge flock of about 65 Killdeers.
Not a bad Christmas morning. Hope I or someone can refind the Longspur, on the ground, not an easy task owing to the fences along the road.
Date: 12/25/19 5:33 am From: William Majoros <bmajoros...> Subject: Warblers persist at Sandy Creek in Durham
Yesterday, with the help of another birder, I again found the Black and White Warbler at Sandy Creek (assuming it was the same bird from Sunday). This time it was in a tree beside the parking lot.
I also saw an Orange-Crowned Warbler at the wooden bridge, with distinctly yellow undertail coverts. I'm guessing the bird I saw Sunday, despite having white undertail coverts, might have just been an Orange-Crowned with less yellow under the tail than I expected.
--- Bill Majoros, PhD Durham, NC ThirdBirdFromTheSun.com
Date: 12/24/19 1:02 pm From: Marc Ribaudo (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Merlin in Garner
This afternoon while walking to the mailbox in our Garner neighborhood a Merlin circled low overhead, making several passes at what I believe were sparrows cemented to the ground. They would not flush, which would have pleased the Merlin. This is the second time in a few weeks I have seen a Merlin in our subdivision. May be wintering in the area.
Date: 12/24/19 8:43 am From: Rob G (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: best Xmas gift so far ;)
This morning I was perusing a recently-built beaver dam on our little Tom's Creek that runs right through my apt. complex when I heard a tell-tale tap-tap-tap just over my head; I looked up to see a Pileated Woodpecker working 25 ft. above me... can't recall for sure, but maybe the first PIWO I've seen in this apt. complex in the 5+ yrs. I've been here.
Forgot to mention, also nice in that area was a noisy flock of 60 Rusty Blackbirds.
Nick Flanders
Portsmouth, VA
________________________________
From: <carolinabirds-request...> <carolinabirds-request...> on behalf of nicholas <carolinabirds...>
Sent: Monday, December 23, 2019 9:51:49 PM
To: CAROLINA BIRDS <carolinabirds...>
Subject: Snow Goose, Nash Co., NC, 12/20/19
Spent a few hours on 12/20 helping with Rocky Mount CBC and had 1 Snow Goose with a flock of Canada Geese in a marshy area off the railroad tracks south of Whitakers just north of Swift Creek.
Spent a few hours on 12/20 helping with Rocky Mount CBC and had 1 Snow Goose with a flock of Canada Geese in a marshy area off the railroad tracks south of Whitakers just north of Swift Creek.
Date: 12/23/19 5:47 am From: William Majoros <bmajoros...> Subject: Black & White Warbler in Durham, and possible Tennessee
Yesterday morning I was very surprised to see a Black and White Warbler at Sandy Creek park in Durham. The bird was foraging near the wooden bridge, on the paved trail that runs to Pickett Road.
Further down the same trail I got very clear views of what looked like a Tennessee Warbler, though I'm less certain of that ID.
I also saw many golden- and ruby-crowned kinglets and several brown creepers in addition to the usual sparrows, chickadees, and titmice.
--- Bill Majoros, PhD Durham, NC ThirdBirdFromTheSun.com
Date: 12/22/19 10:20 am From: Harry LeGrand (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Re: Wintering Fish Crows -- Hickory Area
They are “semi” early winter residents in Wake County. They are about 50-50 on a Christmas count. They may have been missed on the CBC a week ago, but Phil Doerr had one this morning just south of Raleigh. About Jan 15-20 a few start “returning” on territory, even as the coldest weather has still not set in. I do see or hear it at times in Dec into mid-Jan. But, no, there is no reliable location where they can be found now and for a few more weeks.
But, we are getting a few Common Ravens now this winter and at times all year. Two parties had Raven on the count last week, and two birds have been hanging around The NC State Farm fields for a month now.
Date: 12/22/19 9:38 am From: scompton1251 <scompton1251...> Subject: Re: mockingbird
Mockingbirds like suet and mealworms. Provide those in a separate feeder and it takes away some of their interest. Steve ComptonGreenville, SC Sent from my Verizon LG Smartphone------ Original message------From: <jschultz...>: Sun, Dec 22, 2019 11:14 AMTo: '<carolinabirds...>';Cc: Subject:mockingbirdWe have a very aggressive Mockingbird that seems to be driving off the other feeder birds. Is there an easy solution?John SchultzWinston-Salem
Date: 12/22/19 8:34 am From: Dwayne Martin (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Wintering Fish Crows -- Hickory Area
I was just at the Walmart about a mile north of Hickory in Caldwell County and had a flock of 10 Fish Crows. This is actually not unusual for the Hickory area. We have had wintering Fish Crows for the last 10 years or so. I just find it interesting that they seem to leave areas like Raleigh and Charlotte during the winter, yet stay year round here. Are they still absent in Raleigh and Charlotte during the early winter?
Dwayne ************* J. Dwayne Martin Hickory, NC <redxbill...>
