Date: 11/23/23 12:00 am From: Phil Davis <pdavis...> Subject: Re: [MDBirding] MD/DC Records Committee News and Updates
Hi MD/DC Birders:
I made a manual data entry error when I updated the MD/DCRC database to reflect the new AOS taxonomy. Eurasian Goshawk currently appears on our web reports ... I will need to fix this to reflect American Goshawk. Give me a week or so to make and post those report updates.
Sorry for any confusion.
Thanks.
Phil
At 13:17 11/22/2023, Phil Davis wrote:
MD/DC Records Committee News and Updates Below are news and updates from the MD/DC Records Committee ...
1. Database Updates and Taxonomy Changes The committee’s web data products (Official Lists, Review Lists, Abridged databases, etc.) have been updated and now conform with the AOS 64th Supplement Checklist update. These documents, updated as of 13 Oct 2023, can be found on the committee’s web pages …¦
AOS changes that directly affect our regional checklists are:
Northern Goshawk split. The AOS split the Eurasian and North American forms of Northern Goshawk into two species based on significant morphological and genetic differences. The former Northern Goshawk (Accipiter gentilis) is now renamed Eurasian Goshawk. Split from the former Northern Goshawk is the new American Goshawk (Accipiter atricapillus).
Pacific-slope Flycatcher lump. The AOS determined that the previous 1989 split of Western Flycatcher into Pacific-slope and Cordilleran Flycatcher was a bad split. In the 64th supplement, the Pacific-slope Flycatcher (Empidonax difficilis) was renamed Western Flycatcher and the former Cordilleran Flycatcher (E. occidentalis) was deleted. This re-lumping is due to a lack of consistent vocal, genetic, morphological differences and extensive hybridization across much of their range. However, the restored Western Flycatcher now encompasses five subspecies, two of which were previously considered to comprise the "Cordilleran Flycatcher".
Note: The MD/DCRC has several “Pacific-slope†(Western) Flycatchers in its review queue. These reviews had been held up pending completion of DNA analyses on fecal samples from one of the birds. There were some complications with this DNA testing, but since test results are now moot, the committee will move forward with these reviews.
Note: A correction was made to the MD/DCRC database to reflect the proper order of King and Clapper Rail. King Rail now precedes Clapper Rail, per the AOS.
2. Review List Changes: The following changes were made to the MD and DC Review Lists:
Maryland
Common Raven This species was most recently placed in Maryland Review category 4E, reviewable south of Cecil County on the Eastern Shore. The status of this species is changing fast and is now not unusual in Kent or Queen Anne’s Counties. Although there are no records yet for the lower Eastern Shore, the committee voted to remove this species from the Maryland Review List and leave future record confirmations to the eBird Team.
Thick-billed Murre Records are now not uncommon at Ocean City Inlet, so the committee voted to move this species from Category 2 (reviewable statewide) to Category 4B (Species seen in locations other than over the ocean, coastal Worcester County, in major Chesapeake Bay tributaries, or along the Potomac River south of Prince George's County.)
DC
Since there is only one accepted record, the committee agreed to add Cave Swallow to the DC Review List.
3. Annual Meeting The MD/DCRC Annual Meeting was held in February 2023. Detailed meeting minutes and the annual business summary can be found on the committee’s web page here …
4. Elections and New Members Members completing their three-year voting terms were Daniel Irons, Frank Marenghi, and Alex Wiebe. The committee thanks them for all their efforts over the past years. The new members elected for three-year terms were Gerry Hawkins (Arlington, VA), Marisa Rositol (Prince George’s County), and Andy Wilson (Frederick County). Matt Hafner was reelected as Chair. Phil Davis was reelected as Secretary.
Happy Thanksgiving and good birding!
Phil
=================================================== Phil Davis, Secretary MD/DC Records Committee 2549 Vale Court Davidsonville, Maryland 21035 USA web: https://mdbirds.org/records-committee/ email: <pdavis...> phone: 301-261-0184 ===================================================
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Date: 11/22/23 10:17 am From: Phil Davis <pdavis...> Subject: [MDBirding] MD/DC Records Committee News and Updates
MD/DC Records Committee News and Updates Below are news and updates from the MD/DC Records Committee ...
1. Database Updates and Taxonomy Changes The committee’s web data products (Official Lists, Review Lists, Abridged databases, etc.) have been updated and now conform with the AOS 64th Supplement Checklist update. These documents, updated as of 13 Oct 2023, can be found on the committee’s web pages …
AOS changes that directly affect our regional checklists are:
Northern Goshawk split. The AOS split the Eurasian and North American forms of Northern Goshawk into two species based on significant morphological and genetic differences. The former Northern Goshawk (Accipiter gentilis) is now renamed Eurasian Goshawk. Split from the former Northern Goshawk is the new American Goshawk (Accipiter atricapillus).
Pacific-slope Flycatcher lump. The AOS determined that the previous 1989 split of Western Flycatcher into Pacific-slope and Cordilleran Flycatcher was a bad split. In the 64th supplement, the Pacific-slope Flycatcher (Empidonax difficilis) was renamed Western Flycatcher and the former Cordilleran Flycatcher (E. occidentalis) was deleted. This re-lumping is due to a lack of consistent vocal, genetic, morphological differences and extensive hybridization across much of their range. However, the restored Western Flycatcher now encompasses five subspecies, two of which were previously considered to comprise the "Cordilleran Flycatcher".
Note: The MD/DCRC has several “Pacific-slope” (Western) Flycatchers in its review queue. These reviews had been held up pending completion of DNA analyses on fecal samples from one of the birds. There were some complications with this DNA testing, but since test results are now moot, the committee will move forward with these reviews.
Note: A correction was made to the MD/DCRC database to reflect the proper order of King and Clapper Rail. King Rail now precedes Clapper Rail, per the AOS.
2. Review List Changes: The following changes were made to the MD and DC Review Lists:
Maryland
Common Raven This species was most recently placed in Maryland Review category 4E, reviewable south of Cecil County on the Eastern Shore. The status of this species is changing fast and is now not unusual in Kent or Queen Anne’s Counties. Although there are no records yet for the lower Eastern Shore, the committee voted to remove this species from the Maryland Review List and leave future record confirmations to the eBird Team.
Thick-billed Murre Records are now not uncommon at Ocean City Inlet, so the committee voted to move this species from Category 2 (reviewable statewide) to Category 4B (Species seen in locations other than over the ocean, coastal Worcester County, in major Chesapeake Bay tributaries, or along the Potomac River south of Prince George's County.)
DC
Since there is only one accepted record, the committee agreed to add Cave Swallow to the DC Review List.
3. Annual Meeting The MD/DCRC Annual Meeting was held in February 2023. Detailed meeting minutes and the annual business summary can be found on the committee’s web page here …
4. Elections and New Members Members completing their three-year voting terms were Daniel Irons, Frank Marenghi, and Alex Wiebe. The committee thanks them for all their efforts over the past years. The new members elected for three-year terms were Gerry Hawkins (Arlington, VA), Marisa Rositol (Prince George’s County), and Andy Wilson (Frederick County). Matt Hafner was reelected as Chair. Phil Davis was reelected as Secretary.
Happy Thanksgiving and good birding!
Phil
=================================================== Phil Davis, Secretary MD/DC Records Committee 2549 Vale Court Davidsonville, Maryland 21035 USA web: https://mdbirds.org/records-committee/ email: <pdavis...> phone: 301-261-0184 ===================================================
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Date: 11/17/23 7:32 am From: Evelyn Ralston <evelynsralston...> Subject: Re: [MDBirding] Has anyone been to the sax-Zimbabwean bog in Minnesota?
I went in 2020, just in time! This was a trip from Red Hill Birding (https://www.redhillbirding.com/tours-2024), a Chicago-based company. We were staying in a comfortable unpretentious hotel in Duluth and traveling with a van (group of 7 to 8). Our guide, Josh Engel, knew were to find the owls and was in touch with locals who called him when something new appeared. That’s how we could see the Boreal Owl that, for me, was the best bird of the week.
Evelyn Ralston
> On Nov 16, 2023, at 9:29 AM, Christine Ley <chrisley21...> wrote:
>
> We are thinking of going there in Jan. Or February. Is it worth it? Are there any other places to bird near there? Any advice, other than wear warm clothes?
> Thanks.
> Chris Ley
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
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Date: 11/17/23 6:59 am From: Steve Long <steve.long4...> Subject: Re: [MDBirding] OFF TOPIC: Coyotes? Tuesday this week
Interesting. I have heard coyotes and wolves howling in Montana, and
have seen them very near my home in Maryland, but have never heard them
here. Relatives in upper Pennsylvania hear them doing their hunting
party "yips", but I am not hearing them doing that around here, either.
I suspect it has something to do with whether they are in packs or just
pairs, and whether they feel dominant or threatened in their territory.
I am seeing foxes hunting in daylight routinely near my home, so I am
suspecting that there are coyotes nearby that have taken over the night
shift. There are some dogs around, so I suspect the coyotes here are
not feeling dominant.
Steve Long, Oxford (area)
On 11/17/2023 9:52 AM, Rick Borchelt wrote:
> What Marcia said. Had a nice pack sing at Fran Uhler a couple weeks
> ago. Of course I don't know where you are reporting this from and the
> audio doesn't say; if it's the middle of the Inner Harbor that might
> be news but otherwise you can expect them in numbers in practically
> every rural or semi-rural area in the state. Research to date
> suggests that urban coyotes are much more circumspect and seldom
> engage in pack song.
>
> On Fri, Nov 17, 2023 at 9:48 AM Marcia Watson
> <marshwren50...> wrote:
>
> I was hearing coyotes regularly this past spring at my house in
> Bowie, before we moved. And got a photo of one in my backyard. DNR
> will tell you that coyotes now breed in every county in the state.
> I stopped reprting them years ago because DNR was not interested.
>
> Marcia
>
> _____________
>
> Marcia Watson
>
> Phoenix, MD
>
>
>> On Nov 17, 2023, at 9:41 AM, JAMES SPEICHER
>> <jugornought...> wrote:
>>
>>
>> I had to break up the audio into two parts, distant and close
>> groups assumed to be interacting. Some vocalizing b4 i was able
>> to begin recording. Total time recorded was just over a minute,
>> then silence.
>>
>> I heard coyotes long ago in Oklahoma. They are around, of course,
>> but this suggests a pretty healthy population. I wondered if DNR
>> might be interested.
>>
>> Jim Speicher
>> Broad Run/Burkittsville
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>> <Tuesday, 11_14_2023, 11_42 PM (2)_104620.wav>
>> <Tuesday, 11_14_2023, 11_42 PM (3)_104729.wav>
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>
>
>
> --
> Rick Borchelt
> College Park, MD
> preferred personal email: rborchelt |AT| gmail |DOT| com
>
> http://leplog.wordpress.com > --
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Date: 11/17/23 6:53 am From: Stella T <stazandgazer...> Subject: Re: [MDBirding] OFF TOPIC: Coyotes? Tuesday this week
I usually have one but have seen two caught on our trail cams regularly
especially during warmer months in suburban Montgomery County. It never
occurred to me to inform DNR.
Best,
Stella Tea
Silver Spring, MD
On Fri, Nov 17, 2023, 8:48 AM Marcia Watson <marshwren50...> wrote:
> I was hearing coyotes regularly this past spring at my house in Bowie,
> before we moved. And got a photo of one in my backyard. DNR will tell you
> that coyotes now breed in every county in the state. I stopped reprting
> them years ago because DNR was not interested.
>
> Marcia
>
> _____________
>
> Marcia Watson
>
> Phoenix, MD
>
> On Nov 17, 2023, at 9:41 AM, JAMES SPEICHER <jugornought...> wrote:
>
>
> I had to break up the audio into two parts, distant and close groups
> assumed to be interacting. Some vocalizing b4 i was able to begin
> recording. Total time recorded was just over a minute, then silence.
>
> I heard coyotes long ago in Oklahoma. They are around, of course, but this
> suggests a pretty healthy population. I wondered if DNR might be interested.
>
> Jim Speicher
> Broad Run/Burkittsville
>
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> <Tuesday, 11_14_2023, 11_42 PM (2)_104620.wav>
> <Tuesday, 11_14_2023, 11_42 PM (3)_104729.wav>
>
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Date: 11/17/23 6:52 am From: Rick Borchelt <rborchelt...> Subject: Re: [MDBirding] OFF TOPIC: Coyotes? Tuesday this week
What Marcia said. Had a nice pack sing at Fran Uhler a couple weeks ago.
Of course I don't know where you are reporting this from and the audio
doesn't say; if it's the middle of the Inner Harbor that might be news but
otherwise you can expect them in numbers in practically every rural or
semi-rural area in the state. Research to date suggests that urban coyotes
are much more circumspect and seldom engage in pack song.
On Fri, Nov 17, 2023 at 9:48 AM Marcia Watson <marshwren50...>
wrote:
> I was hearing coyotes regularly this past spring at my house in Bowie,
> before we moved. And got a photo of one in my backyard. DNR will tell you
> that coyotes now breed in every county in the state. I stopped reprting
> them years ago because DNR was not interested.
>
> Marcia
>
> _____________
>
> Marcia Watson
>
> Phoenix, MD
>
> On Nov 17, 2023, at 9:41 AM, JAMES SPEICHER <jugornought...> wrote:
>
>
> I had to break up the audio into two parts, distant and close groups
> assumed to be interacting. Some vocalizing b4 i was able to begin
> recording. Total time recorded was just over a minute, then silence.
>
> I heard coyotes long ago in Oklahoma. They are around, of course, but this
> suggests a pretty healthy population. I wondered if DNR might be interested.
>
> Jim Speicher
> Broad Run/Burkittsville
>
> --
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> <Tuesday, 11_14_2023, 11_42 PM (2)_104620.wav>
> <Tuesday, 11_14_2023, 11_42 PM (3)_104729.wav>
>
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>
--
Rick Borchelt
College Park, MD
preferred personal email: rborchelt |AT| gmail |DOT| com
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Date: 11/16/23 7:31 am From: Christine Ley <chrisley21...> Subject: Re: [MDBirding] Has anyone been to the sax-Zimbabwean bog in Minnesota?
Thank you for all your tips and info about the bog. Yes, now back to Md. birding. Anyone can email me personally if they have any additional info.
Chris
Sent from my iPad
> On Nov 16, 2023, at 10:25 AM, Rick Borchelt <rborchelt...> wrote:
>
> Sax-Zim has the distinction of providing me my life bird seen at the lowest temperature — Northern Hawk Owl at -38F.
>
> A couple of other tips — check out the map of feeder stations scattered throughout the area. Many of the specialist birds (other than owls) and the occasional pine marten frequent well stocked feeders across the bog area, many maintained by private citizens and some by the Friends (all would appreciate a few dollars to defray the cost of the feed and feeders if you go). I got Spruce Grouse, Pine Grosbeak, Boreal Chickadee, and unimaginable flocks of Evening Grosbeaks (among others) on that same cold trip.
>
> And even if you prefer to be a solo birder (I’ve done the bog both with a guide — which I *highly* recommend for your first day there, and then you know the layout of the area and can mop up anything you missed on subsequent days — and on my own), join whatever notification lists are running when you go. When I was there it was a GroupMe feed, now I think it’s a Discord feed. Invaluable.
>
> We should probably return to MD birds with this conversation now, but there are regular conversations about birding the Bog on Facebook. There’s even a dedicated page, Sax-Zim Bog, with current conditions and sightings. And of course start tracking the eBird lists from there a couple weeks before you go; that way you’ll know which parts of the Bog are producing which birds.
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
>> On Nov 16, 2023, at 10:09 AM, Chas Argent <chas.argent...> wrote:
>>
>> There are a series of videos on YouTube by a guy named Sparky Stensaas
>> who is from Minnesota and is involved with the organization; they give
>> you a good sense of the place. Here are a few links:
>>
>> https://youtu.be/8Yfnlhc0yPw?si=A7DsTCvdswTgICld >>
>> https://youtu.be/utRjCBAgKFM?si=VDeRedTDSOhqiafv >>
>> ~Chas
>>
>>>> On Thu, Nov 16, 2023 at 9:29 AM Christine Ley <chrisley21...> wrote:
>>>
>>> We are thinking of going there in Jan. Or February. Is it worth it? Are there any other places to bird near there? Any advice, other than wear warm clothes?
>>> Thanks.
>>> Chris Ley
>>>
>>> Sent from my iPad
>>>
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Date: 11/16/23 7:24 am From: Sarah Lister <samjlister13...> Subject: Re: [MDBirding] Has anyone been to the sax-Zimbabwean bog in Minnesota?
I've been twice, summer and winter. I'm addicted. Consider a guide for the first day if you can (list on website). Also stop at the Welcome Center first. Take the tips seriously. The roadside ditches are deep, lurking beneath the plow-mounds. The terrain is flat otherwise and well maintained, but can be icy. The "avoid" properties are for real. Visit all of the feeders, a few of the boardwalks, and the Wilbert Cafe for lifer pie! Feel the magic!!
On Thu, Nov 16, 2023, 9:29 AM Christine Ley <chrisley21...> wrote:
> We are thinking of going there in Jan. Or February. Is it worth it? Are > there any other places to bird near there? Any advice, other than wear > warm clothes? > Thanks. > Chris Ley > > Sent from my iPad > > -- > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > Group 'Maryland & DC Birding'. > To view group guidelines or change email preferences, visit this group on > the web at http://www.mdbirding.com > Unfamiliar with a hotspot mentioned on this list? Quickly locate it here - > http://www.mdbirding.com/hotspot.html > --- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Maryland & DC Birding" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to mdbirding+<unsubscribe...> > To view this discussion on the web visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/mdbirding/<BE9FED92-0D25-4846-A304-B8CC9D79553C...> > . >
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Date: 11/16/23 7:17 am From: pbudde <pbudde...> Subject: Re: [MDBirding] Has anyone been to the sax-Zimbabwean bog in Minnesota?
Sax-Zim Bog is an awesome place in winter. Just about any northern/winter bird can be found there: Rough-legged Hawks, Boreal Chickadees, Evening and Pine grosbeaks, both redpolls, sometimes Black-backed Woodpeckers and Three-toed (unusual) might be just north of the bog. There are good feeders in the area to help you find many of these birds.Both Great Gray and Northern Hawk Owls are usually present, though numbers vary from year to year. More seem to show up as the winter continues, so February would be a good time. A Boreal Owl might be along the Lake Superior coast, and Snowy Owls are usually in Duluth. Duluth could also have a nice variety of gulls.A bit farther afield, Spruce Grouse can often be found in the early morning at the north end of Lake County Road 2, north of Two Harbors.There are accommodations near the bog in Virginia, and many more options in Duluth. Besides being prepared for the cold, be careful driving in the bog. The roads are well-plowed but they can be icy. If you come upon a group of cars ( probably watching a feeder or a hunting owl), just park on one side of the road so local traffic isn't impeded.It's a great winter birding destination, so have fun!PaulPaul BuddeWashington DC, but formerly from Minnesota.Sent from my Galaxy
-------- Original message --------From: 'Robert Parsons' via Maryland & DC Birding <mdbirding...> Date: 11/16/23 8:56 AM (GMT-06:00) To: Barry Marsh <barry.d.marsh...>, Christine Ley <chrisley21...> Cc: <mdbirding...> Subject: Re: [MDBirding] Has anyone been to the sax-Zimbabwean bog in Minnesota?
We had a great trip there in February two years ago Agree—it is cold but just plan on that. Lots of cool boreal birds. Great Gray and Snowy Owls are regularly but it can take a lot of driving around (or tied in with some locals)
to find. Hawk Owl and Boreal are much tougher and not always there. Good article on this area in the last ABA Birding Travel magazine
Robert Parsons.
Get Outlook for iOS
From: <mdbirding...> <mdbirding...> on behalf of Barry Marsh <barry.d.marsh...>
Sent: Thursday, November 16, 2023 7:42:37 AM
To: Christine Ley <chrisley21...>
Cc: <mdbirding...> <mdbirding...>
Subject: Re: [MDBirding] Has anyone been to the sax-Zimbabwean bog in Minnesota?
I attended the Sax-Zim Bog Birding Festival in Feb 2019 (the last one before the annual event was canceled). The Bog is definitely worth a trip in Jan/Feb. Get in touch with the Friends of Sax-Zim Bog and they can get you all the details
on where to go. And dress very warmly - the warmest day when I was there was 19F; the coldest was -21F.
Barry D. Marsh
Towson
443-416-3192
> On Nov 16, 2023, at 09:29, Christine Ley <chrisley21...> wrote:
>
> We are thinking of going there in Jan. Or February. Is it worth it? Are there any other places to bird near there? Any advice, other than wear warm clothes?
> Thanks.
> Chris Ley
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
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Date: 11/16/23 6:52 am From: Maryanne Dolan <maryanne.dolan...> Subject: Re: [MDBirding] Has anyone been to the sax-Zimbabwean bog in Minnesota?
I was there pre-covid with a group. We got 5 owls in one day (including a
Boreal). I highly recommend a guide and a group. It's a large area.
Maryanne Dolan
Elkton MD
On Thu, Nov 16, 2023 at 9:42 AM Barry Marsh <barry.d.marsh...> wrote:
> I attended the Sax-Zim Bog Birding Festival in Feb 2019 (the last one
> before the annual event was canceled). The Bog is definitely worth a trip
> in Jan/Feb. Get in touch with the Friends of Sax-Zim Bog and they can get
> you all the details on where to go. And dress very warmly - the warmest day
> when I was there was 19F; the coldest was -21F.
>
> Barry D. Marsh
> Towson
> 443-416-3192
>
> > On Nov 16, 2023, at 09:29, Christine Ley <chrisley21...> wrote:
> >
> > We are thinking of going there in Jan. Or February. Is it worth it? Are
> there any other places to bird near there? Any advice, other than wear
> warm clothes?
> > Thanks.
> > Chris Ley
> >
> > Sent from my iPad
> >
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>
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Date: 11/15/23 1:37 pm From: Harry Armistead <harryarmistead...> Subject: [MDBirding] Ferry Neck, Nov. 8-12, 2023 (& Philadelphia Nov. 11)
FERRY NECK, NOVEMBER 8-12, 2023 (and Philadelphia November 11).
NOVEMBER 8, WEDNESDAY. arrive c. 3:45. A common loon with a hogchoker. 2 deer (does). 55 Canada geese in the cove. It’s become VERY, close to alarmingly, dry.
NOVEMBER 9, THURSDAY. 59-69, clear becoming fair then mostly overcast, SW or S 1-5 then calm. At Lucy Point great shafts of light either side of a dark cloud, the shafts visually hitting Cook’s Point, Holland Point, and Black Walnut Point. Impressive sky spectacle, what my brother, Gordy, used to say looking as if God was going to make a personal appearance. From the point: 29 buffleheads and 2 common loons (only heard, the tremolo). In the dryness fun to drive the west and north sides of Field 1.
From the yard: 9 black vultures, 17 turkey vultures, an adult osprey (dives 3X to no avail), a bald eagle, 2 sharp-shinned hawks, 3 Cooper’s hawks, 2 red-tailed hawks, 1 red-shouldered hawks, 2 pileated woodpeckers (at home right in the yard; one cuts loose with alarm calls when a Cooper’s hawk flies nearby), 7 robins, a male towhee, 4 Forster’s terns, 3 gray squirrels, 20 laughing gulls feeding aerially (I’m told this is because of flying ants). Canada geese build up from 140 to 320 in the cove. Cocktails with Michael & Nancy Lytell.
NOVEMBER 10, FRIDAY. 47-51, overcast, NW 15-20-10, occasional very light rain. Do the winterization routines. 7 robins at our small bird bath at the same time. 5 gray squirrels at the feed plus 1 on the drive. At 1 P.M. I do my screech-owl imitation from the front porch that draws in a hermit thrush, 2 cardinals, 1 Carolina wren, and 3 blue jays.
While attending the Pump House a small buck suddenly appears 50’ away and stares at me for a while. Dinner with Thuy Tran and Bob Anderson at Osteria Alfredo. This time, and the previous visit, 3 of 4 of us go with the delicious spaghetti a toti mare (sp?), comes with a big shrimp, calimari, and mussels.
NOVEMBER 11, SATURDAY. 48-64. fair becoming clear, NW 15-5 - calm. 19 ring-billed gulls in the cove, 2 common loons, 3 Forster’s terns, 1 sharp-shinned hawk, 2 adult bald eagles, 1 eastern phoebe, 4 bluebirds, 3 brown-headed nuthatches 3 (unafraid, some as close as 20 feet).
A fox squirrel in Field 1 but right next to the lawn bluebird house. Seldom do we see them near or in the yard. 7 gray squirrels at the feed simultaneously. You’d think it was FURsday, FURiday, or POOHsday instead of SatFURday. Yes, things can get a little squirrely here. Nuts in fact.
Dinner again with Thuy and Bob at Pho Van. My favorite, though not that distinctively Vietnamese, is (small) shrimp fried rice. Bob is here for the Waterfowl Festival where he exhibits his carvings.
George has a banner day at his house in Roxborough in NW Philadelphia where he sees 4 golden eagles go over (1 immature well-photographed), a flock of Canada geese in which there is a cackling goose (also well-photographed), plus a common raven.
Seems to be a good year for golden eagles. Kiptopeke, Virginia, so far east and so far south, has already seen 18 finding them in 10 of 15 days in November. 18 ties the record for there. Excellent reporting from there, the best ever, can be seen via hawkcount.org. Waggoner’s Gap, PA, a notorious GOEA site, has 117 so far this season.
NOVEMBER 12, SUNDAY. 42, northeast 10-15, fair. See what is probably the same little buck seen on Friday. Leave at 10:08 A.M. On the way home to Philadelphia 2 adult bald eagles east of Wilmington perched in the oak grove where there was a nest for several years, in red oaks.
Baccharis halimifolia, so notable for its blowing white seeds in the fall, has not yet been that way when the seeds blow like minor snow flurries. Seems real late. A.K.A. groundsel tree, high tide bush, or saltwater bush.
Best to all. - Harry Armistead, Bellevue, MD & Philadelphia.
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Date: 11/15/23 9:54 am From: Kevin Graff <keyweststyle2001...> Subject: [MDBirding] Loch Raven Reservoir, 11/15/23
11/15/23 - 751am-1041am Loch Raven Reservoir--Old Picnic Area Trail, B Co., MD
WEATHER: MC, 35-48, ENE 2- ESE 5 OBS: 3
Canada Goose - 270 Gadwall - 28 American Wigeon - 51 American Black Duck - 2 Mallard - 2 Redhead - 2 Ring-necked Duck - 260 Bufflehead - 15 Hooded Merganser - 25 Common Loon - 1 Pied-billed Grebe - 16 Double-crested Cormorant - 3 Great Blue Heron - 3 Black Vulture - 1 Turkey Vulture - 3 Bald Eagle - 3 Common Gallinule - 1 ** American Coot - 325 Bonaparte's Gull - 3 Ring-billed Gull - 2 Mourning Dove - 1 Belted Kingfisher - 1 Yellow-bellied Sapsucker - 4 Red-bellied Woodpecker - 5 Downy Woodpecker - 5 Hairy Woodpecker - 1 Northern Flicker - 2 Blue Jay - 13 American Crow - 25 Fish Crow - 1 Carolina Chickadee - 8 Tufted Titmouse - 5 White-breasted Nuthatch - 5 Brown Creeper - 4 Carolina Wren - 6 Ruby-crowned Kinglet - 4 Golden-crowned Kinglet - 1 Eastern Bluebird - 28 Hermit Thrush - 4 American Robin - 39 Cedar Waxwing - 6 European Starling - 1 Yellow-rumped Warbler - 6 Eastern Towhee - 6 Song Sparrow - 9 White-throated Sparrow - 85 "Slate-colored" Junco - 1 Northern Cardinal - 13 Red-winged Blackbird - 45 Common Grackle - 25 Purple Finch - 2 House Finch - 3 American Goldfinch - 13 SPECIES: 53 INDIVIDUALS: 1393
MAMMALS: Gray Sq - 10
**We have two spots left for Cali, Colombia June 28-July 8, 2024. Contact me for more info**
Kevin Graff Jarrettsville, MD <KeyWeststyle2001...>
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Date: 11/6/23 3:49 pm From: 'Paul Woodford' via Maryland & DC Birding <mdbirding...> Subject: Re: [MDBirding] Where have all my birds gone?
Another possibility is that a hawk has started hanging around your house.
Paul
Ellicott City, MD
> On Nov 6, 2023, at 6:20 PM, John McKitterick <john.mckitterick...> wrote:
>
> This is actually a common question. My belief is that at this time of the year, when seed crops are ripe, the weather remains warm, and the young have fledged and are on their own, that there is plenty of food out there away from the feeders. I've noticed this at my feeders, particularly with the bluebirds, who have now congregated in a flock that roams the neighborhood. When the weather turns colder, they return to the feeder where they can get sunflower chips without the effort to hunt down insects.
>
> When the weather gets colder, they should return.
>
> --John McKitterick
> Columbia, MD
>
>
> On Mon, Nov 6, 2023 at 5:37 PM Dan&Nan <dan-nan-semper...> <mailto:<dan-nan-semper...>> wrote:
>> Your group was SO helpful to me a few years ago when my yard was overrun by pine siskins - I’m hoping you can help again.
>>
>> We had the usual tons of birds & squirrels up until the last week in September. But that week nearly all the birds and squirrels in my yard vanished (finches, wrens, cardinals, doves, woodpeckers, crows, etc. ). I still see a few squirrels in our woods (& we do have MANY nut trees). Also I can still hear some birds in the distance and occasionally see one at the feeders or birdbath. I’m not surprised the blue jays are gone - the ones in my yard always migrate in/out for a few weeks around this time. But other than that I don’t see more than a handful of birds any more. I didn’t even see squirrels at the birdbath.
>>
>> In late summer I did have a horrible problem with seed falling to the ground growing white mold. I did everything I could to keep that cleaned up (& I kept the feeders & birdbath clean) but the mold on the ground was an unending problem. I put heavy blocks below the feeders to make it easier to clean up the fallen seed but still very few birds. And we MISS them.
>>
>> -- Now I’m terrified the moldy seed killed them all.
>> — I also put a tiny solar fountain in our birdbath - could that be scaring them off?
>>
>> Thoughts?
>> Thank you,
>> Nancy Whelton
>> Sent from my iPad
>>
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>
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Date: 11/6/23 3:20 pm From: John McKitterick <john.mckitterick...> Subject: Re: [MDBirding] Where have all my birds gone?
This is actually a common question. My belief is that at this time of the
year, when seed crops are ripe, the weather remains warm, and the young
have fledged and are on their own, that there is plenty of food out there
away from the feeders. I've noticed this at my feeders, particularly with
the bluebirds, who have now congregated in a flock that roams the
neighborhood. When the weather turns colder, they return to the feeder
where they can get sunflower chips without the effort to hunt down insects.
When the weather gets colder, they should return.
--John McKitterick
Columbia, MD
On Mon, Nov 6, 2023 at 5:37 PM Dan&Nan <dan-nan-semper...> wrote:
> Your group was SO helpful to me a few years ago when my yard was overrun
> by pine siskins - I’m hoping you can help again.
>
> We had the usual tons of birds & squirrels up until the last week in
> September. But that week nearly all the birds and squirrels in my yard
> vanished (finches, wrens, cardinals, doves, woodpeckers, crows, etc. ). I
> still see a few squirrels in our woods (& we do have MANY nut trees). Also
> I can still hear some birds in the distance and occasionally see one at the
> feeders or birdbath. I’m not surprised the blue jays are gone - the ones in
> my yard always migrate in/out for a few weeks around this time. But other
> than that I don’t see more than a handful of birds any more. I didn’t even
> see squirrels at the birdbath.
>
> In late summer I did have a horrible problem with seed falling to the
> ground growing white mold. I did everything I could to keep that cleaned
> up (& I kept the feeders & birdbath clean) but the mold on the ground was
> an unending problem. I put heavy blocks below the feeders to make it easier
> to clean up the fallen seed but still very few birds. And we MISS them.
>
> -- Now I’m terrified the moldy seed killed them all.
> — I also put a tiny solar fountain in our birdbath - could that be scaring
> them off?
>
> Thoughts?
> Thank you,
> Nancy Whelton
> Sent from my iPad
>
> --
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Date: 11/6/23 2:37 pm From: Dan&Nan <dan-nan-semper...> Subject: [MDBirding] Where have all my birds gone?
Your group was SO helpful to me a few years ago when my yard was overrun by pine siskins - I’m hoping you can help again.
We had the usual tons of birds & squirrels up until the last week in September. But that week nearly all the birds and squirrels in my yard vanished (finches, wrens, cardinals, doves, woodpeckers, crows, etc. ). I still see a few squirrels in our woods (& we do have MANY nut trees). Also I can still hear some birds in the distance and occasionally see one at the feeders or birdbath. I’m not surprised the blue jays are gone - the ones in my yard always migrate in/out for a few weeks around this time. But other than that I don’t see more than a handful of birds any more. I didn’t even see squirrels at the birdbath.
In late summer I did have a horrible problem with seed falling to the ground growing white mold. I did everything I could to keep that cleaned up (& I kept the feeders & birdbath clean) but the mold on the ground was an unending problem. I put heavy blocks below the feeders to make it easier to clean up the fallen seed but still very few birds. And we MISS them.
-- Now I’m terrified the moldy seed killed them all.
— I also put a tiny solar fountain in our birdbath - could that be scaring them off?
Thoughts?
Thank you,
Nancy Whelton
Sent from my iPad
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Date: 11/6/23 2:37 pm From: Steve Long <steve.long4...> Subject: Re: [MDBirding] Bird Names will be changing!
Considering that this list has a tendency to focus on rarities, I think
you are over-confident about how many people who read it can know for
sure what somebody is posting about without looking up the list of
abbreviations.
Seems pretty inconsistent to think that we should all learn new bird
names to make birding "inclusive" and then require newbies to learn the
abbreviations to understand posts.
On 11/6/2023 3:54 PM, JAMES SPEICHER wrote:
> Guidelines should be linked here...
>
> http://www.mdbirding.com/guidelines.html >
> See #2, but note that it suggests rather than requires full species
> name usage.
>
> I used to be annoyed with the use of codes, but have changed my mind
> over time. All endeavors have their own "language," which evolved as
> the community developed and were found useful. They are not a weapon
> of exclusion and are almost always easily understood.
>
> Jim Speicher
> Jefferson MD
>
> ps I generally don't use a sigblock when my post contains a checklist link
>
> On Mon, Nov 6, 2023, 3:14 PM Cass <enbycass...> wrote:
>
> I'm pretty sure there's a guideline for this email list asking
> people posting here to avoid the codes. It's also frustrating to
> see them in eBird reports. At least using the full name once with
> the code in parentheses would be helpful.
>
> On Mon, Nov 6, 2023, 12:11 PM Lyn Miller <lynsm77...> wrote:
>
> Once any names are changed, if birding is to be more
> inclusive, how about doing away with the use of the code names
> (my term) - see recent topic headings such as LEOW or GHOW.
> Hey, kids, did you hear that alphabet soup bird? Not very
> descriptive or useful in general conversations.
>
> Lyn Miller
> Formerly of Cheverly
>
>
>
>
> On Sunday, November 5, 2023 at 8:09:39 PM UTC-5 Sarah Lister
> wrote:
>
> As I've said, I'm for the renaming, and I've mentioned
> that I would like behavior to be considered along with
> morphology. To that, let me add habitat.
>
> Consider sparrows. Can you imagine trying to distinguish
> that lot using morpho names only? Now they're a mix of
> eponyms (e.g., Lincoln's), morpho (the "X-crowned" cabal),
> behavior (Song, Chipping), and habitat (Saltmarsh).
>
> When it fits, habitat names may work where place names
> won't. It seems that in replacing place names that are too
> narrow, we've gotten more than a few "Northern
> (what'sits)." I don't think this is a great trend, unless
> you've got just two species to distinguish (e.g., Northern
> and Southern flying squirrels). But within small genera,
> even size could work. Our accipiters could be Tall,
> Grande, and Venti. (OK, JK!)
>
> I love involving kids! I don't think Jim suggests that
> they adopt power suits and PowerPoints. But it could be a
> fun activity for younger kids to look at birds (field,
> video, still) and make up names for them. Kids grasp the
> concept of adaptation quite young; this could be a
> variation on that theme. (A current STEM activity involves
> making a new bird with craft supplies, explaining its
> adaptations and natural history, and naming it
> appropriately.) High school students could surely consider
> this renaming initiative as a hybrid
> biology/anatomy/taxonomy and social studies exercise.
> (Yoohoo, Science Fair!!)
>
> Let the meetings begin! Happy Birding! Sarah
>
> On Sun, Nov 5, 2023, 7:33 PM JAMES SPEICHER
> <jugor......> wrote:
>
> Granted kids don't know a Dunlin from a doorknob, but
> they don't need to know that. The idea is to
> incorporate features for the new names replacing
> people. Kids are great at colors and shapes.
>
> Years and years ago we let a day care class at what is
> now Walter Reed Med Center have a go at designing our
> Earth Day T-shirts. It was a total success.
>
> Jim Speicher
>
>
> On Sun, Nov 5, 2023, 5:40 PM <mkbenj......> wrote:
>
> Let the children name them?
>
> How would this work? Because children generally
> don’t know much about birds. At least the children
> I know. Frankly this idea sounds both highly
> impractical and ridiculously naive to me.
>
> Like all other human pursuits, birding and bird
> naming has a complex and sometimes fraught
> history. If you think that complex history can be
> cleansed with some creative renaming (by children
> of all things!) and NPR-inspired cliches about
> “white spaces,” you’re bound to be disappointed.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Sat, Nov 4, 2023 at 1:35 PM JAMES SPEICHER
> <jugor......> wrote:
>
> Although it appears that in Parker's case the
> naming was an honorarium rather than to
> acknowledge "discovery," it's a decision made
> in a vacuum of sorts.
>
> In the case of "good guys" who's birds will be
> renamed, they weren't by any measure the
> "discoverers" of the birds, known to the
> native peoples for eons.
>
> I'm for the renaming.
>
> However, the powers that be should give this a
> lot of thought. Please, not another Washington
> Commanders debacle!
>
> I would suggest that they consult CHILDREN for
> input. Kids have a remarkable ability to hone
> in on what's important in objects that adults
> have largely lost as they've gotten older.
>
> Jim Speicher
>
>
> On Fri, Nov 3, 2023, 11:56 AM Francesca Grifo
> <frances......> wrote:
>
> I get it, I support it. But it’s a band
> aid and we lose the opportunity to honor
> and remember some of the good guys. Back
> in the 90s there was a terrible plane
> crash in Ecuador and a Conservation
> International Rapid Assessment team were
> all killed. I knew Al Gentry who was the
> botanist on board. And knew only by
> reputation the ornithologist- Ted Parker.
> He could walk through neotropical forests
> rapidly identifying hundreds of birds by
> ear in a way some of us can do in our
> forests. Parkers Antbird was named after
> him. Now I know - this move is only North
> American birds - but I imagine there are
> some good people who will lose their
> birds. I also appreciate the mess that
> trying to decide who is good and who is
> not creates. So I get it. I support it but
> I am sad too.
>
> Francesca T. Grifo
> Sent from my iPhone - please forgive my
> brevity!
> “...ignorance more frequently begets
> confidence than does knowledge: it is
> those who know little, and not those who
> know much, who so positively assert that
> this or that problem will never be solved
> by science.
> " Charles Darwin, 1871
>
>
>> On Nov 3, 2023, at 11:32 AM,
>> '<sus......>' via Maryland & DC
>> Birding <mdbi......> wrote:
>>
>> Decided to pull my old copy of
>> ”Obsolete English Names of North American
>> Birds and Their Modern Equivalents” off
>> the shelf. It was published in 1988 by
>> Fish and Wildlife Service.
>>
>> I was particularly intrigued by the old
>> names for the bird the AOU depicted in
>> its media push this week, Sayirnis saya -
>> Say’s Phoebe - named for Thomas Say.
>> This bird was called San Jose Phoebe, San
>> Pedro Martir Phoebe, and Yukon Phoebe
>> before it was named for Say.
>>
>> Say was a significant naturalist of the
>> early 19th century. He came from a Quaker
>> family and I don’t think he has any
>> claims of egregious behavior
>> and/or violations of modern standards
>> against him. He contributed much more to
>> entomology than ornithology, though an
>> expedition for which he served as
>> zoologist in 1821 produced the first
>> descriptions of several western birds. I
>> will be sad to see his name removed from
>> Say’s Phoebe.
>>
>> Also of note, our own Eastern Phoebe is
>> named for Say as well. According to
>> Diana Wells in 100 Birds and How They Got
>> Their Names, “in 1854 Audubon’s eastern
>> and Say’s Phoebe were renamed Sayornis
>> (in honor of Say),” and so the Latin name
>> of Eastern is Sayornis phoebe.
>>
>> David Gersten
>> Laurel, MD
>>
>>
>> <IMG_6808.jpeg>
>>
>> <IMG_6807.jpeg>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Sent from the all new AOL app for iOS
>>
>> On Wednesday, November 1, 2023, 10:40 PM,
>> 'Mike Bowen' via Maryland & DC Birding
>> <mdbi......> wrote:
>>
>> Gail's fascinating tale of Prince
>> Ruspoli and the Turaco to which he
>> gave his name takes me back in memory
>> to a lengthy search I was involved
>> with in November, 2010, mounted by
>> the British bird tour company
>> Birdquest, to look for the Turaco
>> that bears his name in the wilds of
>> Southern Ethiopia. My 2010 bird
>> even seems to sport a crown, which
>> logically argues for retention of the
>> princely name!:
>>
>> <1698892076538blob.jpg>
>>
>>
>> Mike Bowen
>> Bethesda
>>
>> D. H. Michael Bowen
>> 8609 Ewing Drive
>> <https://www.google.com/maps/search/8609+Ewing+Drive+Bethesda,+Maryland+20817?entry=gmail&source=g> >> Bethesda, Maryland 20817
>> <https://www.google.com/maps/search/8609+Ewing+Drive+Bethesda,+Maryland+20817?entry=gmail&source=g> >>
>> Phone: (202) 236-0510
>> <tel:(202)%20236-0510>
>> Ambassador for American Bird
>> Conservancy, helping ABC help the birds
>> eBird volunteer Hotspot
>> Reviewer/Editor for Maryland,
>> Delaware, the District of Columbia,
>> and the Republic of Ghana
>>
>>
>> On Wednesday, November 1, 2023 at
>> 10:17:46 PM EDT, Marcia Watson
>> <marsh......> wrote:
>>
>>
>> Great story, Gail!
>>
>> Marcia
>> ------------
>> Marcia Watson
>> Phoenix, MD
>>
>>
>> > On Nov 1, 2023, at 10:10 PM, Gail
>> Mackiernan <katah......> wrote:
>> >
>> > One eponymous name which I am
>> ambivalent about changing is that of
>> Prince Ruspoli’s Turaco, a
>> pink-tufted, green Turaco found in
>> Ethiopia. Prince Eugenio Ruspoli was
>> a 19th century Italian explorer and
>> naturalist who undertook some of the
>> first expeditions into that part of
>> the Horn of Africa. He collected a
>> number of new species of both plants
>> and animals, and made a number of
>> important ecological, mineralogical
>> and geographical observations.
>> >
>> > However at the same time, he and
>> some of his companions massacred
>> native people and looted their
>> villages. He also slaughtered
>> hundreds of animals, far more than
>> was needed for his scientific
>> collections, just for fun. In other
>> words, he was a really terrible person.
>> >
>> > However, every time I hear the name
>> of that bird, I think about how karma
>> is, really, a bitch. Seems Ruspoli
>> was out collecting specimens in
>> Somalia when he encountered a large
>> bull elephant . Naturally, being who
>> he was, he shot it. The annoyed
>> elephant grabbed Ruspoli with his
>> trunk, swung him around a few times,
>> bashed him to the ground and
>> proceeded to trample him flat. His
>> expedition companions, in examining
>> his effects, found a specimen of an
>> unknown turaco in his collection bag.
>> There were no notes as to where the
>> bird had been shot, other than
>> somewhere in the region. However the
>> species was eventually described
>> named in his honor, Turaco ruspolii
>> (now Menellikornis ruspolii) although
>> it was not for some years that the
>> bird’s origin and habitat was discovered.
>> >
>> > It could be renamed Pink-Crested
>> Turaco but that would really spoil
>> the story of an SOB getting just what
>> he deserved!
>> >
>> > Gail Mackiernan!
>> > Colesville
>> >
>> > Sent from my iPad
>> >
>> >
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>> <IMG_6808.jpeg>
>> <IMG_6807.jpeg>
>> <1698892076538blob.jpg>
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Left on the 31st with a half full hummingbird feeder and came back to an empty one today. Ther must be done stragglers coming thru.
Sigi Hollywood, md
On Fri, Sep 29, 2023, 5:06 PM <jonbarrettphoto...> wrote:
> At least two sightings at my feeder today, both females. One around > mid-day and another close to 4 PM. > > > > *From:* <mdbirding...> <mdbirding...> *On > Behalf Of *JAMES SPEICHER > *Sent:* Monday, September 25, 2023 12:59 PM > *To:* Anna Urciolo <anna.urciolo...> > *Cc:* MDbirding <mdbirding...> > *Subject:* Re: [MDBirding] Hummingbird > > > > In late summer thru first frost hummingbird feeders must compete with > several varieties of Impatiens incl I. capensis (Jewel weed) and locally I. > pallida (pale touch-me-not), which can be distinguished by its yellow > flowers. > > > > At least one continuing today... > > > > Jim Speicher > > S FREDCO > > > > On Mon, Sep 25, 2023, 8:52 AM Anna Urciolo <anna.urciolo...> wrote: > > At feeder 8:50 am today. > > Anna Urciolo > Rockville > > Sent from my iPad > > -- > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > Group 'Maryland & DC Birding'. > To view group guidelines or change email preferences, visit this group on > the web at http://www.mdbirding.com > Unfamiliar with a hotspot mentioned on this list? Quickly locate it here - > http://www.mdbirding.com/hotspot.html > --- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Maryland & DC Birding" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to mdbirding+<unsubscribe...> > To view this discussion on the web visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/mdbirding/<E4546FE2-C173-4B8F-ADBA-ED8AB86E471C...> > . > > -- > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > Group 'Maryland & DC Birding'. > To view group guidelines or change email preferences, visit this group on > the web at http://www.mdbirding.com > Unfamiliar with a hotspot mentioned on this list? Quickly locate it here - > http://www.mdbirding.com/hotspot.html > --- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Maryland & DC Birding" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to mdbirding+<unsubscribe...> > To view this discussion on the web visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/mdbirding/CAAaQ%3DiZNRRd_3dXCU8dZmMzDf3%3DZNPwR6KBn%<3DxYXo9r9r1nc0g...> > <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/mdbirding/CAAaQ%3DiZNRRd_3dXCU8dZmMzDf3%3DZNPwR6KBn%<3DxYXo9r9r1nc0g...>?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> > . > > -- > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > Group 'Maryland & DC Birding'. > To view group guidelines or change email preferences, visit this group on > the web at http://www.mdbirding.com > Unfamiliar with a hotspot mentioned on this list? Quickly locate it here - > http://www.mdbirding.com/hotspot.html > --- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Maryland & DC Birding" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to mdbirding+<unsubscribe...> > To view this discussion on the web visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/mdbirding/025a01d9f318%24dbb38400%24931a8c00%<24...> > <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/mdbirding/025a01d9f318%24dbb38400%24931a8c00%<24...>?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> > . >
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Date: 11/6/23 2:36 pm From: <mkbenjamin68...> Subject: Re: [MDBirding] Bird Names will be changing!
Let the children name them?
How would this work? Because children generally don’t know much about
birds. At least the children I know. Frankly this idea sounds both highly
impractical and ridiculously naive to me.
Like all other human pursuits, birding and bird naming has a complex and
sometimes fraught history. If you think that complex history can be
cleansed with some creative renaming (by children of all things!) and
NPR-inspired cliches about “white spaces,” you’re bound to be disappointed.
On Sat, Nov 4, 2023 at 1:35 PM JAMES SPEICHER <jugornought...> wrote:
> Although it appears that in Parker's case the naming was an honorarium
> rather than to acknowledge "discovery," it's a decision made in a vacuum of
> sorts.
>
> In the case of "good guys" who's birds will be renamed, they weren't by
> any measure the "discoverers" of the birds, known to the native peoples for
> eons.
>
> I'm for the renaming.
>
> However, the powers that be should give this a lot of thought. Please, not
> another Washington Commanders debacle!
>
> I would suggest that they consult CHILDREN for input. Kids have a
> remarkable ability to hone in on what's important in objects that adults
> have largely lost as they've gotten older.
>
> Jim Speicher
>
>
> On Fri, Nov 3, 2023, 11:56 AM Francesca Grifo <francescatgrifo...>
> wrote:
>
>> I get it, I support it. But it’s a band aid and we lose the opportunity
>> to honor and remember some of the good guys. Back in the 90s there was a
>> terrible plane crash in Ecuador and a Conservation International Rapid
>> Assessment team were all killed. I knew Al Gentry who was the botanist on
>> board. And knew only by reputation the ornithologist- Ted Parker. He could
>> walk through neotropical forests rapidly identifying hundreds of birds by
>> ear in a way some of us can do in our forests. Parkers Antbird was named
>> after him. Now I know - this move is only North American birds - but I
>> imagine there are some good people who will lose their birds. I also
>> appreciate the mess that trying to decide who is good and who is not
>> creates. So I get it. I support it but I am sad too.
>>
>> Francesca T. Grifo
>> Sent from my iPhone - please forgive my brevity!
>> “...ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge:
>> it is those who know little, and not those who know much, who so
>> positively assert that this or that problem will never be solved by science.
>> " Charles Darwin, 1871
>>
>>
>> On Nov 3, 2023, at 11:32 AM, '<suscipe...>' via Maryland & DC
>> Birding <mdbirding...> wrote:
>>
>> Decided to pull my old copy of ”Obsolete English Names of North
>> American Birds and Their Modern Equivalents” off the shelf. It was
>> published in 1988 by Fish and Wildlife Service.
>>
>> I was particularly intrigued by the old names for the bird the AOU
>> depicted in its media push this week, Sayirnis saya - Say’s Phoebe -
>> named for Thomas Say. This bird was called San Jose Phoebe, San Pedro
>> Martir Phoebe, and Yukon Phoebe before it was named for Say.
>>
>> Say was a significant naturalist of the early 19th century. He came from
>> a Quaker family and I don’t think he has any claims of egregious behavior
>> and/or violations of modern standards against him. He contributed much
>> more to entomology than ornithology, though an expedition for which he
>> served as zoologist in 1821 produced the first descriptions of several
>> western birds. I will be sad to see his name removed from Say’s Phoebe.
>>
>> Also of note, our own Eastern Phoebe is named for Say as well. According
>> to Diana Wells in 100 Birds and How They Got Their Names, “in 1854
>> Audubon’s eastern and Say’s Phoebe were renamed Sayornis (in honor of
>> Say),” and so the Latin name of Eastern is Sayornis phoebe.
>>
>> David Gersten
>> Laurel, MD
>>
>>
>> <IMG_6808.jpeg>
>>
>> <IMG_6807.jpeg>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Sent from the all new AOL app for iOS
>>
>> On Wednesday, November 1, 2023, 10:40 PM, 'Mike Bowen' via Maryland & DC
>> Birding <mdbirding...> wrote:
>>
>> Gail's fascinating tale of Prince Ruspoli and the Turaco to which he gave
>> his name takes me back in memory to a lengthy search I was involved with in
>> November, 2010, mounted by the British bird tour company Birdquest, to look
>> for the Turaco that bears his name in the wilds of Southern Ethiopia. My
>> 2010 bird even seems to sport a crown, which logically argues for retention
>> of the princely name!:
>>
>> <1698892076538blob.jpg>
>>
>>
>> Mike Bowen
>> Bethesda
>>
>> D. H. Michael Bowen
>> 8609 Ewing Drive
>> <https://www.google.com/maps/search/8609+Ewing+Drive+Bethesda,+Maryland+20817?entry=gmail&source=g> >> Bethesda, Maryland 20817
>> <https://www.google.com/maps/search/8609+Ewing+Drive+Bethesda,+Maryland+20817?entry=gmail&source=g> >> Phone: (202) 236-0510
>> Ambassador for American Bird Conservancy, helping ABC help the birds
>> eBird volunteer Hotspot Reviewer/Editor for Maryland, Delaware, the
>> District of Columbia, and the Republic of Ghana
>>
>>
>> On Wednesday, November 1, 2023 at 10:17:46 PM EDT, Marcia Watson <
>> <marshwren50...> wrote:
>>
>>
>> Great story, Gail!
>>
>> Marcia
>> ------------
>> Marcia Watson
>> Phoenix, MD
>>
>>
>> > On Nov 1, 2023, at 10:10 PM, Gail Mackiernan <katahdinss...>
>> wrote:
>> >
>> > One eponymous name which I am ambivalent about changing is that of
>> Prince Ruspoli’s Turaco, a pink-tufted, green Turaco found in Ethiopia.
>> Prince Eugenio Ruspoli was a 19th century Italian explorer and naturalist
>> who undertook some of the first expeditions into that part of the Horn of
>> Africa. He collected a number of new species of both plants and animals,
>> and made a number of important ecological, mineralogical and geographical
>> observations.
>> >
>> > However at the same time, he and some of his companions massacred
>> native people and looted their villages. He also slaughtered hundreds of
>> animals, far more than was needed for his scientific collections, just for
>> fun. In other words, he was a really terrible person.
>> >
>> > However, every time I hear the name of that bird, I think about how
>> karma is, really, a bitch. Seems Ruspoli was out collecting specimens in
>> Somalia when he encountered a large bull elephant . Naturally, being who he
>> was, he shot it. The annoyed elephant grabbed Ruspoli with his trunk, swung
>> him around a few times, bashed him to the ground and proceeded to trample
>> him flat. His expedition companions, in examining his effects, found a
>> specimen of an unknown turaco in his collection bag. There were no notes as
>> to where the bird had been shot, other than somewhere in the region.
>> However the species was eventually described named in his honor, Turaco
>> ruspolii (now Menellikornis ruspolii) although it was not for some years
>> that the bird’s origin and habitat was discovered.
>> >
>> > It could be renamed Pink-Crested Turaco but that would really spoil the
>> story of an SOB getting just what he deserved!
>> >
>> > Gail Mackiernan!
>> > Colesville
>> >
>> > Sent from my iPad
>> >
>> >
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>>
>>
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>>
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>> <IMG_6808.jpeg>
>> <IMG_6807.jpeg>
>> <1698892076538blob.jpg>
>>
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>>
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See #2, but note that it suggests rather than requires full species name
usage.
I used to be annoyed with the use of codes, but have changed my mind over
time. All endeavors have their own "language," which evolved as the
community developed and were found useful. They are not a weapon of
exclusion and are almost always easily understood.
Jim Speicher
Jefferson MD
ps I generally don't use a sigblock when my post contains a checklist link
On Mon, Nov 6, 2023, 3:14 PM Cass <enbycass...> wrote:
> I'm pretty sure there's a guideline for this email list asking people
> posting here to avoid the codes. It's also frustrating to see them in eBird
> reports. At least using the full name once with the code in parentheses
> would be helpful.
>
> On Mon, Nov 6, 2023, 12:11 PM Lyn Miller <lynsm77...> wrote:
>
>> Once any names are changed, if birding is to be more inclusive, how about
>> doing away with the use of the code names (my term) - see recent topic
>> headings such as LEOW or GHOW. Hey, kids, did you hear that alphabet soup
>> bird? Not very descriptive or useful in general conversations.
>>
>> Lyn Miller
>> Formerly of Cheverly
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Sunday, November 5, 2023 at 8:09:39 PM UTC-5 Sarah Lister wrote:
>>
>>> As I've said, I'm for the renaming, and I've mentioned that I would like
>>> behavior to be considered along with morphology. To that, let me add
>>> habitat.
>>>
>>> Consider sparrows. Can you imagine trying to distinguish that lot using
>>> morpho names only? Now they're a mix of eponyms (e.g., Lincoln's), morpho
>>> (the "X-crowned" cabal), behavior (Song, Chipping), and habitat
>>> (Saltmarsh).
>>>
>>> When it fits, habitat names may work where place names won't. It seems
>>> that in replacing place names that are too narrow, we've gotten more than a
>>> few "Northern (what'sits)." I don't think this is a great trend, unless
>>> you've got just two species to distinguish (e.g., Northern and Southern
>>> flying squirrels). But within small genera, even size could work. Our
>>> accipiters could be Tall, Grande, and Venti. (OK, JK!)
>>>
>>> I love involving kids! I don't think Jim suggests that they adopt power
>>> suits and PowerPoints. But it could be a fun activity for younger kids to
>>> look at birds (field, video, still) and make up names for them. Kids grasp
>>> the concept of adaptation quite young; this could be a variation on that
>>> theme. (A current STEM activity involves making a new bird with craft
>>> supplies, explaining its adaptations and natural history, and naming it
>>> appropriately.) High school students could surely consider this renaming
>>> initiative as a hybrid biology/anatomy/taxonomy and social studies
>>> exercise. (Yoohoo, Science Fair!!)
>>>
>>> Let the meetings begin! Happy Birding! Sarah
>>>
>>> On Sun, Nov 5, 2023, 7:33 PM JAMES SPEICHER <jugor......> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Granted kids don't know a Dunlin from a doorknob, but they don't need
>>>> to know that. The idea is to incorporate features for the new names
>>>> replacing people. Kids are great at colors and shapes.
>>>>
>>>> Years and years ago we let a day care class at what is now Walter Reed
>>>> Med Center have a go at designing our Earth Day T-shirts. It was a total
>>>> success.
>>>>
>>>> Jim Speicher
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Sun, Nov 5, 2023, 5:40 PM <mkbenj......> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Let the children name them?
>>>>>
>>>>> How would this work? Because children generally don’t know much about
>>>>> birds. At least the children I know. Frankly this idea sounds both highly
>>>>> impractical and ridiculously naive to me.
>>>>>
>>>>> Like all other human pursuits, birding and bird naming has a complex
>>>>> and sometimes fraught history. If you think that complex history can be
>>>>> cleansed with some creative renaming (by children of all things!) and
>>>>> NPR-inspired cliches about “white spaces,” you’re bound to be disappointed.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Sat, Nov 4, 2023 at 1:35 PM JAMES SPEICHER <jugor......>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Although it appears that in Parker's case the naming was an
>>>>>> honorarium rather than to acknowledge "discovery," it's a decision made in
>>>>>> a vacuum of sorts.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> In the case of "good guys" who's birds will be renamed, they weren't
>>>>>> by any measure the "discoverers" of the birds, known to the native peoples
>>>>>> for eons.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I'm for the renaming.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> However, the powers that be should give this a lot of thought.
>>>>>> Please, not another Washington Commanders debacle!
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I would suggest that they consult CHILDREN for input. Kids have a
>>>>>> remarkable ability to hone in on what's important in objects that adults
>>>>>> have largely lost as they've gotten older.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Jim Speicher
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Fri, Nov 3, 2023, 11:56 AM Francesca Grifo <frances......>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I get it, I support it. But it’s a band aid and we lose the
>>>>>>> opportunity to honor and remember some of the good guys. Back in the 90s
>>>>>>> there was a terrible plane crash in Ecuador and a Conservation
>>>>>>> International Rapid Assessment team were all killed. I knew Al Gentry who
>>>>>>> was the botanist on board. And knew only by reputation the ornithologist-
>>>>>>> Ted Parker. He could walk through neotropical forests rapidly identifying
>>>>>>> hundreds of birds by ear in a way some of us can do in our forests. Parkers
>>>>>>> Antbird was named after him. Now I know - this move is only North American
>>>>>>> birds - but I imagine there are some good people who will lose their birds.
>>>>>>> I also appreciate the mess that trying to decide who is good and who is not
>>>>>>> creates. So I get it. I support it but I am sad too.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Francesca T. Grifo
>>>>>>> Sent from my iPhone - please forgive my brevity!
>>>>>>> “...ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge:
>>>>>>> it is those who know little, and not those who know much, who so
>>>>>>> positively assert that this or that problem will never be solved by science.
>>>>>>> " Charles Darwin, 1871
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Nov 3, 2023, at 11:32 AM, '<sus......>' via Maryland & DC
>>>>>>> Birding <mdbi......> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Decided to pull my old copy of ”Obsolete English Names of North
>>>>>>> American Birds and Their Modern Equivalents” off the shelf. It was
>>>>>>> published in 1988 by Fish and Wildlife Service.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I was particularly intrigued by the old names for the bird the AOU
>>>>>>> depicted in its media push this week, Sayirnis saya - Say’s Phoebe
>>>>>>> - named for Thomas Say. This bird was called San Jose Phoebe, San Pedro
>>>>>>> Martir Phoebe, and Yukon Phoebe before it was named for Say.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Say was a significant naturalist of the early 19th century. He came
>>>>>>> from a Quaker family and I don’t think he has any claims of egregious
>>>>>>> behavior and/or violations of modern standards against him. He contributed
>>>>>>> much more to entomology than ornithology, though an expedition for which he
>>>>>>> served as zoologist in 1821 produced the first descriptions of several
>>>>>>> western birds. I will be sad to see his name removed from Say’s Phoebe.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Also of note, our own Eastern Phoebe is named for Say as well.
>>>>>>> According to Diana Wells in 100 Birds and How They Got Their Names, “in
>>>>>>> 1854 Audubon’s eastern and Say’s Phoebe were renamed Sayornis (in honor of
>>>>>>> Say),” and so the Latin name of Eastern is Sayornis phoebe.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> David Gersten
>>>>>>> Laurel, MD
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> <IMG_6808.jpeg>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> <IMG_6807.jpeg>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Sent from the all new AOL app for iOS
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Wednesday, November 1, 2023, 10:40 PM, 'Mike Bowen' via Maryland
>>>>>>> & DC Birding <mdbi......> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Gail's fascinating tale of Prince Ruspoli and the Turaco to which he
>>>>>>> gave his name takes me back in memory to a lengthy search I was involved
>>>>>>> with in November, 2010, mounted by the British bird tour company Birdquest,
>>>>>>> to look for the Turaco that bears his name in the wilds of Southern
>>>>>>> Ethiopia. My 2010 bird even seems to sport a crown, which logically
>>>>>>> argues for retention of the princely name!:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> <1698892076538blob.jpg>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Mike Bowen
>>>>>>> Bethesda
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> D. H. Michael Bowen
>>>>>>> 8609 Ewing Drive
>>>>>>> <https://www.google.com/maps/search/8609+Ewing+Drive+Bethesda,+Maryland+20817?entry=gmail&source=g> >>>>>>> Bethesda, Maryland 20817
>>>>>>> <https://www.google.com/maps/search/8609+Ewing+Drive+Bethesda,+Maryland+20817?entry=gmail&source=g> >>>>>>> Phone: (202) 236-0510
>>>>>>> Ambassador for American Bird Conservancy, helping ABC help the birds
>>>>>>> eBird volunteer Hotspot Reviewer/Editor for Maryland, Delaware, the
>>>>>>> District of Columbia, and the Republic of Ghana
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Wednesday, November 1, 2023 at 10:17:46 PM EDT, Marcia Watson <
>>>>>>> <marsh......> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Great story, Gail!
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Marcia
>>>>>>> ------------
>>>>>>> Marcia Watson
>>>>>>> Phoenix, MD
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> > On Nov 1, 2023, at 10:10 PM, Gail Mackiernan <katah......>
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> > One eponymous name which I am ambivalent about changing is that
>>>>>>> of Prince Ruspoli’s Turaco, a pink-tufted, green Turaco found in Ethiopia.
>>>>>>> Prince Eugenio Ruspoli was a 19th century Italian explorer and naturalist
>>>>>>> who undertook some of the first expeditions into that part of the Horn of
>>>>>>> Africa. He collected a number of new species of both plants and animals,
>>>>>>> and made a number of important ecological, mineralogical and geographical
>>>>>>> observations.
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> > However at the same time, he and some of his companions massacred
>>>>>>> native people and looted their villages. He also slaughtered hundreds of
>>>>>>> animals, far more than was needed for his scientific collections, just for
>>>>>>> fun. In other words, he was a really terrible person.
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> > However, every time I hear the name of that bird, I think about
>>>>>>> how karma is, really, a bitch. Seems Ruspoli was out collecting specimens
>>>>>>> in Somalia when he encountered a large bull elephant . Naturally, being who
>>>>>>> he was, he shot it. The annoyed elephant grabbed Ruspoli with his trunk,
>>>>>>> swung him around a few times, bashed him to the ground and proceeded to
>>>>>>> trample him flat. His expedition companions, in examining his effects,
>>>>>>> found a specimen of an unknown turaco in his collection bag. There were no
>>>>>>> notes as to where the bird had been shot, other than somewhere in the
>>>>>>> region. However the species was eventually described named in his honor,
>>>>>>> Turaco ruspolii (now Menellikornis ruspolii) although it was not for some
>>>>>>> years that the bird’s origin and habitat was discovered.
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> > It could be renamed Pink-Crested Turaco but that would really
>>>>>>> spoil the story of an SOB getting just what he deserved!
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> > Gail Mackiernan!
>>>>>>> > Colesville
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> > Sent from my iPad
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> > --
>>>>>>> > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the
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>>>>>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/mdbirding/<38F093C9-F327-4243-9A1D-4BAE25A9ED8A...> >>>>>>> .
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
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>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> --
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>>>>>>> <IMG_6808.jpeg>
>>>>>>> <IMG_6807.jpeg>
>>>>>>> <1698892076538blob.jpg>
>>>>>>>
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>>>>>>>
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Date: 11/6/23 12:14 pm From: Cass <enbycass...> Subject: Re: [MDBirding] Bird Names will be changing!
I'm pretty sure there's a guideline for this email list asking people
posting here to avoid the codes. It's also frustrating to see them in eBird
reports. At least using the full name once with the code in parentheses
would be helpful.
On Mon, Nov 6, 2023, 12:11 PM Lyn Miller <lynsm77...> wrote:
> Once any names are changed, if birding is to be more inclusive, how about
> doing away with the use of the code names (my term) - see recent topic
> headings such as LEOW or GHOW. Hey, kids, did you hear that alphabet soup
> bird? Not very descriptive or useful in general conversations.
>
> Lyn Miller
> Formerly of Cheverly
>
>
>
>
> On Sunday, November 5, 2023 at 8:09:39 PM UTC-5 Sarah Lister wrote:
>
>> As I've said, I'm for the renaming, and I've mentioned that I would like
>> behavior to be considered along with morphology. To that, let me add
>> habitat.
>>
>> Consider sparrows. Can you imagine trying to distinguish that lot using
>> morpho names only? Now they're a mix of eponyms (e.g., Lincoln's), morpho
>> (the "X-crowned" cabal), behavior (Song, Chipping), and habitat
>> (Saltmarsh).
>>
>> When it fits, habitat names may work where place names won't. It seems
>> that in replacing place names that are too narrow, we've gotten more than a
>> few "Northern (what'sits)." I don't think this is a great trend, unless
>> you've got just two species to distinguish (e.g., Northern and Southern
>> flying squirrels). But within small genera, even size could work. Our
>> accipiters could be Tall, Grande, and Venti. (OK, JK!)
>>
>> I love involving kids! I don't think Jim suggests that they adopt power
>> suits and PowerPoints. But it could be a fun activity for younger kids to
>> look at birds (field, video, still) and make up names for them. Kids grasp
>> the concept of adaptation quite young; this could be a variation on that
>> theme. (A current STEM activity involves making a new bird with craft
>> supplies, explaining its adaptations and natural history, and naming it
>> appropriately.) High school students could surely consider this renaming
>> initiative as a hybrid biology/anatomy/taxonomy and social studies
>> exercise. (Yoohoo, Science Fair!!)
>>
>> Let the meetings begin! Happy Birding! Sarah
>>
>> On Sun, Nov 5, 2023, 7:33 PM JAMES SPEICHER <jugor......> wrote:
>>
>>> Granted kids don't know a Dunlin from a doorknob, but they don't need to
>>> know that. The idea is to incorporate features for the new names replacing
>>> people. Kids are great at colors and shapes.
>>>
>>> Years and years ago we let a day care class at what is now Walter Reed
>>> Med Center have a go at designing our Earth Day T-shirts. It was a total
>>> success.
>>>
>>> Jim Speicher
>>>
>>>
>>> On Sun, Nov 5, 2023, 5:40 PM <mkbenj......> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Let the children name them?
>>>>
>>>> How would this work? Because children generally don’t know much about
>>>> birds. At least the children I know. Frankly this idea sounds both highly
>>>> impractical and ridiculously naive to me.
>>>>
>>>> Like all other human pursuits, birding and bird naming has a complex
>>>> and sometimes fraught history. If you think that complex history can be
>>>> cleansed with some creative renaming (by children of all things!) and
>>>> NPR-inspired cliches about “white spaces,” you’re bound to be disappointed.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Sat, Nov 4, 2023 at 1:35 PM JAMES SPEICHER <jugor......>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Although it appears that in Parker's case the naming was an honorarium
>>>>> rather than to acknowledge "discovery," it's a decision made in a vacuum of
>>>>> sorts.
>>>>>
>>>>> In the case of "good guys" who's birds will be renamed, they weren't
>>>>> by any measure the "discoverers" of the birds, known to the native peoples
>>>>> for eons.
>>>>>
>>>>> I'm for the renaming.
>>>>>
>>>>> However, the powers that be should give this a lot of thought. Please,
>>>>> not another Washington Commanders debacle!
>>>>>
>>>>> I would suggest that they consult CHILDREN for input. Kids have a
>>>>> remarkable ability to hone in on what's important in objects that adults
>>>>> have largely lost as they've gotten older.
>>>>>
>>>>> Jim Speicher
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Fri, Nov 3, 2023, 11:56 AM Francesca Grifo <frances......>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> I get it, I support it. But it’s a band aid and we lose the
>>>>>> opportunity to honor and remember some of the good guys. Back in the 90s
>>>>>> there was a terrible plane crash in Ecuador and a Conservation
>>>>>> International Rapid Assessment team were all killed. I knew Al Gentry who
>>>>>> was the botanist on board. And knew only by reputation the ornithologist-
>>>>>> Ted Parker. He could walk through neotropical forests rapidly identifying
>>>>>> hundreds of birds by ear in a way some of us can do in our forests. Parkers
>>>>>> Antbird was named after him. Now I know - this move is only North American
>>>>>> birds - but I imagine there are some good people who will lose their birds.
>>>>>> I also appreciate the mess that trying to decide who is good and who is not
>>>>>> creates. So I get it. I support it but I am sad too.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Francesca T. Grifo
>>>>>> Sent from my iPhone - please forgive my brevity!
>>>>>> “...ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge:
>>>>>> it is those who know little, and not those who know much, who so
>>>>>> positively assert that this or that problem will never be solved by science.
>>>>>> " Charles Darwin, 1871
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Nov 3, 2023, at 11:32 AM, '<sus......>' via Maryland & DC
>>>>>> Birding <mdbi......> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Decided to pull my old copy of ”Obsolete English Names of North
>>>>>> American Birds and Their Modern Equivalents” off the shelf. It was
>>>>>> published in 1988 by Fish and Wildlife Service.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I was particularly intrigued by the old names for the bird the AOU
>>>>>> depicted in its media push this week, Sayirnis saya - Say’s Phoebe -
>>>>>> named for Thomas Say. This bird was called San Jose Phoebe, San Pedro
>>>>>> Martir Phoebe, and Yukon Phoebe before it was named for Say.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Say was a significant naturalist of the early 19th century. He came
>>>>>> from a Quaker family and I don’t think he has any claims of egregious
>>>>>> behavior and/or violations of modern standards against him. He contributed
>>>>>> much more to entomology than ornithology, though an expedition for which he
>>>>>> served as zoologist in 1821 produced the first descriptions of several
>>>>>> western birds. I will be sad to see his name removed from Say’s Phoebe.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Also of note, our own Eastern Phoebe is named for Say as well.
>>>>>> According to Diana Wells in 100 Birds and How They Got Their Names, “in
>>>>>> 1854 Audubon’s eastern and Say’s Phoebe were renamed Sayornis (in honor of
>>>>>> Say),” and so the Latin name of Eastern is Sayornis phoebe.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> David Gersten
>>>>>> Laurel, MD
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> <IMG_6808.jpeg>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> <IMG_6807.jpeg>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Sent from the all new AOL app for iOS
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Wednesday, November 1, 2023, 10:40 PM, 'Mike Bowen' via Maryland &
>>>>>> DC Birding <mdbi......> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Gail's fascinating tale of Prince Ruspoli and the Turaco to which he
>>>>>> gave his name takes me back in memory to a lengthy search I was involved
>>>>>> with in November, 2010, mounted by the British bird tour company Birdquest,
>>>>>> to look for the Turaco that bears his name in the wilds of Southern
>>>>>> Ethiopia. My 2010 bird even seems to sport a crown, which logically
>>>>>> argues for retention of the princely name!:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> <1698892076538blob.jpg>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Mike Bowen
>>>>>> Bethesda
>>>>>>
>>>>>> D. H. Michael Bowen
>>>>>> 8609 Ewing Drive
>>>>>> <https://www.google.com/maps/search/8609+Ewing+Drive+Bethesda,+Maryland+20817?entry=gmail&source=g> >>>>>> Bethesda, Maryland 20817
>>>>>> <https://www.google.com/maps/search/8609+Ewing+Drive+Bethesda,+Maryland+20817?entry=gmail&source=g> >>>>>> Phone: (202) 236-0510
>>>>>> Ambassador for American Bird Conservancy, helping ABC help the birds
>>>>>> eBird volunteer Hotspot Reviewer/Editor for Maryland, Delaware, the
>>>>>> District of Columbia, and the Republic of Ghana
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Wednesday, November 1, 2023 at 10:17:46 PM EDT, Marcia Watson <
>>>>>> <marsh......> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Great story, Gail!
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Marcia
>>>>>> ------------
>>>>>> Marcia Watson
>>>>>> Phoenix, MD
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> > On Nov 1, 2023, at 10:10 PM, Gail Mackiernan <katah......>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> > One eponymous name which I am ambivalent about changing is that of
>>>>>> Prince Ruspoli’s Turaco, a pink-tufted, green Turaco found in Ethiopia.
>>>>>> Prince Eugenio Ruspoli was a 19th century Italian explorer and naturalist
>>>>>> who undertook some of the first expeditions into that part of the Horn of
>>>>>> Africa. He collected a number of new species of both plants and animals,
>>>>>> and made a number of important ecological, mineralogical and geographical
>>>>>> observations.
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> > However at the same time, he and some of his companions massacred
>>>>>> native people and looted their villages. He also slaughtered hundreds of
>>>>>> animals, far more than was needed for his scientific collections, just for
>>>>>> fun. In other words, he was a really terrible person.
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> > However, every time I hear the name of that bird, I think about how
>>>>>> karma is, really, a bitch. Seems Ruspoli was out collecting specimens in
>>>>>> Somalia when he encountered a large bull elephant . Naturally, being who he
>>>>>> was, he shot it. The annoyed elephant grabbed Ruspoli with his trunk, swung
>>>>>> him around a few times, bashed him to the ground and proceeded to trample
>>>>>> him flat. His expedition companions, in examining his effects, found a
>>>>>> specimen of an unknown turaco in his collection bag. There were no notes as
>>>>>> to where the bird had been shot, other than somewhere in the region.
>>>>>> However the species was eventually described named in his honor, Turaco
>>>>>> ruspolii (now Menellikornis ruspolii) although it was not for some years
>>>>>> that the bird’s origin and habitat was discovered.
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> > It could be renamed Pink-Crested Turaco but that would really spoil
>>>>>> the story of an SOB getting just what he deserved!
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> > Gail Mackiernan!
>>>>>> > Colesville
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> > Sent from my iPad
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> > --
>>>>>> > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the
>>>>>> Google Group 'Maryland & DC Birding'.
>>>>>> > To view group guidelines or change email preferences, visit this
>>>>>> group on the web at http://www.mdbirding.com >>>>>> > Unfamiliar with a hotspot mentioned on this list? Quickly locate it
>>>>>> here - http://www.mdbirding.com/hotspot.html >>>>>> > ---
>>>>>> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
>>>>>> Groups "Maryland & DC Birding" group.
>>>>>> > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it,
>>>>>> send an email to mdbirding+<......>
>>>>>> > To view this discussion on the web visit
>>>>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/mdbirding/<38F093C9-F327-4243-9A1D-4BAE25A9ED8A...> >>>>>> .
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
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>>>>>>
>>>>>> To view this discussion on the web visit
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>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
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>>>>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/mdbirding/<427566199.1156947.1698892809671...> >>>>>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/mdbirding/<427566199.1156947.1698892809671...>?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >>>>>> .
>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
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>>>>>> To view this discussion on the web visit
>>>>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/mdbirding/<1728652639.1679372.1699025502047...> >>>>>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/mdbirding/<1728652639.1679372.1699025502047...>?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >>>>>> .
>>>>>> <IMG_6808.jpeg>
>>>>>> <IMG_6807.jpeg>
>>>>>> <1698892076538blob.jpg>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
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>>>>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/mdbirding/<F70F1E4E-5167-4978-B293-AD5897CE13BF...> >>>>>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/mdbirding/<F70F1E4E-5167-4978-B293-AD5897CE13BF...>?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >>>>>> .
>>>>>>
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>>>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/mdbirding/CAAaQ%3DiZ%3DUbbyBMtSUSOQ%3DpDd%2BBwExh3w3J%<3DAxHFSraDB5afYTg...> >>>>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/mdbirding/CAAaQ%3DiZ%3DUbbyBMtSUSOQ%3DpDd%2BBwExh3w3J%<3DAxHFSraDB5afYTg...>?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >>>>> .
>>>>>
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>>>
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Date: 11/6/23 9:12 am From: Lyn Miller <lynsm77...> Subject: Re: [MDBirding] Bird Names will be changing!
Once any names are changed, if birding is to be more inclusive, how about
doing away with the use of the code names (my term) - see recent topic
headings such as LEOW or GHOW. Hey, kids, did you hear that alphabet soup
bird? Not very descriptive or useful in general conversations.
Lyn Miller
Formerly of Cheverly
On Sunday, November 5, 2023 at 8:09:39 PM UTC-5 Sarah Lister wrote:
> As I've said, I'm for the renaming, and I've mentioned that I would like
> behavior to be considered along with morphology. To that, let me add
> habitat.
>
> Consider sparrows. Can you imagine trying to distinguish that lot using
> morpho names only? Now they're a mix of eponyms (e.g., Lincoln's), morpho
> (the "X-crowned" cabal), behavior (Song, Chipping), and habitat
> (Saltmarsh).
>
> When it fits, habitat names may work where place names won't. It seems
> that in replacing place names that are too narrow, we've gotten more than a
> few "Northern (what'sits)." I don't think this is a great trend, unless
> you've got just two species to distinguish (e.g., Northern and Southern
> flying squirrels). But within small genera, even size could work. Our
> accipiters could be Tall, Grande, and Venti. (OK, JK!)
>
> I love involving kids! I don't think Jim suggests that they adopt power
> suits and PowerPoints. But it could be a fun activity for younger kids to
> look at birds (field, video, still) and make up names for them. Kids grasp
> the concept of adaptation quite young; this could be a variation on that
> theme. (A current STEM activity involves making a new bird with craft
> supplies, explaining its adaptations and natural history, and naming it
> appropriately.) High school students could surely consider this renaming
> initiative as a hybrid biology/anatomy/taxonomy and social studies
> exercise. (Yoohoo, Science Fair!!)
>
> Let the meetings begin! Happy Birding! Sarah
>
> On Sun, Nov 5, 2023, 7:33 PM JAMES SPEICHER <jugor......> wrote:
>
>> Granted kids don't know a Dunlin from a doorknob, but they don't need to
>> know that. The idea is to incorporate features for the new names replacing
>> people. Kids are great at colors and shapes.
>>
>> Years and years ago we let a day care class at what is now Walter Reed
>> Med Center have a go at designing our Earth Day T-shirts. It was a total
>> success.
>>
>> Jim Speicher
>>
>>
>> On Sun, Nov 5, 2023, 5:40 PM <mkbenj......> wrote:
>>
>>> Let the children name them?
>>>
>>> How would this work? Because children generally don’t know much about
>>> birds. At least the children I know. Frankly this idea sounds both highly
>>> impractical and ridiculously naive to me.
>>>
>>> Like all other human pursuits, birding and bird naming has a complex and
>>> sometimes fraught history. If you think that complex history can be
>>> cleansed with some creative renaming (by children of all things!) and
>>> NPR-inspired cliches about “white spaces,” you’re bound to be disappointed.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Sat, Nov 4, 2023 at 1:35 PM JAMES SPEICHER <jugor......>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Although it appears that in Parker's case the naming was an honorarium
>>>> rather than to acknowledge "discovery," it's a decision made in a vacuum of
>>>> sorts.
>>>>
>>>> In the case of "good guys" who's birds will be renamed, they weren't by
>>>> any measure the "discoverers" of the birds, known to the native peoples for
>>>> eons.
>>>>
>>>> I'm for the renaming.
>>>>
>>>> However, the powers that be should give this a lot of thought. Please,
>>>> not another Washington Commanders debacle!
>>>>
>>>> I would suggest that they consult CHILDREN for input. Kids have a
>>>> remarkable ability to hone in on what's important in objects that adults
>>>> have largely lost as they've gotten older.
>>>>
>>>> Jim Speicher
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Fri, Nov 3, 2023, 11:56 AM Francesca Grifo <frances......>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> I get it, I support it. But it’s a band aid and we lose the
>>>>> opportunity to honor and remember some of the good guys. Back in the 90s
>>>>> there was a terrible plane crash in Ecuador and a Conservation
>>>>> International Rapid Assessment team were all killed. I knew Al Gentry who
>>>>> was the botanist on board. And knew only by reputation the ornithologist-
>>>>> Ted Parker. He could walk through neotropical forests rapidly identifying
>>>>> hundreds of birds by ear in a way some of us can do in our forests. Parkers
>>>>> Antbird was named after him. Now I know - this move is only North American
>>>>> birds - but I imagine there are some good people who will lose their birds.
>>>>> I also appreciate the mess that trying to decide who is good and who is not
>>>>> creates. So I get it. I support it but I am sad too.
>>>>>
>>>>> Francesca T. Grifo
>>>>> Sent from my iPhone - please forgive my brevity!
>>>>> “...ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge:
>>>>> it is those who know little, and not those who know much, who so
>>>>> positively assert that this or that problem will never be solved by science.
>>>>> " Charles Darwin, 1871
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Nov 3, 2023, at 11:32 AM, '<sus......>' via Maryland & DC
>>>>> Birding <mdbi......> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Decided to pull my old copy of ”Obsolete English Names of North
>>>>> American Birds and Their Modern Equivalents” off the shelf. It was
>>>>> published in 1988 by Fish and Wildlife Service.
>>>>>
>>>>> I was particularly intrigued by the old names for the bird the AOU
>>>>> depicted in its media push this week, Sayirnis saya - Say’s Phoebe -
>>>>> named for Thomas Say. This bird was called San Jose Phoebe, San Pedro
>>>>> Martir Phoebe, and Yukon Phoebe before it was named for Say.
>>>>>
>>>>> Say was a significant naturalist of the early 19th century. He came
>>>>> from a Quaker family and I don’t think he has any claims of egregious
>>>>> behavior and/or violations of modern standards against him. He contributed
>>>>> much more to entomology than ornithology, though an expedition for which he
>>>>> served as zoologist in 1821 produced the first descriptions of several
>>>>> western birds. I will be sad to see his name removed from Say’s Phoebe.
>>>>>
>>>>> Also of note, our own Eastern Phoebe is named for Say as well.
>>>>> According to Diana Wells in 100 Birds and How They Got Their Names, “in
>>>>> 1854 Audubon’s eastern and Say’s Phoebe were renamed Sayornis (in honor of
>>>>> Say),” and so the Latin name of Eastern is Sayornis phoebe.
>>>>>
>>>>> David Gersten
>>>>> Laurel, MD
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> <IMG_6808.jpeg>
>>>>>
>>>>> <IMG_6807.jpeg>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Sent from the all new AOL app for iOS
>>>>>
>>>>> On Wednesday, November 1, 2023, 10:40 PM, 'Mike Bowen' via Maryland &
>>>>> DC Birding <mdbi......> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Gail's fascinating tale of Prince Ruspoli and the Turaco to which he
>>>>> gave his name takes me back in memory to a lengthy search I was involved
>>>>> with in November, 2010, mounted by the British bird tour company Birdquest,
>>>>> to look for the Turaco that bears his name in the wilds of Southern
>>>>> Ethiopia. My 2010 bird even seems to sport a crown, which logically
>>>>> argues for retention of the princely name!:
>>>>>
>>>>> <1698892076538blob.jpg>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Mike Bowen
>>>>> Bethesda
>>>>>
>>>>> D. H. Michael Bowen
>>>>> 8609 Ewing Drive
>>>>> <https://www.google.com/maps/search/8609+Ewing+Drive+Bethesda,+Maryland+20817?entry=gmail&source=g> >>>>> Bethesda, Maryland 20817
>>>>> <https://www.google.com/maps/search/8609+Ewing+Drive+Bethesda,+Maryland+20817?entry=gmail&source=g> >>>>> Phone: (202) 236-0510
>>>>> Ambassador for American Bird Conservancy, helping ABC help the birds
>>>>> eBird volunteer Hotspot Reviewer/Editor for Maryland, Delaware, the
>>>>> District of Columbia, and the Republic of Ghana
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Wednesday, November 1, 2023 at 10:17:46 PM EDT, Marcia Watson <
>>>>> <marsh......> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Great story, Gail!
>>>>>
>>>>> Marcia
>>>>> ------------
>>>>> Marcia Watson
>>>>> Phoenix, MD
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> > On Nov 1, 2023, at 10:10 PM, Gail Mackiernan <katah......>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>> >
>>>>> > One eponymous name which I am ambivalent about changing is that of
>>>>> Prince Ruspoli’s Turaco, a pink-tufted, green Turaco found in Ethiopia.
>>>>> Prince Eugenio Ruspoli was a 19th century Italian explorer and naturalist
>>>>> who undertook some of the first expeditions into that part of the Horn of
>>>>> Africa. He collected a number of new species of both plants and animals,
>>>>> and made a number of important ecological, mineralogical and geographical
>>>>> observations.
>>>>> >
>>>>> > However at the same time, he and some of his companions massacred
>>>>> native people and looted their villages. He also slaughtered hundreds of
>>>>> animals, far more than was needed for his scientific collections, just for
>>>>> fun. In other words, he was a really terrible person.
>>>>> >
>>>>> > However, every time I hear the name of that bird, I think about how
>>>>> karma is, really, a bitch. Seems Ruspoli was out collecting specimens in
>>>>> Somalia when he encountered a large bull elephant . Naturally, being who he
>>>>> was, he shot it. The annoyed elephant grabbed Ruspoli with his trunk, swung
>>>>> him around a few times, bashed him to the ground and proceeded to trample
>>>>> him flat. His expedition companions, in examining his effects, found a
>>>>> specimen of an unknown turaco in his collection bag. There were no notes as
>>>>> to where the bird had been shot, other than somewhere in the region.
>>>>> However the species was eventually described named in his honor, Turaco
>>>>> ruspolii (now Menellikornis ruspolii) although it was not for some years
>>>>> that the bird’s origin and habitat was discovered.
>>>>> >
>>>>> > It could be renamed Pink-Crested Turaco but that would really spoil
>>>>> the story of an SOB getting just what he deserved!
>>>>> >
>>>>> > Gail Mackiernan!
>>>>> > Colesville
>>>>> >
>>>>> > Sent from my iPad
>>>>> >
>>>>> >
>>>>> > --
>>>>> > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the
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>>>>> Groups "Maryland & DC Birding" group.
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>>>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/mdbirding/<38F093C9-F327-4243-9A1D-4BAE25A9ED8A...> >>>>> .
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> --
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>>>>>
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>>>>> To view this discussion on the web visit
>>>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/mdbirding/<427566199.1156947.1698892809671...> >>>>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/mdbirding/<427566199.1156947.1698892809671...>?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >>>>> .
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
>>>>> Group 'Maryland & DC Birding'.
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>>>>> on the web at http://www.mdbirding.com >>>>> Unfamiliar with a hotspot mentioned on this list? Quickly locate it
>>>>> here - http://www.mdbirding.com/hotspot.html >>>>> ---
>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
>>>>> Groups "Maryland & DC Birding" group.
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>>>>> an email to mdbirding+<......>
>>>>> To view this discussion on the web visit
>>>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/mdbirding/<1728652639.1679372.1699025502047...> >>>>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/mdbirding/<1728652639.1679372.1699025502047...>?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >>>>> .
>>>>> <IMG_6808.jpeg>
>>>>> <IMG_6807.jpeg>
>>>>> <1698892076538blob.jpg>
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
>>>>> Group 'Maryland & DC Birding'.
>>>>> To view group guidelines or change email preferences, visit this group
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>>>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/mdbirding/<F70F1E4E-5167-4978-B293-AD5897CE13BF...> >>>>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/mdbirding/<F70F1E4E-5167-4978-B293-AD5897CE13BF...>?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >>>>> .
>>>>>
>>>> --
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>>>>
>>> --
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>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/mdbirding/CAAaQ%<3DiYB1vaFc4efoY3fJb3aPhXCsyyvmYeWVK5raoDsyveqRw...> >> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/mdbirding/CAAaQ%<3DiYB1vaFc4efoY3fJb3aPhXCsyyvmYeWVK5raoDsyveqRw...>?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >> .
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Date: 11/5/23 5:09 pm From: Sarah Lister <samjlister13...> Subject: Re: [MDBirding] Bird Names will be changing!
As I've said, I'm for the renaming, and I've mentioned that I would like
behavior to be considered along with morphology. To that, let me add
habitat.
Consider sparrows. Can you imagine trying to distinguish that lot using
morpho names only? Now they're a mix of eponyms (e.g., Lincoln's), morpho
(the "X-crowned" cabal), behavior (Song, Chipping), and habitat
(Saltmarsh).
When it fits, habitat names may work where place names won't. It seems that
in replacing place names that are too narrow, we've gotten more than a few
"Northern (what'sits)." I don't think this is a great trend, unless you've
got just two species to distinguish (e.g., Northern and Southern flying
squirrels). But within small genera, even size could work. Our accipiters
could be Tall, Grande, and Venti. (OK, JK!)
I love involving kids! I don't think Jim suggests that they adopt power
suits and PowerPoints. But it could be a fun activity for younger kids to
look at birds (field, video, still) and make up names for them. Kids grasp
the concept of adaptation quite young; this could be a variation on that
theme. (A current STEM activity involves making a new bird with craft
supplies, explaining its adaptations and natural history, and naming it
appropriately.) High school students could surely consider this renaming
initiative as a hybrid biology/anatomy/taxonomy and social studies
exercise. (Yoohoo, Science Fair!!)
Let the meetings begin! Happy Birding! Sarah
On Sun, Nov 5, 2023, 7:33 PM JAMES SPEICHER <jugornought...> wrote:
> Granted kids don't know a Dunlin from a doorknob, but they don't need to
> know that. The idea is to incorporate features for the new names replacing
> people. Kids are great at colors and shapes.
>
> Years and years ago we let a day care class at what is now Walter Reed Med
> Center have a go at designing our Earth Day T-shirts. It was a total
> success.
>
> Jim Speicher
>
>
> On Sun, Nov 5, 2023, 5:40 PM <mkbenjamin68...> wrote:
>
>> Let the children name them?
>>
>> How would this work? Because children generally don’t know much about
>> birds. At least the children I know. Frankly this idea sounds both highly
>> impractical and ridiculously naive to me.
>>
>> Like all other human pursuits, birding and bird naming has a complex and
>> sometimes fraught history. If you think that complex history can be
>> cleansed with some creative renaming (by children of all things!) and
>> NPR-inspired cliches about “white spaces,” you’re bound to be disappointed.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Sat, Nov 4, 2023 at 1:35 PM JAMES SPEICHER <jugornought...>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Although it appears that in Parker's case the naming was an honorarium
>>> rather than to acknowledge "discovery," it's a decision made in a vacuum of
>>> sorts.
>>>
>>> In the case of "good guys" who's birds will be renamed, they weren't by
>>> any measure the "discoverers" of the birds, known to the native peoples for
>>> eons.
>>>
>>> I'm for the renaming.
>>>
>>> However, the powers that be should give this a lot of thought. Please,
>>> not another Washington Commanders debacle!
>>>
>>> I would suggest that they consult CHILDREN for input. Kids have a
>>> remarkable ability to hone in on what's important in objects that adults
>>> have largely lost as they've gotten older.
>>>
>>> Jim Speicher
>>>
>>>
>>> On Fri, Nov 3, 2023, 11:56 AM Francesca Grifo <francescatgrifo...>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> I get it, I support it. But it’s a band aid and we lose the opportunity
>>>> to honor and remember some of the good guys. Back in the 90s there was a
>>>> terrible plane crash in Ecuador and a Conservation International Rapid
>>>> Assessment team were all killed. I knew Al Gentry who was the botanist on
>>>> board. And knew only by reputation the ornithologist- Ted Parker. He could
>>>> walk through neotropical forests rapidly identifying hundreds of birds by
>>>> ear in a way some of us can do in our forests. Parkers Antbird was named
>>>> after him. Now I know - this move is only North American birds - but I
>>>> imagine there are some good people who will lose their birds. I also
>>>> appreciate the mess that trying to decide who is good and who is not
>>>> creates. So I get it. I support it but I am sad too.
>>>>
>>>> Francesca T. Grifo
>>>> Sent from my iPhone - please forgive my brevity!
>>>> “...ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge:
>>>> it is those who know little, and not those who know much, who so
>>>> positively assert that this or that problem will never be solved by science.
>>>> " Charles Darwin, 1871
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Nov 3, 2023, at 11:32 AM, '<suscipe...>' via Maryland & DC
>>>> Birding <mdbirding...> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Decided to pull my old copy of ”Obsolete English Names of North
>>>> American Birds and Their Modern Equivalents” off the shelf. It was
>>>> published in 1988 by Fish and Wildlife Service.
>>>>
>>>> I was particularly intrigued by the old names for the bird the AOU
>>>> depicted in its media push this week, Sayirnis saya - Say’s Phoebe -
>>>> named for Thomas Say. This bird was called San Jose Phoebe, San Pedro
>>>> Martir Phoebe, and Yukon Phoebe before it was named for Say.
>>>>
>>>> Say was a significant naturalist of the early 19th century. He came
>>>> from a Quaker family and I don’t think he has any claims of egregious
>>>> behavior and/or violations of modern standards against him. He contributed
>>>> much more to entomology than ornithology, though an expedition for which he
>>>> served as zoologist in 1821 produced the first descriptions of several
>>>> western birds. I will be sad to see his name removed from Say’s Phoebe.
>>>>
>>>> Also of note, our own Eastern Phoebe is named for Say as well.
>>>> According to Diana Wells in 100 Birds and How They Got Their Names, “in
>>>> 1854 Audubon’s eastern and Say’s Phoebe were renamed Sayornis (in honor of
>>>> Say),” and so the Latin name of Eastern is Sayornis phoebe.
>>>>
>>>> David Gersten
>>>> Laurel, MD
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> <IMG_6808.jpeg>
>>>>
>>>> <IMG_6807.jpeg>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Sent from the all new AOL app for iOS
>>>>
>>>> On Wednesday, November 1, 2023, 10:40 PM, 'Mike Bowen' via Maryland &
>>>> DC Birding <mdbirding...> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Gail's fascinating tale of Prince Ruspoli and the Turaco to which he
>>>> gave his name takes me back in memory to a lengthy search I was involved
>>>> with in November, 2010, mounted by the British bird tour company Birdquest,
>>>> to look for the Turaco that bears his name in the wilds of Southern
>>>> Ethiopia. My 2010 bird even seems to sport a crown, which logically
>>>> argues for retention of the princely name!:
>>>>
>>>> <1698892076538blob.jpg>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Mike Bowen
>>>> Bethesda
>>>>
>>>> D. H. Michael Bowen
>>>> 8609 Ewing Drive
>>>> <https://www.google.com/maps/search/8609+Ewing+Drive+Bethesda,+Maryland+20817?entry=gmail&source=g> >>>> Bethesda, Maryland 20817
>>>> <https://www.google.com/maps/search/8609+Ewing+Drive+Bethesda,+Maryland+20817?entry=gmail&source=g> >>>> Phone: (202) 236-0510
>>>> Ambassador for American Bird Conservancy, helping ABC help the birds
>>>> eBird volunteer Hotspot Reviewer/Editor for Maryland, Delaware, the
>>>> District of Columbia, and the Republic of Ghana
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Wednesday, November 1, 2023 at 10:17:46 PM EDT, Marcia Watson <
>>>> <marshwren50...> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Great story, Gail!
>>>>
>>>> Marcia
>>>> ------------
>>>> Marcia Watson
>>>> Phoenix, MD
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> > On Nov 1, 2023, at 10:10 PM, Gail Mackiernan <katahdinss...>
>>>> wrote:
>>>> >
>>>> > One eponymous name which I am ambivalent about changing is that of
>>>> Prince Ruspoli’s Turaco, a pink-tufted, green Turaco found in Ethiopia.
>>>> Prince Eugenio Ruspoli was a 19th century Italian explorer and naturalist
>>>> who undertook some of the first expeditions into that part of the Horn of
>>>> Africa. He collected a number of new species of both plants and animals,
>>>> and made a number of important ecological, mineralogical and geographical
>>>> observations.
>>>> >
>>>> > However at the same time, he and some of his companions massacred
>>>> native people and looted their villages. He also slaughtered hundreds of
>>>> animals, far more than was needed for his scientific collections, just for
>>>> fun. In other words, he was a really terrible person.
>>>> >
>>>> > However, every time I hear the name of that bird, I think about how
>>>> karma is, really, a bitch. Seems Ruspoli was out collecting specimens in
>>>> Somalia when he encountered a large bull elephant . Naturally, being who he
>>>> was, he shot it. The annoyed elephant grabbed Ruspoli with his trunk, swung
>>>> him around a few times, bashed him to the ground and proceeded to trample
>>>> him flat. His expedition companions, in examining his effects, found a
>>>> specimen of an unknown turaco in his collection bag. There were no notes as
>>>> to where the bird had been shot, other than somewhere in the region.
>>>> However the species was eventually described named in his honor, Turaco
>>>> ruspolii (now Menellikornis ruspolii) although it was not for some years
>>>> that the bird’s origin and habitat was discovered.
>>>> >
>>>> > It could be renamed Pink-Crested Turaco but that would really spoil
>>>> the story of an SOB getting just what he deserved!
>>>> >
>>>> > Gail Mackiernan!
>>>> > Colesville
>>>> >
>>>> > Sent from my iPad
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > --
>>>> > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
>>>> Group 'Maryland & DC Birding'.
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>>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/mdbirding/<38F093C9-F327-4243-9A1D-4BAE25A9ED8A...> >>>> .
>>>>
>>>>
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>>>>
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>>>> <IMG_6808.jpeg>
>>>> <IMG_6807.jpeg>
>>>> <1698892076538blob.jpg>
>>>>
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>>>>
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Date: 11/5/23 4:33 pm From: JAMES SPEICHER <jugornought...> Subject: Re: [MDBirding] Bird Names will be changing!
Granted kids don't know a Dunlin from a doorknob, but they don't need to
know that. The idea is to incorporate features for the new names replacing
people. Kids are great at colors and shapes.
Years and years ago we let a day care class at what is now Walter Reed Med
Center have a go at designing our Earth Day T-shirts. It was a total
success.
Jim Speicher
On Sun, Nov 5, 2023, 5:40 PM <mkbenjamin68...> wrote:
> Let the children name them?
>
> How would this work? Because children generally don’t know much about
> birds. At least the children I know. Frankly this idea sounds both highly
> impractical and ridiculously naive to me.
>
> Like all other human pursuits, birding and bird naming has a complex and
> sometimes fraught history. If you think that complex history can be
> cleansed with some creative renaming (by children of all things!) and
> NPR-inspired cliches about “white spaces,” you’re bound to be disappointed.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Sat, Nov 4, 2023 at 1:35 PM JAMES SPEICHER <jugornought...>
> wrote:
>
>> Although it appears that in Parker's case the naming was an honorarium
>> rather than to acknowledge "discovery," it's a decision made in a vacuum of
>> sorts.
>>
>> In the case of "good guys" who's birds will be renamed, they weren't by
>> any measure the "discoverers" of the birds, known to the native peoples for
>> eons.
>>
>> I'm for the renaming.
>>
>> However, the powers that be should give this a lot of thought. Please,
>> not another Washington Commanders debacle!
>>
>> I would suggest that they consult CHILDREN for input. Kids have a
>> remarkable ability to hone in on what's important in objects that adults
>> have largely lost as they've gotten older.
>>
>> Jim Speicher
>>
>>
>> On Fri, Nov 3, 2023, 11:56 AM Francesca Grifo <francescatgrifo...>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> I get it, I support it. But it’s a band aid and we lose the opportunity
>>> to honor and remember some of the good guys. Back in the 90s there was a
>>> terrible plane crash in Ecuador and a Conservation International Rapid
>>> Assessment team were all killed. I knew Al Gentry who was the botanist on
>>> board. And knew only by reputation the ornithologist- Ted Parker. He could
>>> walk through neotropical forests rapidly identifying hundreds of birds by
>>> ear in a way some of us can do in our forests. Parkers Antbird was named
>>> after him. Now I know - this move is only North American birds - but I
>>> imagine there are some good people who will lose their birds. I also
>>> appreciate the mess that trying to decide who is good and who is not
>>> creates. So I get it. I support it but I am sad too.
>>>
>>> Francesca T. Grifo
>>> Sent from my iPhone - please forgive my brevity!
>>> “...ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge:
>>> it is those who know little, and not those who know much, who so
>>> positively assert that this or that problem will never be solved by science.
>>> " Charles Darwin, 1871
>>>
>>>
>>> On Nov 3, 2023, at 11:32 AM, '<suscipe...>' via Maryland & DC
>>> Birding <mdbirding...> wrote:
>>>
>>> Decided to pull my old copy of ”Obsolete English Names of North
>>> American Birds and Their Modern Equivalents” off the shelf. It was
>>> published in 1988 by Fish and Wildlife Service.
>>>
>>> I was particularly intrigued by the old names for the bird the AOU
>>> depicted in its media push this week, Sayirnis saya - Say’s Phoebe -
>>> named for Thomas Say. This bird was called San Jose Phoebe, San Pedro
>>> Martir Phoebe, and Yukon Phoebe before it was named for Say.
>>>
>>> Say was a significant naturalist of the early 19th century. He came
>>> from a Quaker family and I don’t think he has any claims of egregious
>>> behavior and/or violations of modern standards against him. He contributed
>>> much more to entomology than ornithology, though an expedition for which he
>>> served as zoologist in 1821 produced the first descriptions of several
>>> western birds. I will be sad to see his name removed from Say’s Phoebe.
>>>
>>> Also of note, our own Eastern Phoebe is named for Say as well.
>>> According to Diana Wells in 100 Birds and How They Got Their Names, “in
>>> 1854 Audubon’s eastern and Say’s Phoebe were renamed Sayornis (in honor of
>>> Say),” and so the Latin name of Eastern is Sayornis phoebe.
>>>
>>> David Gersten
>>> Laurel, MD
>>>
>>>
>>> <IMG_6808.jpeg>
>>>
>>> <IMG_6807.jpeg>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Sent from the all new AOL app for iOS
>>>
>>> On Wednesday, November 1, 2023, 10:40 PM, 'Mike Bowen' via Maryland & DC
>>> Birding <mdbirding...> wrote:
>>>
>>> Gail's fascinating tale of Prince Ruspoli and the Turaco to which he
>>> gave his name takes me back in memory to a lengthy search I was involved
>>> with in November, 2010, mounted by the British bird tour company Birdquest,
>>> to look for the Turaco that bears his name in the wilds of Southern
>>> Ethiopia. My 2010 bird even seems to sport a crown, which logically
>>> argues for retention of the princely name!:
>>>
>>> <1698892076538blob.jpg>
>>>
>>>
>>> Mike Bowen
>>> Bethesda
>>>
>>> D. H. Michael Bowen
>>> 8609 Ewing Drive
>>> <https://www.google.com/maps/search/8609+Ewing+Drive+Bethesda,+Maryland+20817?entry=gmail&source=g> >>> Bethesda, Maryland 20817
>>> <https://www.google.com/maps/search/8609+Ewing+Drive+Bethesda,+Maryland+20817?entry=gmail&source=g> >>> Phone: (202) 236-0510
>>> Ambassador for American Bird Conservancy, helping ABC help the birds
>>> eBird volunteer Hotspot Reviewer/Editor for Maryland, Delaware, the
>>> District of Columbia, and the Republic of Ghana
>>>
>>>
>>> On Wednesday, November 1, 2023 at 10:17:46 PM EDT, Marcia Watson <
>>> <marshwren50...> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> Great story, Gail!
>>>
>>> Marcia
>>> ------------
>>> Marcia Watson
>>> Phoenix, MD
>>>
>>>
>>> > On Nov 1, 2023, at 10:10 PM, Gail Mackiernan <katahdinss...>
>>> wrote:
>>> >
>>> > One eponymous name which I am ambivalent about changing is that of
>>> Prince Ruspoli’s Turaco, a pink-tufted, green Turaco found in Ethiopia.
>>> Prince Eugenio Ruspoli was a 19th century Italian explorer and naturalist
>>> who undertook some of the first expeditions into that part of the Horn of
>>> Africa. He collected a number of new species of both plants and animals,
>>> and made a number of important ecological, mineralogical and geographical
>>> observations.
>>> >
>>> > However at the same time, he and some of his companions massacred
>>> native people and looted their villages. He also slaughtered hundreds of
>>> animals, far more than was needed for his scientific collections, just for
>>> fun. In other words, he was a really terrible person.
>>> >
>>> > However, every time I hear the name of that bird, I think about how
>>> karma is, really, a bitch. Seems Ruspoli was out collecting specimens in
>>> Somalia when he encountered a large bull elephant . Naturally, being who he
>>> was, he shot it. The annoyed elephant grabbed Ruspoli with his trunk, swung
>>> him around a few times, bashed him to the ground and proceeded to trample
>>> him flat. His expedition companions, in examining his effects, found a
>>> specimen of an unknown turaco in his collection bag. There were no notes as
>>> to where the bird had been shot, other than somewhere in the region.
>>> However the species was eventually described named in his honor, Turaco
>>> ruspolii (now Menellikornis ruspolii) although it was not for some years
>>> that the bird’s origin and habitat was discovered.
>>> >
>>> > It could be renamed Pink-Crested Turaco but that would really spoil
>>> the story of an SOB getting just what he deserved!
>>> >
>>> > Gail Mackiernan!
>>> > Colesville
>>> >
>>> > Sent from my iPad
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > --
>>> > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
>>> Group 'Maryland & DC Birding'.
>>> > To view group guidelines or change email preferences, visit this group
>>> on the web at http://www.mdbirding.com >>> > Unfamiliar with a hotspot mentioned on this list? Quickly locate it
>>> here - http://www.mdbirding.com/hotspot.html >>> > ---
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>>> Groups "Maryland & DC Birding" group.
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>>> an email to mdbirding+<unsubscribe...>
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>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/mdbirding/<38F093C9-F327-4243-9A1D-4BAE25A9ED8A...> >>> .
>>>
>>>
>>> --
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>>>
>>> --
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>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/mdbirding/<1728652639.1679372.1699025502047...> >>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/mdbirding/<1728652639.1679372.1699025502047...>?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >>> .
>>> <IMG_6808.jpeg>
>>> <IMG_6807.jpeg>
>>> <1698892076538blob.jpg>
>>>
>>> --
>>> -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
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>>>
>> --
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>>
>
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Date: 11/4/23 10:35 am From: JAMES SPEICHER <jugornought...> Subject: Re: [MDBirding] Bird Names will be changing!
Although it appears that in Parker's case the naming was an honorarium
rather than to acknowledge "discovery," it's a decision made in a vacuum of
sorts.
In the case of "good guys" who's birds will be renamed, they weren't by any
measure the "discoverers" of the birds, known to the native peoples for
eons.
I'm for the renaming.
However, the powers that be should give this a lot of thought. Please, not
another Washington Commanders debacle!
I would suggest that they consult CHILDREN for input. Kids have a
remarkable ability to hone in on what's important in objects that adults
have largely lost as they've gotten older.
Jim Speicher
On Fri, Nov 3, 2023, 11:56 AM Francesca Grifo <francescatgrifo...>
wrote:
> I get it, I support it. But it’s a band aid and we lose the opportunity to
> honor and remember some of the good guys. Back in the 90s there was a
> terrible plane crash in Ecuador and a Conservation International Rapid
> Assessment team were all killed. I knew Al Gentry who was the botanist on
> board. And knew only by reputation the ornithologist- Ted Parker. He could
> walk through neotropical forests rapidly identifying hundreds of birds by
> ear in a way some of us can do in our forests. Parkers Antbird was named
> after him. Now I know - this move is only North American birds - but I
> imagine there are some good people who will lose their birds. I also
> appreciate the mess that trying to decide who is good and who is not
> creates. So I get it. I support it but I am sad too.
>
> Francesca T. Grifo
> Sent from my iPhone - please forgive my brevity!
> “...ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge: it is
> those who know little, and not those who know much, who so
> positively assert that this or that problem will never be solved by science.
> " Charles Darwin, 1871
>
>
> On Nov 3, 2023, at 11:32 AM, '<suscipe...>' via Maryland & DC
> Birding <mdbirding...> wrote:
>
> Decided to pull my old copy of ”Obsolete English Names of North American
> Birds and Their Modern Equivalents” off the shelf. It was published in
> 1988 by Fish and Wildlife Service.
>
> I was particularly intrigued by the old names for the bird the AOU
> depicted in its media push this week, Sayirnis saya - Say’s Phoebe -
> named for Thomas Say. This bird was called San Jose Phoebe, San Pedro
> Martir Phoebe, and Yukon Phoebe before it was named for Say.
>
> Say was a significant naturalist of the early 19th century. He came from
> a Quaker family and I don’t think he has any claims of egregious behavior
> and/or violations of modern standards against him. He contributed much
> more to entomology than ornithology, though an expedition for which he
> served as zoologist in 1821 produced the first descriptions of several
> western birds. I will be sad to see his name removed from Say’s Phoebe.
>
> Also of note, our own Eastern Phoebe is named for Say as well. According
> to Diana Wells in 100 Birds and How They Got Their Names, “in 1854
> Audubon’s eastern and Say’s Phoebe were renamed Sayornis (in honor of
> Say),” and so the Latin name of Eastern is Sayornis phoebe.
>
> David Gersten
> Laurel, MD
>
>
> <IMG_6808.jpeg>
>
> <IMG_6807.jpeg>
>
>
>
>
> Sent from the all new AOL app for iOS
>
> On Wednesday, November 1, 2023, 10:40 PM, 'Mike Bowen' via Maryland & DC
> Birding <mdbirding...> wrote:
>
> Gail's fascinating tale of Prince Ruspoli and the Turaco to which he gave
> his name takes me back in memory to a lengthy search I was involved with in
> November, 2010, mounted by the British bird tour company Birdquest, to look
> for the Turaco that bears his name in the wilds of Southern Ethiopia. My
> 2010 bird even seems to sport a crown, which logically argues for retention
> of the princely name!:
>
> <1698892076538blob.jpg>
>
>
> Mike Bowen
> Bethesda
>
> D. H. Michael Bowen
> 8609 Ewing Drive
> Bethesda, Maryland 20817
> Phone: (202) 236-0510
> Ambassador for American Bird Conservancy, helping ABC help the birds
> eBird volunteer Hotspot Reviewer/Editor for Maryland, Delaware, the
> District of Columbia, and the Republic of Ghana
>
>
> On Wednesday, November 1, 2023 at 10:17:46 PM EDT, Marcia Watson <
> <marshwren50...> wrote:
>
>
> Great story, Gail!
>
> Marcia
> ------------
> Marcia Watson
> Phoenix, MD
>
>
> > On Nov 1, 2023, at 10:10 PM, Gail Mackiernan <katahdinss...>
> wrote:
> >
> > One eponymous name which I am ambivalent about changing is that of
> Prince Ruspoli’s Turaco, a pink-tufted, green Turaco found in Ethiopia.
> Prince Eugenio Ruspoli was a 19th century Italian explorer and naturalist
> who undertook some of the first expeditions into that part of the Horn of
> Africa. He collected a number of new species of both plants and animals,
> and made a number of important ecological, mineralogical and geographical
> observations.
> >
> > However at the same time, he and some of his companions massacred native
> people and looted their villages. He also slaughtered hundreds of animals,
> far more than was needed for his scientific collections, just for fun. In
> other words, he was a really terrible person.
> >
> > However, every time I hear the name of that bird, I think about how
> karma is, really, a bitch. Seems Ruspoli was out collecting specimens in
> Somalia when he encountered a large bull elephant . Naturally, being who he
> was, he shot it. The annoyed elephant grabbed Ruspoli with his trunk, swung
> him around a few times, bashed him to the ground and proceeded to trample
> him flat. His expedition companions, in examining his effects, found a
> specimen of an unknown turaco in his collection bag. There were no notes as
> to where the bird had been shot, other than somewhere in the region.
> However the species was eventually described named in his honor, Turaco
> ruspolii (now Menellikornis ruspolii) although it was not for some years
> that the bird’s origin and habitat was discovered.
> >
> > It could be renamed Pink-Crested Turaco but that would really spoil the
> story of an SOB getting just what he deserved!
> >
> > Gail Mackiernan!
> > Colesville
> >
> > Sent from my iPad
> >
> >
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Date: 11/4/23 9:22 am From: Steve Long <steve.long4...> Subject: Re: [MDBirding] Bird Names will be changing!
That post is morphing this thread into a racist debate, rather than a
"Bird names for birds" discussion with race issues being only one part.
I think that is inappropriate for this particular list, so I am going to
make a point and stop posting:
The current efforts by some to "cancel" things that can be linked in any
way to something with negative racial (or other societal) issues is not
a "positive" process. It has even been used to suggest that the
Constitution of the United States should be set aside, because several
of the founders of the United States were slave holders. It ignores the
good things that some people accomplished and even seeks to undo them.
I think that is inappropriate in most cases. We need to recognize that
people are not "completely bad unless they are completely good" by
whatever judgement measures are used in succeeding generations, as
society evolves. It is actually more socially healthy to acknowledge
the positive as well as the negative in realistic terms. In that sense,
I think it is healthy to acknowledge Audubon as the guiding force in the
development of birding in the United States, along with noting his other
less admirable behaviors and his own possibly "mixed" race.
If we really want to make "birding" inclusive, i believe that it is more
important that we do so on a personal level. "Birders" are stereotyped
as arrogant and insensitive in Hollywood portrayals, and, unfortunately,
with some justification. I have experienced some of that myself,
despite being a "White male", and can see how a "Black" person could
easily think that type of behavior directed at them is racially
motivated, even when it is really "equal opportunity" insensitive
behavior. And, I am sure there are also some actual racists left among
us, too.
So, if we really want to make progress toward inclusivity, we need to
speak out when we see bad behaviors NOW. We can't do anything to change
the past behaviors, and we need to stop using them to drive divisions
among people with common interests, TODAY.
Steve Long
On 11/3/2023 10:15 PM, Lacey N. Dunham wrote:
> Birding and conservation are overwhelming White: majority White
> spaces, centering White historical narratives and White perspectives.
> Bias is absolutely present: White bias.
>
> The renaming process is an opportunity to take one step away from
> exclusion and towards embracing a plethora of current and future
> birders. While no identity group is monolithic in beliefs, of course,
> I think we are obligated to step back and respectfully listen to the
> concerns of our fellow birders, especially birders who identify as
> Black and Brown and whose experiences—in birding, in life—likely
> differ from our own.
>
> Here are a few reading suggestions. No doubt there are others.
> https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2023/04/04/audubon-enslaver-name-change/ > https://www.audubon.org/magazine/spring-2021/what-do-we-do-about-john-james-audubon > https://www.birdability.org/blog/why-bird-names-matter-to-birdability >
> --
> Lacey N. Dunham (she/her)
> WDC
>
> On Fri, Nov 3, 2023 at 7:51 PM Steve Long <steve.long4...>
> wrote:
>
> Well, we are going far astray here, so I am not going to pursue
> this much farther.
>
> But, I just can't resist pointing out that using Latin is still
> not consistent with the VAST majority of people on our shared
> planet. There are FAR more Indians, and almost as many Chinese,
> than there ever were Romans, and both had civilizations that
> predate the Romans by substantial margins. Clearly, in ethnic
> fairness, we should all learn one or the other to pursue birding.
> But, perhaps we should hold off on the transition until after the
> next war between these nuclear-armed historical rivals - we would
> not want to have to learn Sanskrit AND Chinese traditional
> characters because we picked the loser, right? RIGHT?
>
> Seriously, I am just pointing out that this idea that birders need
> to change to be "fair" and/or "inclusive" is being pushed from a
> point of view that is highly biased, anyway. The folks who are
> thinking that they are "being better" really are not so much
> better as they are claiming to be.
>
> Steve Long
>
> On 11/3/2023 6:51 PM, Mike Bowen wrote:
>> Seems to me that using the names in a dead language (Latin is
>> surely dead as a currently spoken language, although Romansh,
>> still spoken by a very few in Switzerland, comes close) can
>> logically be suggested as a common basis all over the world.
>>
>> Funnily enough, that's the language we see in parentheses behind
>> the local (language) in field guides in different languages all
>> over the world. That's the language we need to adopt as a
>> standard. Everything else is politics.
>>
>> Maybe it's not this simple, but please tell me why not.
>>
>> Mike Bowen
>>
>> Bethesda
>>
>> D. H. Michael Bowen
>> 8609 Ewing Drive
>> Bethesda, Maryland 20817
>> Phone: (202) 236-0510
>> Ambassador for American Bird Conservancy, helping ABC help the birds
>> eBird volunteer Hotspot Reviewer/Editor for Maryland, Delaware,
>> the District of Columbia, and the Republic of Ghana
>>
>>
>> On Friday, November 3, 2023 at 06:03:37 PM EDT, Steve Long
>> <steve.long4...> <mailto:<steve.long4...> >> wrote:
>>
>>
>> Frankly, this whole thing smacks of bureaucracy rather than
>> science or
>> fairness.
>>
>> Since the Roman's were not exactly "politically correct" people,
>> perhaps
>> we should not be naming everything in their dead language,
>> either. Why
>> memorialize colonizing slave holders who used torture, etc., etc.,
>> etc.? Let's not disrupt just every amateur birder, let's go get
>> those
>> terrible professional ornithologists who make their living by
>> memorializing terrible ancient people. (/sarcasm)
>>
>> Seriously, I can see renaming some birds, but the justification
>> for this
>> whole-sale process seems silly.
>>
>> As for local vs "North American English" bird names, are those of
>> us in
>> the United States supposed to learn all the languages of the world,
>> including their characters in Sanskrit, Arabic, Chinese,
>> Japanese, etc.,
>> etc. so that there is only one "common" name for each species
>> that is
>> standard across the entire planet? Or, could we do like we do with
>> everything else and have different names for the same thing, for
>> instance a "boat", in different parts of the world with
>> translation from
>> language to language?
>>
>> And, what about the probability that something like "black bird" in
>> different languages is actually referring to different birds in
>> different places?
>>
>> This whole process seems like it is going to backfire so far as
>> "inclusivity" is concerned. It is going to turn off the average
>> person
>> who is somewhat interested in birding more than it is going to
>> attract
>> them into the "fold" of serious birders, to be told "We don't
>> call them
>> that, anymore (humph)!"
>>
>> But, it is sure to increase the sale of bird books - for a short
>> while.
>>
>> Steve Long - realistic curmudgeon
>>
>>
>> --
>> -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the
>> Google Group 'Maryland & DC Birding'.
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>> group on the web at http://www.mdbirding.com >> Unfamiliar with a hotspot mentioned on this list? Quickly locate
>> it here - http://www.mdbirding.com/hotspot.html >> ---
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>>
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>>
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Date: 11/3/23 7:16 pm From: Lacey N. Dunham <lacey.n.dunham...> Subject: Re: [MDBirding] Bird Names will be changing!
Birding and conservation are overwhelming White: majority White spaces,
centering White historical narratives and White perspectives. Bias is
absolutely present: White bias.
The renaming process is an opportunity to take one step away from exclusion
and towards embracing a plethora of current and future birders. While no
identity group is monolithic in beliefs, of course, I think we are
obligated to step back and respectfully listen to the concerns of our
fellow birders, especially birders who identify as Black and Brown and
whose experiences—in birding, in life—likely differ from our own.
On Fri, Nov 3, 2023 at 7:51 PM Steve Long <steve.long4...>
wrote:
> Well, we are going far astray here, so I am not going to pursue this much
> farther.
>
> But, I just can't resist pointing out that using Latin is still not
> consistent with the VAST majority of people on our shared planet. There
> are FAR more Indians, and almost as many Chinese, than there ever were
> Romans, and both had civilizations that predate the Romans by substantial
> margins. Clearly, in ethnic fairness, we should all learn one or the other
> to pursue birding. But, perhaps we should hold off on the transition until
> after the next war between these nuclear-armed historical rivals - we would
> not want to have to learn Sanskrit AND Chinese traditional characters
> because we picked the loser, right? RIGHT?
>
> Seriously, I am just pointing out that this idea that birders need to
> change to be "fair" and/or "inclusive" is being pushed from a point of view
> that is highly biased, anyway. The folks who are thinking that they are
> "being better" really are not so much better as they are claiming to be.
>
> Steve Long
> On 11/3/2023 6:51 PM, Mike Bowen wrote:
>
> Seems to me that using the names in a dead language (Latin is surely dead
> as a currently spoken language, although Romansh, still spoken by a very
> few in Switzerland, comes close) can logically be suggested as a common
> basis all over the world.
>
> Funnily enough, that's the language we see in parentheses behind the local
> (language) in field guides in different languages all over the world.
> That's the language we need to adopt as a standard. Everything else is
> politics.
>
> Maybe it's not this simple, but please tell me why not.
>
> Mike Bowen
>
> Bethesda
>
> D. H. Michael Bowen
> 8609 Ewing Drive
> Bethesda, Maryland 20817
> Phone: (202) 236-0510
> Ambassador for American Bird Conservancy, helping ABC help the birds
> eBird volunteer Hotspot Reviewer/Editor for Maryland, Delaware, the
> District of Columbia, and the Republic of Ghana
>
>
> On Friday, November 3, 2023 at 06:03:37 PM EDT, Steve Long
> <steve.long4...> <steve.long4...> wrote:
>
>
> Frankly, this whole thing smacks of bureaucracy rather than science or
> fairness.
>
> Since the Roman's were not exactly "politically correct" people, perhaps
> we should not be naming everything in their dead language, either. Why
> memorialize colonizing slave holders who used torture, etc., etc.,
> etc.? Let's not disrupt just every amateur birder, let's go get those
> terrible professional ornithologists who make their living by
> memorializing terrible ancient people. (/sarcasm)
>
> Seriously, I can see renaming some birds, but the justification for this
> whole-sale process seems silly.
>
> As for local vs "North American English" bird names, are those of us in
> the United States supposed to learn all the languages of the world,
> including their characters in Sanskrit, Arabic, Chinese, Japanese, etc.,
> etc. so that there is only one "common" name for each species that is
> standard across the entire planet? Or, could we do like we do with
> everything else and have different names for the same thing, for
> instance a "boat", in different parts of the world with translation from
> language to language?
>
> And, what about the probability that something like "black bird" in
> different languages is actually referring to different birds in
> different places?
>
> This whole process seems like it is going to backfire so far as
> "inclusivity" is concerned. It is going to turn off the average person
> who is somewhat interested in birding more than it is going to attract
> them into the "fold" of serious birders, to be told "We don't call them
> that, anymore (humph)!"
>
> But, it is sure to increase the sale of bird books - for a short while.
>
> Steve Long - realistic curmudgeon
>
>
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>
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>
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>
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Date: 11/3/23 4:51 pm From: Steve Long <steve.long4...> Subject: Re: [MDBirding] Bird Names will be changing!
Well, we are going far astray here, so I am not going to pursue this
much farther.
But, I just can't resist pointing out that using Latin is still not
consistent with the VAST majority of people on our shared planet. There
are FAR more Indians, and almost as many Chinese, than there ever were
Romans, and both had civilizations that predate the Romans by
substantial margins. Clearly, in ethnic fairness, we should all learn
one or the other to pursue birding. But, perhaps we should hold off on
the transition until after the next war between these nuclear-armed
historical rivals - we would not want to have to learn Sanskrit AND
Chinese traditional characters because we picked the loser, right? RIGHT?
Seriously, I am just pointing out that this idea that birders need to
change to be "fair" and/or "inclusive" is being pushed from a point of
view that is highly biased, anyway. The folks who are thinking that
they are "being better" really are not so much better as they are
claiming to be.
Steve Long
On 11/3/2023 6:51 PM, Mike Bowen wrote:
> Seems to me that using the names in a dead language (Latin is surely
> dead as a currently spoken language, although Romansh, still spoken by
> a very few in Switzerland, comes close) can logically be suggested as
> a common basis all over the world.
>
> Funnily enough, that's the language we see in parentheses behind the
> local (language) in field guides in different languages all over the
> world. That's the language we need to adopt as a standard. Everything
> else is politics.
>
> Maybe it's not this simple, but please tell me why not.
>
> Mike Bowen
>
> Bethesda
>
> D. H. Michael Bowen
> 8609 Ewing Drive
> Bethesda, Maryland 20817
> Phone: (202) 236-0510
> Ambassador for American Bird Conservancy, helping ABC help the birds
> eBird volunteer Hotspot Reviewer/Editor for Maryland, Delaware, the
> District of Columbia, and the Republic of Ghana
>
>
> On Friday, November 3, 2023 at 06:03:37 PM EDT, Steve Long
> <steve.long4...> wrote:
>
>
> Frankly, this whole thing smacks of bureaucracy rather than science or
> fairness.
>
> Since the Roman's were not exactly "politically correct" people, perhaps
> we should not be naming everything in their dead language, either. Why
> memorialize colonizing slave holders who used torture, etc., etc.,
> etc.? Let's not disrupt just every amateur birder, let's go get those
> terrible professional ornithologists who make their living by
> memorializing terrible ancient people. (/sarcasm)
>
> Seriously, I can see renaming some birds, but the justification for this
> whole-sale process seems silly.
>
> As for local vs "North American English" bird names, are those of us in
> the United States supposed to learn all the languages of the world,
> including their characters in Sanskrit, Arabic, Chinese, Japanese, etc.,
> etc. so that there is only one "common" name for each species that is
> standard across the entire planet? Or, could we do like we do with
> everything else and have different names for the same thing, for
> instance a "boat", in different parts of the world with translation from
> language to language?
>
> And, what about the probability that something like "black bird" in
> different languages is actually referring to different birds in
> different places?
>
> This whole process seems like it is going to backfire so far as
> "inclusivity" is concerned. It is going to turn off the average person
> who is somewhat interested in birding more than it is going to attract
> them into the "fold" of serious birders, to be told "We don't call them
> that, anymore (humph)!"
>
> But, it is sure to increase the sale of bird books - for a short while.
>
> Steve Long - realistic curmudgeon
>
>
> --
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>
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Date: 11/3/23 3:51 pm From: 'Mike Bowen' via Maryland & DC Birding <mdbirding...> Subject: Re: [MDBirding] Bird Names will be changing!
Seems to me that using the names in a dead language (Latin is surely dead as a currently spoken language, although Romansh, still spoken by a very few in Switzerland, comes close) can logically be suggested as a common basis all over the world.
Funnily enough, that's the language we see in parentheses behind the local (language) in field guides in different languages all over the world. That's the language we need to adopt as a standard. Everything else is politics.
Maybe it's not this simple, but please tell me why not.
Mike Bowen
Bethesda
D. H. Michael Bowen
8609 Ewing Drive
Bethesda, Maryland 20817Phone: (202) 236-0510Ambassador for American Bird Conservancy, helping ABC help the birdseBird volunteer Hotspot Reviewer/Editor for Maryland, Delaware, the District of Columbia, and the Republic of Ghana
On Friday, November 3, 2023 at 06:03:37 PM EDT, Steve Long <steve.long4...> wrote:
Frankly, this whole thing smacks of bureaucracy rather than science or
fairness.
Since the Roman's were not exactly "politically correct" people, perhaps
we should not be naming everything in their dead language, either. Why
memorialize colonizing slave holders who used torture, etc., etc.,
etc.? Let's not disrupt just every amateur birder, let's go get those
terrible professional ornithologists who make their living by
memorializing terrible ancient people. (/sarcasm)
Seriously, I can see renaming some birds, but the justification for this
whole-sale process seems silly.
As for local vs "North American English" bird names, are those of us in
the United States supposed to learn all the languages of the world,
including their characters in Sanskrit, Arabic, Chinese, Japanese, etc.,
etc. so that there is only one "common" name for each species that is
standard across the entire planet? Or, could we do like we do with
everything else and have different names for the same thing, for
instance a "boat", in different parts of the world with translation from
language to language?
And, what about the probability that something like "black bird" in
different languages is actually referring to different birds in
different places?
This whole process seems like it is going to backfire so far as
"inclusivity" is concerned. It is going to turn off the average person
who is somewhat interested in birding more than it is going to attract
them into the "fold" of serious birders, to be told "We don't call them
that, anymore (humph)!"
But, it is sure to increase the sale of bird books - for a short while.
Steve Long - realistic curmudgeon
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Date: 11/3/23 3:03 pm From: Steve Long <steve.long4...> Subject: Re: [MDBirding] Bird Names will be changing!
Frankly, this whole thing smacks of bureaucracy rather than science or
fairness.
Since the Roman's were not exactly "politically correct" people, perhaps
we should not be naming everything in their dead language, either. Why
memorialize colonizing slave holders who used torture, etc., etc.,
etc.? Let's not disrupt just every amateur birder, let's go get those
terrible professional ornithologists who make their living by
memorializing terrible ancient people. (/sarcasm)
Seriously, I can see renaming some birds, but the justification for this
whole-sale process seems silly.
As for local vs "North American English" bird names, are those of us in
the United States supposed to learn all the languages of the world,
including their characters in Sanskrit, Arabic, Chinese, Japanese, etc.,
etc. so that there is only one "common" name for each species that is
standard across the entire planet? Or, could we do like we do with
everything else and have different names for the same thing, for
instance a "boat", in different parts of the world with translation from
language to language?
And, what about the probability that something like "black bird" in
different languages is actually referring to different birds in
different places?
This whole process seems like it is going to backfire so far as
"inclusivity" is concerned. It is going to turn off the average person
who is somewhat interested in birding more than it is going to attract
them into the "fold" of serious birders, to be told "We don't call them
that, anymore (humph)!"
But, it is sure to increase the sale of bird books - for a short while.
Steve Long - realistic curmudgeon
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Date: 11/3/23 12:08 pm From: Maryanne Dolan <maryanne.dolan...> Subject: Re: [MDBirding] Bird Names will be changing!
To shift the discussion a bit to another angle.....I am just back from a
trip to South Africa, where the local guides were miffed that 'others'
(read Americans) dared to rename their endemics. Ebird was the culprit,
but I wouldn't be surprised if there were more fingers in that pie.
best
Maryanne Dolan
Cecil County
On Fri, Nov 3, 2023 at 1:48 PM Rick Borchelt <rborchelt...> wrote:
> For those who don't have a hard copy on your shelf to pull down, there is
> a pdf version available
> https://www.georgiabackroads.com/Articles/Obsolete%20Names%20of%20Birds.pdf >
>
> On Fri, Nov 3, 2023 at 11:32 AM '<suscipe...>' via Maryland & DC
> Birding <mdbirding...> wrote:
>
>> Decided to pull my old copy of ”Obsolete English Names of North American
>> Birds and Their Modern Equivalents” off the shelf. It was published in
>> 1988 by Fish and Wildlife Service.
>>
>> I was particularly intrigued by the old names for the bird the AOU
>> depicted in its media push this week, Sayirnis saya - Say’s Phoebe -
>> named for Thomas Say. This bird was called San Jose Phoebe, San Pedro
>> Martir Phoebe, and Yukon Phoebe before it was named for Say.
>>
>> Say was a significant naturalist of the early 19th century. He came from
>> a Quaker family and I don’t think he has any claims of egregious behavior
>> and/or violations of modern standards against him. He contributed much
>> more to entomology than ornithology, though an expedition for which he
>> served as zoologist in 1821 produced the first descriptions of several
>> western birds. I will be sad to see his name removed from Say’s Phoebe.
>>
>> Also of note, our own Eastern Phoebe is named for Say as well. According
>> to Diana Wells in 100 Birds and How They Got Their Names, “in 1854
>> Audubon’s eastern and Say’s Phoebe were renamed Sayornis (in honor of
>> Say),” and so the Latin name of Eastern is Sayornis phoebe.
>>
>> David Gersten
>> Laurel, MD
>>
>>
>> [image: Inline image]
>>
>> [image: Inline image]
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Sent from the all new AOL app for iOS
>>
>> On Wednesday, November 1, 2023, 10:40 PM, 'Mike Bowen' via Maryland & DC
>> Birding <mdbirding...> wrote:
>>
>> Gail's fascinating tale of Prince Ruspoli and the Turaco to which he gave
>> his name takes me back in memory to a lengthy search I was involved with in
>> November, 2010, mounted by the British bird tour company Birdquest, to look
>> for the Turaco that bears his name in the wilds of Southern Ethiopia. My
>> 2010 bird even seems to sport a crown, which logically argues for retention
>> of the princely name!:
>>
>> [image: Inline image]
>>
>> Mike Bowen
>> Bethesda
>>
>> D. H. Michael Bowen
>> 8609 Ewing Drive
>> Bethesda, Maryland 20817
>> Phone: (202) 236-0510
>> Ambassador for American Bird Conservancy, helping ABC help the birds
>> eBird volunteer Hotspot Reviewer/Editor for Maryland, Delaware, the
>> District of Columbia, and the Republic of Ghana
>>
>>
>> On Wednesday, November 1, 2023 at 10:17:46 PM EDT, Marcia Watson <
>> <marshwren50...> wrote:
>>
>>
>> Great story, Gail!
>>
>> Marcia
>> ------------
>> Marcia Watson
>> Phoenix, MD
>>
>>
>> > On Nov 1, 2023, at 10:10 PM, Gail Mackiernan <katahdinss...>
>> wrote:
>> >
>> > One eponymous name which I am ambivalent about changing is that of
>> Prince Ruspoli’s Turaco, a pink-tufted, green Turaco found in Ethiopia.
>> Prince Eugenio Ruspoli was a 19th century Italian explorer and naturalist
>> who undertook some of the first expeditions into that part of the Horn of
>> Africa. He collected a number of new species of both plants and animals,
>> and made a number of important ecological, mineralogical and geographical
>> observations.
>> >
>> > However at the same time, he and some of his companions massacred
>> native people and looted their villages. He also slaughtered hundreds of
>> animals, far more than was needed for his scientific collections, just for
>> fun. In other words, he was a really terrible person.
>> >
>> > However, every time I hear the name of that bird, I think about how
>> karma is, really, a bitch. Seems Ruspoli was out collecting specimens in
>> Somalia when he encountered a large bull elephant . Naturally, being who he
>> was, he shot it. The annoyed elephant grabbed Ruspoli with his trunk, swung
>> him around a few times, bashed him to the ground and proceeded to trample
>> him flat. His expedition companions, in examining his effects, found a
>> specimen of an unknown turaco in his collection bag. There were no notes as
>> to where the bird had been shot, other than somewhere in the region.
>> However the species was eventually described named in his honor, Turaco
>> ruspolii (now Menellikornis ruspolii) although it was not for some years
>> that the bird’s origin and habitat was discovered.
>> >
>> > It could be renamed Pink-Crested Turaco but that would really spoil the
>> story of an SOB getting just what he deserved!
>> >
>> > Gail Mackiernan!
>> > Colesville
>> >
>> > Sent from my iPad
>> >
>> >
>> > --
>> > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
>> Group 'Maryland & DC Birding'.
>> > To view group guidelines or change email preferences, visit this group
>> on the web at http://www.mdbirding.com >> > Unfamiliar with a hotspot mentioned on this list? Quickly locate it
>> here - http://www.mdbirding.com/hotspot.html >> > ---
>> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
>> Groups "Maryland & DC Birding" group.
>> > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send
>> an email to mdbirding+<unsubscribe...>
>> > To view this discussion on the web visit
>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/mdbirding/<38F093C9-F327-4243-9A1D-4BAE25A9ED8A...> >> .
>>
>>
>> --
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>>
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>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/mdbirding/<19E41A33-B4A7-45C7-952E-187F443F6FE0...> >> .
>>
>> --
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>> To view this discussion on the web visit
>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/mdbirding/<427566199.1156947.1698892809671...> >> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/mdbirding/<427566199.1156947.1698892809671...>?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >> .
>>
>> --
>> -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
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>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/mdbirding/<1728652639.1679372.1699025502047...> >> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/mdbirding/<1728652639.1679372.1699025502047...>?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >> .
>>
>
>
> --
> Rick Borchelt
> College Park, MD
> preferred personal email: rborchelt |AT| gmail |DOT| com
>
> http://leplog.wordpress.com >
> --
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On Fri, Nov 3, 2023 at 11:32 AM '<suscipe...>' via Maryland & DC
Birding <mdbirding...> wrote:
> Decided to pull my old copy of ”Obsolete English Names of North American
> Birds and Their Modern Equivalents” off the shelf. It was published in
> 1988 by Fish and Wildlife Service.
>
> I was particularly intrigued by the old names for the bird the AOU
> depicted in its media push this week, Sayirnis saya - Say’s Phoebe -
> named for Thomas Say. This bird was called San Jose Phoebe, San Pedro
> Martir Phoebe, and Yukon Phoebe before it was named for Say.
>
> Say was a significant naturalist of the early 19th century. He came from
> a Quaker family and I don’t think he has any claims of egregious behavior
> and/or violations of modern standards against him. He contributed much
> more to entomology than ornithology, though an expedition for which he
> served as zoologist in 1821 produced the first descriptions of several
> western birds. I will be sad to see his name removed from Say’s Phoebe.
>
> Also of note, our own Eastern Phoebe is named for Say as well. According
> to Diana Wells in 100 Birds and How They Got Their Names, “in 1854
> Audubon’s eastern and Say’s Phoebe were renamed Sayornis (in honor of
> Say),” and so the Latin name of Eastern is Sayornis phoebe.
>
> David Gersten
> Laurel, MD
>
>
> [image: Inline image]
>
> [image: Inline image]
>
>
>
>
> Sent from the all new AOL app for iOS
>
> On Wednesday, November 1, 2023, 10:40 PM, 'Mike Bowen' via Maryland & DC
> Birding <mdbirding...> wrote:
>
> Gail's fascinating tale of Prince Ruspoli and the Turaco to which he gave
> his name takes me back in memory to a lengthy search I was involved with in
> November, 2010, mounted by the British bird tour company Birdquest, to look
> for the Turaco that bears his name in the wilds of Southern Ethiopia. My
> 2010 bird even seems to sport a crown, which logically argues for retention
> of the princely name!:
>
> [image: Inline image]
>
> Mike Bowen
> Bethesda
>
> D. H. Michael Bowen
> 8609 Ewing Drive
> Bethesda, Maryland 20817
> Phone: (202) 236-0510
> Ambassador for American Bird Conservancy, helping ABC help the birds
> eBird volunteer Hotspot Reviewer/Editor for Maryland, Delaware, the
> District of Columbia, and the Republic of Ghana
>
>
> On Wednesday, November 1, 2023 at 10:17:46 PM EDT, Marcia Watson <
> <marshwren50...> wrote:
>
>
> Great story, Gail!
>
> Marcia
> ------------
> Marcia Watson
> Phoenix, MD
>
>
> > On Nov 1, 2023, at 10:10 PM, Gail Mackiernan <katahdinss...>
> wrote:
> >
> > One eponymous name which I am ambivalent about changing is that of
> Prince Ruspoli’s Turaco, a pink-tufted, green Turaco found in Ethiopia.
> Prince Eugenio Ruspoli was a 19th century Italian explorer and naturalist
> who undertook some of the first expeditions into that part of the Horn of
> Africa. He collected a number of new species of both plants and animals,
> and made a number of important ecological, mineralogical and geographical
> observations.
> >
> > However at the same time, he and some of his companions massacred native
> people and looted their villages. He also slaughtered hundreds of animals,
> far more than was needed for his scientific collections, just for fun. In
> other words, he was a really terrible person.
> >
> > However, every time I hear the name of that bird, I think about how
> karma is, really, a bitch. Seems Ruspoli was out collecting specimens in
> Somalia when he encountered a large bull elephant . Naturally, being who he
> was, he shot it. The annoyed elephant grabbed Ruspoli with his trunk, swung
> him around a few times, bashed him to the ground and proceeded to trample
> him flat. His expedition companions, in examining his effects, found a
> specimen of an unknown turaco in his collection bag. There were no notes as
> to where the bird had been shot, other than somewhere in the region.
> However the species was eventually described named in his honor, Turaco
> ruspolii (now Menellikornis ruspolii) although it was not for some years
> that the bird’s origin and habitat was discovered.
> >
> > It could be renamed Pink-Crested Turaco but that would really spoil the
> story of an SOB getting just what he deserved!
> >
> > Gail Mackiernan!
> > Colesville
> >
> > Sent from my iPad
> >
> >
> > --
> > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
> Group 'Maryland & DC Birding'.
> > To view group guidelines or change email preferences, visit this group
> on the web at http://www.mdbirding.com > > Unfamiliar with a hotspot mentioned on this list? Quickly locate it here
> - http://www.mdbirding.com/hotspot.html > > ---
> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
> Groups "Maryland & DC Birding" group.
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> an email to mdbirding+<unsubscribe...>
> > To view this discussion on the web visit
> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/mdbirding/<38F093C9-F327-4243-9A1D-4BAE25A9ED8A...> > .
>
>
> --
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>
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>
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>
--
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College Park, MD
preferred personal email: rborchelt |AT| gmail |DOT| com
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Date: 11/3/23 8:32 am From: '<suscipe...>' via Maryland & DC Birding <mdbirding...> Subject: Re: [MDBirding] Bird Names will be changing!
Decided to pull my old copy of ”Obsolete English Names of North American Birds and Their Modern Equivalents” off the shelf. It was published in 1988 by Fish and Wildlife Service.
I was particularly intrigued by the old names for the bird the AOU depicted in its media push this week, Sayirnis saya - Say’s Phoebe - named for Thomas Say. This bird was called San Jose Phoebe, San Pedro Martir Phoebe, and Yukon Phoebe before it was named for Say.
Say was a significant naturalist of the early 19th century. He came from a Quaker family and I don’t think he has any claims of egregious behavior and/or violations of modern standards against him. He contributed much more to entomology than ornithology, though an expedition for which he served as zoologist in 1821 produced the first descriptions of several western birds. I will be sad to see his name removed from Say’s Phoebe.
Also of note, our own Eastern Phoebe is named for Say as well. According to Diana Wells in 100 Birds and How They Got Their Names, “in 1854 Audubon’s eastern and Say’s Phoebe were renamed Sayornis (in honor of Say),” and so the Latin name of Eastern is Sayornis phoebe.
David GerstenLaurel, MD
Sent from the all new AOL app for iOS
On Wednesday, November 1, 2023, 10:40 PM, 'Mike Bowen' via Maryland & DC Birding <mdbirding...> wrote:
Gail's fascinating tale of Prince Ruspoli and the Turaco to which he gave his name takes me back in memory to a lengthy search I was involved with in November, 2010, mounted by the British bird tour company Birdquest, to look for the Turaco that bears his name in the wilds of Southern Ethiopia. My 2010 bird even seems to sport a crown, which logically argues for retention of the princely name!:
Mike BowenBethesda
D. H. Michael Bowen
8609 Ewing Drive
Bethesda, Maryland 20817Phone: (202) 236-0510Ambassador for American Bird Conservancy, helping ABC help the birdseBird volunteer Hotspot Reviewer/Editor for Maryland, Delaware, the District of Columbia, and the Republic of Ghana
On Wednesday, November 1, 2023 at 10:17:46 PM EDT, Marcia Watson <marshwren50...> wrote:
Great story, Gail!
Marcia
------------
Marcia Watson
Phoenix, MD
> On Nov 1, 2023, at 10:10 PM, Gail Mackiernan <katahdinss...> wrote:
>
> One eponymous name which I am ambivalent about changing is that of Prince Ruspoli’s Turaco, a pink-tufted, green Turaco found in Ethiopia. Prince Eugenio Ruspoli was a 19th century Italian explorer and naturalist who undertook some of the first expeditions into that part of the Horn of Africa. He collected a number of new species of both plants and animals, and made a number of important ecological, mineralogical and geographical observations.
>
> However at the same time, he and some of his companions massacred native people and looted their villages. He also slaughtered hundreds of animals, far more than was needed for his scientific collections, just for fun. In other words, he was a really terrible person.
>
> However, every time I hear the name of that bird, I think about how karma is, really, a bitch. Seems Ruspoli was out collecting specimens in Somalia when he encountered a large bull elephant . Naturally, being who he was, he shot it. The annoyed elephant grabbed Ruspoli with his trunk, swung him around a few times, bashed him to the ground and proceeded to trample him flat. His expedition companions, in examining his effects, found a specimen of an unknown turaco in his collection bag. There were no notes as to where the bird had been shot, other than somewhere in the region. However the species was eventually described named in his honor, Turaco ruspolii (now Menellikornis ruspolii) although it was not for some years that the bird’s origin and habitat was discovered.
>
> It could be renamed Pink-Crested Turaco but that would really spoil the story of an SOB getting just what he deserved!
>
> Gail Mackiernan!
> Colesville
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
>
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Date: 11/1/23 7:40 pm From: 'Mike Bowen' via Maryland & DC Birding <mdbirding...> Subject: Re: [MDBirding] Bird Names will be changing!
Gail's fascinating tale of Prince Ruspoli and the Turaco to which he gave his name takes me back in memory to a lengthy search I was involved with in November, 2010, mounted by the British bird tour company Birdquest, to look for the Turaco that bears his name in the wilds of Southern Ethiopia. My 2010 bird even seems to sport a crown, which logically argues for retention of the princely name!:
Mike BowenBethesda
D. H. Michael Bowen
8609 Ewing Drive
Bethesda, Maryland 20817Phone: (202) 236-0510Ambassador for American Bird Conservancy, helping ABC help the birdseBird volunteer Hotspot Reviewer/Editor for Maryland, Delaware, the District of Columbia, and the Republic of Ghana
On Wednesday, November 1, 2023 at 10:17:46 PM EDT, Marcia Watson <marshwren50...> wrote:
Great story, Gail!
Marcia
------------
Marcia Watson
Phoenix, MD
> On Nov 1, 2023, at 10:10 PM, Gail Mackiernan <katahdinss...> wrote:
>
> One eponymous name which I am ambivalent about changing is that of Prince Ruspoli’s Turaco, a pink-tufted, green Turaco found in Ethiopia. Prince Eugenio Ruspoli was a 19th century Italian explorer and naturalist who undertook some of the first expeditions into that part of the Horn of Africa. He collected a number of new species of both plants and animals, and made a number of important ecological, mineralogical and geographical observations.
>
> However at the same time, he and some of his companions massacred native people and looted their villages. He also slaughtered hundreds of animals, far more than was needed for his scientific collections, just for fun. In other words, he was a really terrible person.
>
> However, every time I hear the name of that bird, I think about how karma is, really, a bitch. Seems Ruspoli was out collecting specimens in Somalia when he encountered a large bull elephant . Naturally, being who he was, he shot it. The annoyed elephant grabbed Ruspoli with his trunk, swung him around a few times, bashed him to the ground and proceeded to trample him flat. His expedition companions, in examining his effects, found a specimen of an unknown turaco in his collection bag. There were no notes as to where the bird had been shot, other than somewhere in the region. However the species was eventually described named in his honor, Turaco ruspolii (now Menellikornis ruspolii) although it was not for some years that the bird’s origin and habitat was discovered.
>
> It could be renamed Pink-Crested Turaco but that would really spoil the story of an SOB getting just what he deserved!
>
> Gail Mackiernan!
> Colesville
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
>
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Date: 11/1/23 7:17 pm From: Marcia Watson <marshwren50...> Subject: Re: [MDBirding] Bird Names will be changing!
Great story, Gail!
Marcia
------------
Marcia Watson
Phoenix, MD
> On Nov 1, 2023, at 10:10 PM, Gail Mackiernan <katahdinss...> wrote:
>
> One eponymous name which I am ambivalent about changing is that of Prince Ruspoli’s Turaco, a pink-tufted, green Turaco found in Ethiopia. Prince Eugenio Ruspoli was a 19th century Italian explorer and naturalist who undertook some of the first expeditions into that part of the Horn of Africa. He collected a number of new species of both plants and animals, and made a number of important ecological, mineralogical and geographical observations.
>
> However at the same time, he and some of his companions massacred native people and looted their villages. He also slaughtered hundreds of animals, far more than was needed for his scientific collections, just for fun. In other words, he was a really terrible person.
>
> However, every time I hear the name of that bird, I think about how karma is, really, a bitch. Seems Ruspoli was out collecting specimens in Somalia when he encountered a large bull elephant . Naturally, being who he was, he shot it. The annoyed elephant grabbed Ruspoli with his trunk, swung him around a few times, bashed him to the ground and proceeded to trample him flat. His expedition companions, in examining his effects, found a specimen of an unknown turaco in his collection bag. There were no notes as to where the bird had been shot, other than somewhere in the region. However the species was eventually described named in his honor, Turaco ruspolii (now Menellikornis ruspolii) although it was not for some years that the bird’s origin and habitat was discovered.
>
> It could be renamed Pink-Crested Turaco but that would really spoil the story of an SOB getting just what he deserved!
>
> Gail Mackiernan!
> Colesville
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
>
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Date: 11/1/23 7:10 pm From: Gail Mackiernan <katahdinss...> Subject: Re: [MDBirding] Bird Names will be changing!
One eponymous name which I am ambivalent about changing is that of Prince Ruspoli’s Turaco, a pink-tufted, green Turaco found in Ethiopia. Prince Eugenio Ruspoli was a 19th century Italian explorer and naturalist who undertook some of the first expeditions into that part of the Horn of Africa. He collected a number of new species of both plants and animals, and made a number of important ecological, mineralogical and geographical observations.
However at the same time, he and some of his companions massacred native people and looted their villages. He also slaughtered hundreds of animals, far more than was needed for his scientific collections, just for fun. In other words, he was a really terrible person.
However, every time I hear the name of that bird, I think about how karma is, really, a bitch. Seems Ruspoli was out collecting specimens in Somalia when he encountered a large bull elephant . Naturally, being who he was, he shot it. The annoyed elephant grabbed Ruspoli with his trunk, swung him around a few times, bashed him to the ground and proceeded to trample him flat. His expedition companions, in examining his effects, found a specimen of an unknown turaco in his collection bag. There were no notes as to where the bird had been shot, other than somewhere in the region. However the species was eventually described named in his honor, Turaco ruspolii (now Menellikornis ruspolii) although it was not for some years that the bird’s origin and habitat was discovered.
It could be renamed Pink-Crested Turaco but that would really spoil the story of an SOB getting just what he deserved!
Gail Mackiernan!
Colesville
Sent from my iPad
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Date: 11/1/23 5:33 pm From: Sarah Lister <samjlister13...> Subject: Re: [MDBirding] Bird Names will be changing!
I second Gail's comment! I typecast birders as generally good and decent
people; let's live up to it.
Morphologically relevant names are great, though I hope behavior-based
names are also considered. (A la the marvelous American dipper, or the
Mockingbird.)
On Wed, Nov 1, 2023, 6:48 PM Gail Mackiernan <katahdinss...> wrote:
> Well, it is a good start, but must not become just a bandaid over the more
> serious issue of underrepresented groups birding, or, in fact, enjoying
> natural environments in general. Not 100% convinced eponymous names have
> presented any particular barrier as, for most of us, the unsavory aspects
> of these individuals’ biographies has been a total - and unhappy -
> revelation. The diversity in birding problem is deeper and will require
> extensive outreach.
>
> Also, I hope more thought goes into the new names than was given to the
> former McCown’s Longspur. (Large-billed? Why wasn’t it “Rufous-shouldered”-
> one of the bird’s most striking field marks - or “Bridled”, referring to
> its unique harness-like facial stripes? ) Let’s not end up with more of
> those oft-ridiculed names which seem to be based on the bird’s most obscure
> feature. (Looking at you, Ring-necked Duck.)
>
> Gail Mackiernan
> Colesville
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
> On Nov 1, 2023, at 2:11 PM, Corey Bice <profbice9...> wrote:
>
> How do you guys feel about this?
>
>
> On Wed, Nov 1, 2023, 13:17 David Powell <seneca.ranger...> wrote:
>
>> Overdue changes to some bird names.
>>
>>
>> https://www.washingtonpost.com/climate-environment/2023/11/01/bird-names-racism-audubon/ >>
>>
>> Dave Powell
>>
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>>
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I think someone might have made reference to this ...
HOGCHOKERS, POPES, AND PIGWITCHES - revisited. a celebration of colloquial names.
Been well nigh on these 20 some years now. This was well-received, in some quarters, at that time. So … here ’tis again for y’all with some changes and add-ons. Thanks to Phil Davis, Jared Fisher, Larry Riddle, and David Fleischmann for unearthing this document, lost from my files otherwise. Seen any Labrador Twisters lately? Pigwitches? Then why the hell not?
Not for ONE MOMENT should it be supposed that this is making fun of the way
people talk. I love to hear a good Eastern Shore accent. Sadly that is disappearing
as young folks move away, or get acclimated or assimilated through the services or
colleges, or from watching too much TV. Tom Horton writes that where the
Eastern Shore patois really gets used heavy is when watermen are out there talking
amongst themselves.
One of our guides, Albert Heath, spoke with such a thick accent he was almost
incomprehensible … to me. Likewise he could hardly understand us. It took us
a while, once, to realize, because of this confusion, that he’d left us off on the
wrong island. It didn’t make much difference because our respective 2 groups saw
a Snowy Owl on both Ship Shoal and Myrtle islands. Another time he couldn’t get
back to pick us up because of an extremely low tide. Finally after dark he appeared.
We headed south to collect the Smith Island crew, who had built a fire for us to
home in on. Navigating at high speed through those tortuous tidal guts in the dark
was quite an impressive feat. Albert, rest his soul, done us good.- Harry.
In an earlier post the use of the name Hogchoker, a small species of
flounder (sole), drew some commentary. It doesn't sound as if it ought to be, but
Hogchoker (Trinectes maculatus) is the genuine English name used by the scientific
community. The Sea Nettle, our common jellyfish, is also both the colloquial
name and the proper English name. The best of 2 worlds.
Here is a fanciful enumeration of other species, as it might sound like
coming from an Eastern Shore of Virginia waterman. Of course many birds
are known locally, and/or colloquially, by their "correct" names such as snipe,
Brant, loons, etc. I’ve taken a few liberties, but not many, in the name of poetic license.
Some of the colloquial names are better, sometimes much better, than the
“proper” English names. There’s a “glossary” at the end of this. Here goes.
Fasten your safety belts and put your seats in the upright position.
Time to cut loose … again.:
Yes, we got Hogchokers and other fishes, your Spot, Hardheads, Croakers, Trout,
and Rock. Puppy Drum, Alewives, Bunkers, and others. Then there's
Blowtoads, Oystercrackers, and Dowdies, too. And Doubleheads, but you can't
eat them, though some do. They’re good for bait.
Far as crabs go, it's like the Eskimos. They got all sort of names for
different kinds of ice and snow. Down here we got names for all the crab
sorts. There's busters, popes, shedders, softcrabs, she-bitties, papershells, and
doublers (the one underneath's always a softie), your ordinary hard crab,
and, of course, there's jimmies and sooks. Those are all names for the
sorts of Blue Crabs; jimmies are males, sooks females.
Now birds, that's somethin' else. Lot of them little sandpipers, we got
all sorts. The big ones, the Straight-billed Curlew, they used to shoot and eat
them. Sea Crows, too. And Curlew, as well. In the old days they'd also shoot
Calicobacks, Robin Snipe, and Sewin' Machines. And Black-breasted Beetlers.
And all them little peeps.
You want to see those sandpipers, get Filmore, or Wesley, or Shotbill to take you
in their deadrise, out to Thoms Creek ‘bout half-tide. Zoot Zoot knows how to
get hold of them, or else just go down to Buddy Boy Busterson’s depot and ask.
Ducks was commoner then, but there's still lots of Little Dippers, Clubheads
(we also call them Whifflers or Whistlers), and Southerlies, which we oftimes call
South, South Southerlies, or Pintails. Out on the ocean Skunkheads are real common
and other types of sea coots. You go real far out to sea, farther than I go for the
shad in February, you get tuna birds in summer. Never see them from
land.
Out there past the skinny water is where you get those sorts, mostly. Diver ducks.
Other places got more ponds and freshwater than we do hereabouts,
they got more ducks like Sprigs, Spoonbills, and teal. Oh, we got them, too,
but not many.
In the old days there's was but one gull in summer and that was the
Cacklin' Gull, called Soft Crab Gull, too. Now, the Winter Gulls is nestin’
on the islands as well. Time was, you’d never see a winter gull here but
in winter. All the old names, like Egg Harbor, Gull Marsh, Great Egging
Beach, and the like, that was cause they'd go out there and gather gull eggs and
they would make a good omelet or two with that. Then let' em alone to do their
business and nest again.
Big groups of gulls and strikers, Little Strikers, and Big Strikers, still nest on the
islands as well as Flood Gulls, which we also call the Scissorbill or Cutwater.
The littlest striker we call the Minnie Hawk.
What you call the cormorant, well, you know what sort of names they have,
and Shag is one of the more polite ones. No need to tell you the others.
Those are words a smart person don't say no more. Although you might say
Shitpoke, but not t'other, unless you were to say Pocomoke Goose or
Baltimore Goose. I know one thing, there's more and more each year.
In early April or late March there’s lots uh little divers, we call
Pigwitches. And in the summer there's the little heron, called Scowp 'cause of
the way they call when you jump him. Of course you know the White Crane and
the Blue Crane, the blue one sometimes called Forty Quarts of Soup or Old
Cranky. Them night herons, I believe you say, here is called the Wop or
Bumcutter cause of what he sounds like. There’s a hammock up north of
Ewell on Smith’s Island we call Woptown.
Them fish ducks, there's not much to eatin' one, but they're good to shoot
at anyway. You get the Hairy Head or French Pheasant, or Pond Snout, in the
little sloughs and ditches, up the guts, the Sheldrake or regular Pheasant out
on the bays and ocean. You know … Fish ducks. Sawbills. Those and
other diver ducks.
Every so often, when there's a big freezeup or blizzard in Jersey, or
Canada, then the woodcocks pile in here like crazy. Take Hans' spaniel out
and you'd flush one every twenty feet. Up north they call them Labrador
Twisters or Bogsuckers. Timberdoodles even. In Ninety-three we got a
real cold rain, coated all the rushes, sedges and trees with ice. Everything. The
woodcocks like to froze. Chicken Hawks was hitting them right off the grass.
Goin' down 600 woodcocks, blackbirds, Killdees, Field Larks, and Canaries was
all along the roadside shoulders. Couldn't help but hit some with the truck.
Now the bigger stuff, ‘possums, ‘coons, skunks, your haners and whistle pigs,
and of course the deers, the sump buzzards will come down and take care of
that, right on the roads. Eagles at times, too. Roadkill.
Cousin Wesley, “Sneaky Boy”, is partial to roadkill. Long as it was just some
little impact and not gettin’ squashed, he was a good judge of freshness, and
the rabbits and deer he’d eat at times. He’s that way. I suppose that makes
some sense, but, unless it’s been hunted or fished, I get my food store bought.
But once Jared and I found a 10-lb. rockfish right on the road, fallen off a truck.
He put it inside my left hip wader, but when we got to Sewards he dressed it
out into steaks. Now in that same county, mostly marsh, where else would you
find a roadkill thunder pumper, next to the road at Parsons Creek and the
Stewart Canal?
Big old Sicklebill. Never used to see him at all until the sixties. Now there's
white ones, too. In with the herons and cranes.
In September, when there's doves before the Partridge season, you can also
shoot the Sage Hens or Marsh Guineas when the tide's good and flooded.
Time was, the tradition for that was a big deal. Big shots would come from
Washington to do it. Nowsdays hardly anyone bothers, but if you breast him
out and put bacon strips on it, it is right tasty.
That's about the smart of it. And when the tide starts to slack, when she begins
to let out, that's when your Sage Hen will start to hollerin'. There's other smaller
mudhens, too, and such, about the size of a Field Lark, but you don't see
them as much as you see the Sage Hen. Railbirds. Marsh guineas. Mudhens.
You know what I mean. At low tide the Sage Hen will go after Fiddle Crabs, and
other creepy crawlies.
Also in September, and sometimes in August, you have Reedbirds, or Rice-birds
as they're also known, pilin' into the reed beds at Oyster late in the day. Other
places I know they get shot, or used to, 'cause they’d feed on wild rice, come
already stuffed. Get some light shot in Buster’s old, twist steel, side-by-side 8
- that’s a 16-pound gun - could blow away two dozen at a time. Blast the
suckers. Don’t see the old hammer action scatterguns anymore. No more
black powder shells either ways.
In the evening what we call whip-poor-wills, also called Hollerin’ Boys, will start
to call after sundown, ‘specially in June. Colored Charlie’d call them Hollerin’
Boys. Colored’s got special names for things, just as you college folks got
names different from ours. Also hoot owls and your squinch owl.
Now old Elmo, he was the good one at catching them Snapper Turkles.
Made good stew from them, Sweet meat. Add a couple of dollops of your
sherry wine to it, you’d have something.
Onlyest thing I know, there's not as much huntin' as there used to be and
that's too bad, to see that tradition dyin' out. Of course, I haven’t gone gunnin’
since I was a boy, but it is nice to see a bunch of fellas out on the
marsh enjoyin' themselves. Get away from the little old lady and cut loose
a little.
Even if you come back with nothin' to show you're bound to be better off,
but you might go proggin’ in the afternoon when the birds stop flyin’,
come up with old O. K. Davis baking powder bottles, or others’ floater decoys
got loose during a big blow. Best to look for these around the tumps and sod
banks, or in the debris by the flood tide lines.
Once Weldon found a bunch of porpoise bones, vertebrae, on the backside of
Ship Shoal next to the old watch house. Put them up on his mantel until his
Lydia objected they were next to her Evans family crystal, so he moved them
out back to the garage, where, if there’s not a Tech or other big game, he does
his carving weekends.
The big whale bones Wally found once on the beach of Cobb’s, six-foot ribs,
he painted bright silver, then put them around the old tractor tire Naomi had
filled and planted in geraniums. Don’t make much sense to me, but it’s their
yard, they can do what they want. Plain and fancy.
No tellin’ what one can find out there. Nothin’ better than a day on the marsh or
water. Least ways I see it. Right fair straight.
In memory of Lynwood Horner, waterman, our guide at Cape Charles 1965-1999.
May his very good soul rest in peace. He was always so nice to me and my
family. Machine gunner with the Merchant Marine in The War. He was as
discriminating about birds as most of us. Even when his arthritis
would seize up on him he'd go out there clammin', oysterin', or crabbin’,
or when there was a big wreck of conchs washed up on the shores
from a nor’easter. He didn’t know what it was, but he once described perfectly
a Dovekie he had seen around his boat one winter day, a description that would
have sailed right through any rarities committee review.
Also in tribute to Steve Parker, the late director of the Nature Conservancy’s
Virginia Coastal Reserve. Good humored man. Set us up in the grand
old house at Brownsville for the Nassawadox Christmas count compilation.
Like compiling at Monticello or Mount Vernon. A true gentleman. He’d hunt
black ducks and was fond of his hound. Sense of humor, too. I miss him so.
Thanks to Lynwood, Emma Greene, Charles Cook, Jeff Effinger, John Camper,
Minnie Camper, George Reiger, Marcus Killmon, Stanley Marshall, and others
for clueing me in to these old names and unusual expressions. One of the
names above I made up. Know which one? A few others I haven’t “translated”.
Didn’t wish to make it TOO easy.
Best to all.- Harry Armistead, Philadelphia.
GLOSSARY: big striker: royal tern. blowtoads: Northern
Puffer a.k.a. Swellfish, Swell Toad, or Balloonfish; "Puffers are so named because
of their ability to swell by swallowing water (or air, if they are removed
from water) so that they become globular. This habit discourages
predation." - C. Richard Robins, A field guide to Atlantic coast fishes of
North America.
black-breasted beetler: black-bellied plover. blue crane: great blue
heron. cacklin’ gull: laughing gull. calicoback: ruddy turnstone. canary: American
goldfinch. chicken hawk: red-tailed hawk. clubheads: common goldeneye. conch:
whelk. curlew: whimbrel. dowdies: toadfish. doubleheads: cow-nosed rays. field lark:
eastern meadowlark. flood gull: black skimmer. hairy head: hooded merganser.
haner: a corruption of yellowhammer = yellow-shafted flicker. hollerin’ boys: chuck-
will’s-widows. hoot owl: great horned owl. killdee: killdeer. little dipper: bufflehead.
little striker: Forster’s or common tern. marsh guinea: clapper rail. minnie hawk:
least tern, minnie means minnow. mudhen: clapper or other rail. oystercrackers:
toadfish. partridge: northern bobwhite. pigwitch: horned grebe. pintail: long-tailed duck. reedbird: bobolink. robin snipe: red knot, refers to their breeding plumage. rockfish:
my generic name for vulture. thunder pumper: American bittern. tuna birds:
shearwaters. whip-poor-will: sometimes used locally for chuck-will’s-widow.
whistlepig: woodchuck. white crane: great egret. winter gull: herring gull.
wop: night-heron.
A good source of colloquial names is Edward Howe Forbush’s Birds of
Massachusetts and other New England states (Massachusetts Dept. of Agriculture,
1925-1929, 3 volumes). For instance, this source lists 10 names for Hooded
Merganser.
However, Bird is the word: an historical perspective on the names of North American birds by Gary H. Meiter (McDonald & Woodward Publ. Co., 2020, 437p.) is perhaps the last word in this area, with, for example, 70 colloquial names for Hooded Merganser, 150 for Northern Flicker.
An excellent book, Chesapeake requiem: a year with the watermen of vanishing Tangier Island by Earl Swift (Dey Street, 2018, 435p.), has many more terms for the Blue Crab than appear in “Hogchokers”.
March 16, 2021. 2,627 words.
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Date: 11/1/23 3:48 pm From: Gail Mackiernan <katahdinss...> Subject: Re: [MDBirding] Bird Names will be changing!
Well, it is a good start, but must not become just a bandaid over the more serious issue of underrepresented groups birding, or, in fact, enjoying natural environments in general. Not 100% convinced eponymous names have presented any particular barrier as, for most of us, the unsavory aspects of these individuals’ biographies has been a total - and unhappy - revelation. The diversity in birding problem is deeper and will require extensive outreach.
Also, I hope more thought goes into the new names than was given to the former McCown’s Longspur. (Large-billed? Why wasn’t it “Rufous-shouldered”- one of the bird’s most striking field marks - or “Bridled”, referring to its unique harness-like facial stripes? ) Let’s not end up with more of those oft-ridiculed names which seem to be based on the bird’s most obscure feature. (Looking at you, Ring-necked Duck.)
Gail Mackiernan
Colesville
Sent from my iPad
> On Nov 1, 2023, at 2:11 PM, Corey Bice <profbice9...> wrote:
>
> How do you guys feel about this?
>
>
>> On Wed, Nov 1, 2023, 13:17 David Powell <seneca.ranger...> wrote:
>> Overdue changes to some bird names.
>>
>> https://www.washingtonpost.com/climate-environment/2023/11/01/bird-names-racism-audubon/ >>
>> Dave Powell
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Date: 11/1/23 2:38 pm From: Michelle <fireweaver.michelle...> Subject: Re: [MDBirding] Bird Names will be changing!
I love the charming old colloquial names, like Water Ouzel for American
Dipper... but to bring it back to the original topic, yes, I'd be
absolutely overjoyed to ditch useless eponyms for distinctive plumage
features that anchor the name to the actual description of the bird. It's
a far more logical situation, so the right thing to do twice over.
Michelle Browning
On Wed, Nov 1, 2023 at 5:28 PM Rick Borchelt <rborchelt...> wrote:
> George Armistead had a nice historical blog post of common bird names
>
> THE TOP 10: Best Colloquial Bird Names
> <https://blog.aba.org/2012/06/the-top-10-best-colloquial-bird-names.html> > blog.aba.org
> <https://blog.aba.org/2012/06/the-top-10-best-colloquial-bird-names.html> > [image: favicon.ico]
> <https://blog.aba.org/2012/06/the-top-10-best-colloquial-bird-names.html> > <https://blog.aba.org/2012/06/the-top-10-best-colloquial-bird-names.html> >
>
> On Nov 1, 2023, at 5:09 PM, Marcia Watson <marshwren50...> wrote:
>
> Jack,
>
> I believe that that list of local bird names might have come from Harry
> Armistead. I don’t have it but I’m sure Harry will read this.
>
> My favorite is Devil Diver for Bufflehead - a reference to how long and
> deep they can dive.
>
> Marcia
> ------------
> Marcia Watson
> Phoenix, MD
>
>
> On Nov 1, 2023, at 4:26 PM, Jack Saba <jlsaba001...> wrote:
>
>
> On 11/1/23 16:12, Sarah Lister wrote:
>
>
> Deciding that there was no good way to choose which eponymous names to
> change and which to let be, AOS chose to change all of them.
>
>
> Which is good. Much prefer names that include a clue that helps with the
> ID.
>
>
> On a (very slightly) related topic, a while back someone (maybe Bob
> Ringler?) posted a list (or possibly a link to a list) of alternative
> common names -- like Yellowhammer for Yellow-shafted Woodpecker and
> Timberdoodle for American Woodcock. If anyone have that list or link, would
> you please forward it to me (or post it)?
>
>
> Jack Saba
>
>
> --
>
> Jack Saba
>
> Berwyn Heights
>
> <jlsaba001...>
>
>
> --
>
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>
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Date: 11/1/23 2:19 pm From: Corey Bice <profbice9...> Subject: Re: [MDBirding] Bird Names will be changing!
Whats wrong with woodcock to like why!
On Wed, Nov 1, 2023, 17:12 Corey Bice <profbice9...> wrote:
> Personally that offends my religion...
>
> On Wed, Nov 1, 2023, 17:09 Marcia Watson <marshwren50...> wrote:
>
>> Jack,
>>
>> I believe that that list of local bird names might have come from Harry
>> Armistead. I don’t have it but I’m sure Harry will read this.
>>
>> My favorite is Devil Diver for Bufflehead - a reference to how long and
>> deep they can dive.
>>
>> Marcia
>> ------------
>> Marcia Watson
>> Phoenix, MD
>>
>>
>> > On Nov 1, 2023, at 4:26 PM, Jack Saba <jlsaba001...> wrote:
>> >
>> > On 11/1/23 16:12, Sarah Lister wrote:
>> >
>> >> Deciding that there was no good way to choose which eponymous names to
>> change and which to let be, AOS chose to change all of them.
>> >
>> > Which is good. Much prefer names that include a clue that helps with
>> the ID.
>> >
>> > On a (very slightly) related topic, a while back someone (maybe Bob
>> Ringler?) posted a list (or possibly a link to a list) of alternative
>> common names -- like Yellowhammer for Yellow-shafted Woodpecker and
>> Timberdoodle for American Woodcock. If anyone have that list or link, would
>> you please forward it to me (or post it)?
>> >
>> > Jack Saba
>> >
>> > --
>> > Jack Saba
>> > Berwyn Heights
>> > <jlsaba001...>
>> >
>> > --
>> > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
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>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/mdbirding/<d7eb97b7-e9e3-4e5d-b018-076325fb31d8...> >> .
>>
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Date: 11/1/23 2:12 pm From: Corey Bice <profbice9...> Subject: Re: [MDBirding] Bird Names will be changing!
Personally that offends my religion...
On Wed, Nov 1, 2023, 17:09 Marcia Watson <marshwren50...> wrote:
> Jack,
>
> I believe that that list of local bird names might have come from Harry
> Armistead. I don’t have it but I’m sure Harry will read this.
>
> My favorite is Devil Diver for Bufflehead - a reference to how long and
> deep they can dive.
>
> Marcia
> ------------
> Marcia Watson
> Phoenix, MD
>
>
> > On Nov 1, 2023, at 4:26 PM, Jack Saba <jlsaba001...> wrote:
> >
> > On 11/1/23 16:12, Sarah Lister wrote:
> >
> >> Deciding that there was no good way to choose which eponymous names to
> change and which to let be, AOS chose to change all of them.
> >
> > Which is good. Much prefer names that include a clue that helps with the
> ID.
> >
> > On a (very slightly) related topic, a while back someone (maybe Bob
> Ringler?) posted a list (or possibly a link to a list) of alternative
> common names -- like Yellowhammer for Yellow-shafted Woodpecker and
> Timberdoodle for American Woodcock. If anyone have that list or link, would
> you please forward it to me (or post it)?
> >
> > Jack Saba
> >
> > --
> > Jack Saba
> > Berwyn Heights
> > <jlsaba001...>
> >
> > --
> > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
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>
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Date: 11/1/23 2:09 pm From: Marcia Watson <marshwren50...> Subject: Re: [MDBirding] Bird Names will be changing!
Jack,
I believe that that list of local bird names might have come from Harry Armistead. I don’t have it but I’m sure Harry will read this.
My favorite is Devil Diver for Bufflehead - a reference to how long and deep they can dive.
Marcia
------------
Marcia Watson
Phoenix, MD
> On Nov 1, 2023, at 4:26 PM, Jack Saba <jlsaba001...> wrote:
>
> On 11/1/23 16:12, Sarah Lister wrote:
>
>> Deciding that there was no good way to choose which eponymous names to change and which to let be, AOS chose to change all of them.
>
> Which is good. Much prefer names that include a clue that helps with the ID.
>
> On a (very slightly) related topic, a while back someone (maybe Bob Ringler?) posted a list (or possibly a link to a list) of alternative common names -- like Yellowhammer for Yellow-shafted Woodpecker and Timberdoodle for American Woodcock. If anyone have that list or link, would you please forward it to me (or post it)?
>
> Jack Saba
>
> --
> Jack Saba
> Berwyn Heights
> <jlsaba001...>
>
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Date: 11/1/23 1:26 pm From: Jack Saba <jlsaba001...> Subject: Re: [MDBirding] Bird Names will be changing!
On 11/1/23 16:12, Sarah Lister wrote:
> Deciding that there was no good way to choose which eponymous names to > change and which to let be, AOS chose to change all of them.
Which is good. Much prefer names that include a clue that helps with the ID.
On a (very slightly) related topic, a while back someone (maybe Bob Ringler?) posted a list (or possibly a link to a list) of alternative common names -- like Yellowhammer for Yellow-shafted Woodpecker and Timberdoodle for American Woodcock. If anyone have that list or link, would you please forward it to me (or post it)?
Jack Saba
-- Jack Saba Berwyn Heights <jlsaba001...>
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Date: 11/1/23 1:13 pm From: Sarah Lister <samjlister13...> Subject: Re: [MDBirding] Bird Names will be changing!
Deciding that there was no good way to choose which eponymous names to
change and which to let be, AOS chose to change all of them.
On Wed, Nov 1, 2023, 4:03 PM Cass <enbycass...> wrote:
> From the press release:
>
>
> https://americanornithology.org/american-ornithological-society-will-change-the-english-names-of-bird-species-named-after-people/ >
> AOS commits to changing all English-language names of birds within its
> geographic jurisdiction that are named directly after people (eponyms),
> along with other names deemed offensive and exclusionary, focusing first on
> those species that occur primarily within the U.S. or Canada.
>
> The AOS commits to establishing a new committee to oversee the assignment
> of all English common names for species within the AOS’s jurisdiction; this
> committee will broaden participation by including a diverse representation
> of individuals with expertise in the social sciences, communications,
> ornithology, and taxonomy.
>
> The AOS commits to actively involving the public in the process of
> selecting new English bird names.
>
> On Wed, Nov 1, 2023, 3:59 PM Alex Rose <alexrosela...> wrote:
>
>> I looked at the press release and some news articles which say that
>> initially 70-80 names will be changed including Anna's Hummingbird, Lewis'
>> Woodpecker and Townsend's Warbler.
>>
>> Does anyone know if there is a published list of what names are changing,
>> and what the new names will be?
>>
>> Kindly,
>> Alex
>> Washington DC
>>
>> On Wed, Nov 1, 2023 at 3:56 PM Cass <enbycass...> wrote:
>>
>>> Fantastic news!
>>>
>>> Bird names for birds.
>>>
>>> On Wed, Nov 1, 2023, 3:40 PM Joe Corcoran <corcoran2921...>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> I feel great about it. From birding around the world and trying to
>>>> learn about so many different species, it will be nice to have plumage or
>>>> other characteristics of a bird in it’s name, like Blue Jay, or
>>>> Golden-crowned Kinglet, or Large-billed Tern to help remember and ID the
>>>> birds.
>>>>
>>>> The bird names like LeConte’s Sparrow or Buckley’s Forest-Falcon
>>>> doesn’t help me with identification.
>>>>
>>>> There are also social justice reasons for changing the names, which is
>>>> fine with me, but the practical reason of helping in identification makes
>>>> this the best way to go to bring notice to one of a bird’s distinguishing
>>>> features, in my opinion.
>>>>
>>>> Joe Corcoran
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Wed, Nov 1, 2023 at 2:11 PM Corey Bice <profbice9...> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> How do you guys feel about this?
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Wed, Nov 1, 2023, 13:17 David Powell <seneca.ranger...>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Overdue changes to some bird names.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> https://www.washingtonpost.com/climate-environment/2023/11/01/bird-names-racism-audubon/ >>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Dave Powell
>>>>>>
>>>>> --
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>>>>>>
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>>>>>
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AOS commits to changing all English-language names of birds within its
geographic jurisdiction that are named directly after people (eponyms),
along with other names deemed offensive and exclusionary, focusing first on
those species that occur primarily within the U.S. or Canada.
The AOS commits to establishing a new committee to oversee the assignment
of all English common names for species within the AOS’s jurisdiction; this
committee will broaden participation by including a diverse representation
of individuals with expertise in the social sciences, communications,
ornithology, and taxonomy.
The AOS commits to actively involving the public in the process of
selecting new English bird names.
On Wed, Nov 1, 2023, 3:59 PM Alex Rose <alexrosela...> wrote:
> I looked at the press release and some news articles which say that
> initially 70-80 names will be changed including Anna's Hummingbird, Lewis'
> Woodpecker and Townsend's Warbler.
>
> Does anyone know if there is a published list of what names are changing,
> and what the new names will be?
>
> Kindly,
> Alex
> Washington DC
>
> On Wed, Nov 1, 2023 at 3:56 PM Cass <enbycass...> wrote:
>
>> Fantastic news!
>>
>> Bird names for birds.
>>
>> On Wed, Nov 1, 2023, 3:40 PM Joe Corcoran <corcoran2921...> wrote:
>>
>>> I feel great about it. From birding around the world and trying to learn
>>> about so many different species, it will be nice to have plumage or other
>>> characteristics of a bird in it’s name, like Blue Jay, or Golden-crowned
>>> Kinglet, or Large-billed Tern to help remember and ID the birds.
>>>
>>> The bird names like LeConte’s Sparrow or Buckley’s Forest-Falcon doesn’t
>>> help me with identification.
>>>
>>> There are also social justice reasons for changing the names, which is
>>> fine with me, but the practical reason of helping in identification makes
>>> this the best way to go to bring notice to one of a bird’s distinguishing
>>> features, in my opinion.
>>>
>>> Joe Corcoran
>>>
>>>
>>> On Wed, Nov 1, 2023 at 2:11 PM Corey Bice <profbice9...> wrote:
>>>
>>>> How do you guys feel about this?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Wed, Nov 1, 2023, 13:17 David Powell <seneca.ranger...>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Overdue changes to some bird names.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> https://www.washingtonpost.com/climate-environment/2023/11/01/bird-names-racism-audubon/ >>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Dave Powell
>>>>>
>>>> --
>>>>> -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
>>>>> Group 'Maryland & DC Birding'.
>>>>> To view group guidelines or change email preferences, visit this group
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>>>>> To view this discussion on the web visit
>>>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/mdbirding/<CAE9URsDbvqYX59wsnRsApQspXUyy61iV17uJuB2Pqi1DhRxgZg...> >>>>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/mdbirding/<CAE9URsDbvqYX59wsnRsApQspXUyy61iV17uJuB2Pqi1DhRxgZg...>?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >>>>> .
>>>>>
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>>>>
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Date: 11/1/23 12:59 pm From: Alex Rose <alexrosela...> Subject: Re: [MDBirding] Bird Names will be changing!
I looked at the press release and some news articles which say that
initially 70-80 names will be changed including Anna's Hummingbird, Lewis'
Woodpecker and Townsend's Warbler.
Does anyone know if there is a published list of what names are changing,
and what the new names will be?
Kindly,
Alex
Washington DC
On Wed, Nov 1, 2023 at 3:56 PM Cass <enbycass...> wrote:
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Date: 11/1/23 12:40 pm From: Joe Corcoran <corcoran2921...> Subject: Re: [MDBirding] Bird Names will be changing!
I feel great about it. From birding around the world and trying to learn
about so many different species, it will be nice to have plumage or other
characteristics of a bird in it’s name, like Blue Jay, or Golden-crowned
Kinglet, or Large-billed Tern to help remember and ID the birds.
The bird names like LeConte’s Sparrow or Buckley’s Forest-Falcon doesn’t
help me with identification.
There are also social justice reasons for changing the names, which is fine
with me, but the practical reason of helping in identification makes this
the best way to go to bring notice to one of a bird’s distinguishing
features, in my opinion.
Joe Corcoran
On Wed, Nov 1, 2023 at 2:11 PM Corey Bice <profbice9...> wrote:
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Also mixed woodlands with some forest edge.
I would also like to note that it wasn't that I was trying to hide
information.
On Wed, Nov 1, 2023, 13:50 Corey Bice <profbice9...> wrote:
> Overleaf drive arnold md 21012,
>
>
> On Wed, Nov 1, 2023, 13:40 Rick Borchelt <rborchelt...> wrote:
>
>> I think Corey the question was aimed at "where in MD precisely" did you
>> see the bird, since we don't know where your front yard is or what kind of
>> habitat it represents. I agree whole-heartedly about the importance of
>> sharing sightings info (on eBird is terrific, and good detailed notes like
>> yours are good too) but they need to be as accurate/detailed as we can make
>> them.
>>
>> On Wed, Nov 1, 2023 at 1:27 PM Corey Bice <profbice9...> wrote:
>>
>>> To answer a few questions,
>>> 1 for me it's not likely that I miss identified it for a "Phoebe".
>>> 2 the location was in my front yard cherry tree, after this it flew to a
>>> large tree in mixed woodlands, after this I lost track of it.
>>> 3 I have no photos,videos or audio recordings.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
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>> --
>> Rick Borchelt
>> College Park, MD
>> preferred personal email: rborchelt |AT| gmail |DOT| com
>>
>> http://leplog.wordpress.com >>
>
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On Wed, Nov 1, 2023, 13:40 Rick Borchelt <rborchelt...> wrote:
> I think Corey the question was aimed at "where in MD precisely" did you
> see the bird, since we don't know where your front yard is or what kind of
> habitat it represents. I agree whole-heartedly about the importance of
> sharing sightings info (on eBird is terrific, and good detailed notes like
> yours are good too) but they need to be as accurate/detailed as we can make
> them.
>
> On Wed, Nov 1, 2023 at 1:27 PM Corey Bice <profbice9...> wrote:
>
>> To answer a few questions,
>> 1 for me it's not likely that I miss identified it for a "Phoebe".
>> 2 the location was in my front yard cherry tree, after this it flew to a
>> large tree in mixed woodlands, after this I lost track of it.
>> 3 I have no photos,videos or audio recordings.
>>
>>
>>
>>
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>>
>
>
> --
> Rick Borchelt
> College Park, MD
> preferred personal email: rborchelt |AT| gmail |DOT| com
>
> http://leplog.wordpress.com >
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Date: 11/1/23 10:40 am From: Rick Borchelt <rborchelt...> Subject: Re: [MDBirding] Ash Throated fly catcher.
I think Corey the question was aimed at "where in MD precisely" did you see
the bird, since we don't know where your front yard is or what kind of
habitat it represents. I agree whole-heartedly about the importance of
sharing sightings info (on eBird is terrific, and good detailed notes like
yours are good too) but they need to be as accurate/detailed as we can make
them.
On Wed, Nov 1, 2023 at 1:27 PM Corey Bice <profbice9...> wrote:
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To answer a few questions, 1 for me it's not likely that I miss identified it for a "Phoebe". 2 the location was in my front yard cherry tree, after this it flew to a large tree in mixed woodlands, after this I lost track of it. 3 I have no photos,videos or audio recordings.
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Yesterday at 1:21 pm EST I noted a interesting bird, what I later found out to be a potential sighting of the wonderful Ash-Throated flycatcher, I honestly have no idea what to do now, i've been birding for 4 years now since i was 10 and have only seen one thing come close to this rare. As a responsible part of the birding community we need to bring sightings and information to each other, so here is what I saw.
(NOTE I WILL COMPARE IT TO THE GREAT CRESTED FLYCATCHER) it had a pale yellow lower belly, it had a gray-white face gray wings, its underside of the tail was a faint yellow, however its call was unmistakable merlin describes it as a ha-wheer call or the ka-brick call which is exactly what i heard, the wings had white bars on them. Here is why I'm 89% sure it was not a great crested, the great crested has a yellow belly and a deep gray throat. if it was not an ash throated i would like to know what you guys think it is?
Thank you, Corey Bice <Profbice9...>
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Date: 10/31/23 3:56 pm From: JAMES SPEICHER <jugornought...> Subject: [MDBirding] LEOW or GHOW - egg on my face
I made a major goof. I imported my phone recording to my Merlin app
without specifying a location. When I do that using Jefferson MD, LEOW
totally disappears as an option. It's also not an option when I use
counties in NY or ME. In fact, I have to choose Ontario, Ontario Canada
before LEOW appears as an option and even then it's secondary to GHOW.
BirdNET doesn't allow location specification to my knowledge. Why it
preferred LEOW over GHOW is unknown.
Noah had it right, I believe. The examples for Female calls given on
Merlin come pretty close to my recording.
> On Mon, Oct 30, 2023 at 4:12 PM Noah Comet <noahcomet...> wrote:
>>
> Hi Jim, et al,
>>
>> I've taken the liberty of excerpting and amplifying the call you
>> heard---a very brief clip is available here
>> <https://drive.google.com/file/d/1X3Cl1fL-JnYCcG8ONF8zH4tPCAyayy-5/view?usp=sharing> >> .
>>
>> Based on that, I feel pretty confident calling this a Great Horned
>> Owl---see the GHO sound labeled "Female Calls" on Cornell's site here
>> <https://www.allaboutbirds.org/guide/Great_Horned_Owl/sounds>. A bit
>> closer to your recording, I'd say, than the sound of a LEO. And given that
>> you know this spot is a regular hangout for GHOs, that feels pretty likely.
>> (GHOs are known predators of LEOs---I imagine the latter would avoid areas
>> frequented by the former, and probably wouldn't advertise their presence in
>> such areas, at any rate.)
>>
>> My (admittedly less than extensive but not insignificant) experience with
>> migrating/wintering LEOs is that they don't vocalize much at all, whereas
>> our resident GHOs never stop :) and make a variety of sounds.
>>
>> For what it's worth,
>> Noah
>>
>> P.S. I'll take this owly occasion to tout Jennifer Ackerman's wonderful
>> book, *What an Owl Knows*. A highly recommended read!
>>
>
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Kevin Graff Jarrettsville, MD <Keyweststyle2001...>
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Based on that, I feel pretty confident calling this a Great Horned
Owl---see the GHO sound labeled "Female Calls" on Cornell's site here
<https://www.allaboutbirds.org/guide/Great_Horned_Owl/sounds>. A bit closer
to your recording, I'd say, than the sound of a LEO. And given that you
know this spot is a regular hangout for GHOs, that feels pretty likely.
(GHOs are known predators of LEOs---I imagine the latter would avoid areas
frequented by the former, and probably wouldn't advertise their presence in
such areas, at any rate.)
My (admittedly less than extensive but not insignificant) experience with
migrating/wintering LEOs is that they don't vocalize much at all, whereas
our resident GHOs never stop :) and make a variety of sounds.
For what it's worth,
Noah
P.S. I'll take this owly occasion to tout Jennifer Ackerman's wonderful
book, *What an Owl Knows*. A highly recommended read!
On Mon, Oct 30, 2023 at 1:52 PM JAMES SPEICHER <jugornought...>
wrote:
> More on the nature of LEOW vocalization...
>
> eBird: Typical vocalization is a single low “woop” repeated every few
> seconds.
>
> The Golden/Robbins field guide gives no single description of the call,
> but goes on to say that the bird is usually silent except near its nest.
>
> Peterson characterizes the voice as a low moaning hooooo. Also a catlike
> whine.
>
> Sibley: Male gives a low soft hoot [wooip] about once every three seconds.
> Female call higher and softer.
>
> J
>
>
> ---------- Forwarded message ---------
> From: JAMES SPEICHER <jugornought...>
> Date: Mon, Oct 30, 2023, 1:48 AM
> Subject: LEOW or GHOW
> To: mdbirding <mdbirding...>
>
>
> I heard this from my driveway and motored down to the creek bottom to get
> a listen/recording. I probably listened for a combined ~20 minutes and the
> call never varied.
>
> https://ebird.org/checklist/S153378220 >
> As mentioned this is a common hangout for GHOWs, but this call was not
> heard before tonight and it's always possible that a strange bird is
> passing though and overnighted in pretty good owl habitat.
>
> BirdNet overall analysis:
> [image: image.png]
>
> Jim Speicher
>
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