Date: 2/22/21 6:31 am
From: Jeff Gilligan <jeffgilligan10...>
Subject: [obol] Re: name change question Gray Jay
Hi Wayne

It was partially tongue in cheek. For example, I don’t advocate war withour Canadian friend over our rightful claim to sovereignty to the 54.40 paralell.

We don’t disagree that thegreat majority of Gray Jays occur north of the international border though, but as a matter of range, it is a bit strange to call one a Canada Jay that has spent its life and probably that of thousands of its ancestors in the White Mountains in Arizona.

How about removing “California” from the name of the gull, and maybe the condor too??

(I refrained in calling the jay ”Oregon Jay” in reference to the Arizona birds so I didn’t get called out on that… :-0


Jeff





> On Feb 21, 2021, at 9:08 PM, Wayne Weber <contopus...> wrote:
>
> Oregon Birders,
>
> I am assuming that Jeff’s message (attached) is somewhat tongue-in-cheek. Regardless, I must differ strongly with Jeff’s opinion. The vast majority of the species’ range (more than 80%, I would say) is in Canada. The scientific name is Perisoreus canadensis, so the English name now matches the scientific name.
>
> We who live in Canada get a little bit tired of American economic and nomenclatural imperialism. We have many animal and plant species which are named “americanus”, even though much or most of their breeding range is in Canada. The original name change from Canada Jay to Gray Jay was made by the chauvinistic AMERICAN Ornithologists’ Union, who seemingly ignored the opinions of their many Canadian members (I am one of them!) I’m glad to see that the AOU has finally seen fit to reverse their earlier, erroneous decision.
>
> So take that, Yankee!
>
> As for the Oregon Jay, it was once considered a separate species, Perisoreus obscurus. It has significant behavioural differences from other Canada Jays, and may well be split from the Canada Jay again in future. (After all, look what the AOU has done to Scrub-Jays!) In that case, Jeff, I would be pleased to agree with you and call it the Oregon Jay!
>
> Wayne Weber
> Delta, BC, CANADA
> <contopus...> <mailto:<contopus...>
> Staunchly Canadian and proud of it!
>
>
> From: Jeff Gilligan [mailto:<jeffgilligan10...>]
> Sent: Sunday, February 21, 2021 7:11 PM
> To: <contopus...>
> Cc: OBOL2
> Subject: Re: [obol] Re: name change question Gray Jay
>
> Canada Jay is a terrible renaming of Gray Jay. The species occurs as a permeant resident to central Arizona - not very far from Mexico, and it is after all - gray. I suspect that the name Canada Jay has an eastern bias, since there the range is very greatly Canadian.
>
> That the Canadian government objected to the use of “Gray”, rather than the English Royal spelling “Grey”, is also offensive, since my Scottish sept supported the Stewarts, rather than the current Hanoverian pretenders.
>
> BTW: 54:40 or fight. Wayne Weber - any comment on that… :-) ?
>
> I will revert to “Oregon Jay”.
>
> Jeff Gilligan
>
>
>
>
>> On Feb 21, 2021, at 5:30 PM, Wayne Weber <contopus...> <mailto:<contopus...>> wrote:
>>
>> Oregon Birders,
>>
>> In response to Darrel’s question, no, there was no taxonomic split involved. The renaming of Gray Jay to Canada Jay was the long-delayed reversal of a name change 60 years ago-- a name change which, most ornithologists agree, should never have happened in the first place.
>>
>> If anyone is interested, you can read the reasons for the name change, as they were proposed to the NACC (North American Checklist Committee) in 2018. The name change proposal is an 8-page document (with references) submitted by a team of several ornithologists led by Dan Strickland, who has done extensive research on Canada Jays, and is co-author of the detailed species account in the BIRDS OF NORTH AMERICA series. The name change proposal goes into considerable detail and, at least to me, makes fascinating reading. The proposal was accepted by the NACC with only a single dissenting vote.
>>
>> For the original proposal, have a look at pages 5-12 in the following document:
>>
>> https://americanornithology.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/02/2018-B.pdf <https://americanornithology.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/02/2018-B.pdf>
>>
>> Wayne Weber
>> Delta, BC, Canada
>> <contopus...> <mailto:<contopus...>
>>
>>
>>
>> From: <obol-bounce...> <mailto:<obol-bounce...> [mailto:<obol-bounce...> <mailto:<obol-bounce...>] On Behalf Of Darrel Faxon
>> Sent: Sunday, February 21, 2021 8:04 AM
>> To: obol
>> Subject: [obol] name change question
>>
>> Was the recent name change from Gray Jay to Canada Jay related to a split, or was it just a nomenclature issue?
>> Darrel


 
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