Date: 11/2/26 11:36 am From: Paul Roisen via NEBirds <roisenp1950...> Subject: Re: [NEBirds] AOS updates feat. UNK Ornithology
Good to know that I am not the only one who posts something only to find
out I made an error in ID or statment.
God Bless.
*Paul O. Roisen*
*Sioux City, IA 51106 **Woodbury County, IA*
*Mobile 712-301-2817 **<roisenp1950...> <roisenp1950...>*
On Mon, Nov 2, 2026 at 1:13 PM flyingcarlini via NEBirds <flyingcarlini=
<yahoo.com...> wrote:
> Need to disagree with myself - scratch that statement about tail barring
> being consistent because Eastern example below from All About Birds shows
> an ample amount of visible barring even on the darker reddish tail:
> [image: Inline image]
> Also scratch my earlier statement about nape and crown being browner on
> Westerns vs blacker on Easterns because a quick browse of Macaulay pics
> show widely varying degrees of black and brown on crown and nape of both
> species. Back to square one!
> -Shari & John
> On Monday, November 2, 2026 at 12:20:19 PM CST, flyingcarlini via NEBirds
> <flyingcarlini...> wrote:
>
>
> Thanks to all for the feedback! We agree it's best to leave this silent
> marsh-wrem as Western/Eastern. It might be worth reiterating how much
> variability between individuals there is. While many pics of WEMWs do
> indeed have a more grayish tone on the underparts, there appears to be
> plenty of exceptions to Princeton's description of Western having a
> "dingier breast" because numerous Neb. pics of Westerns show a fairly white
> breast and also what maybe could be interpreted as streaky cheeks. Also,
> pasted below is an example of rich chestnut coloration in a WEMW's plumage
> in Bristish Columbia on the All About Birds site that's arguably the same
> reddish tint as the marsh-wren in our pic and some Easterns :
> [image: Inline image]
> Perhaps the most consistent WEMW field mark we've seen so far is the
> amount of tail barring that Jacob and Tobin mentioned.
> -Shari & John, Lincoln
>
> On Monday, November 2, 2026 at 09:12:13 AM CST, Jacob C. Cooper via
> NEBirds <cooperj2...> wrote:
>
>
> I would concur with Tobin; the dark black on the flanks of the crown, the
> deep russet and chestnut tones to the flanks and tail, and the overall
> bright, colorful, and crisp appearance would all make me lean Eastern. That
> being said, I know the characters for separating these are still being
> actively discussed, so I could see a good argument for leaving this as
> “marsh-wren sp.” as well.
>
> JC
>
> ------------------------------------------
> *Jacob C. Cooper, PhD (he/him)*
> *Lab Website* <https://unkornithology.github.io/> | *Book a meeting*
> <https://outlook.office.com/bookwithme/user/<54b539030932433597927a9d0bc134c6...>/meetingtype/DipxYAhygk6c6tyh8N9U9g2?anonymous&ismsaljsauthenabled&ep=mLinkFromTile> >
> *Assistant Professor, University of Nebraska at Kearney*
> Bruner Hall of Sciences, Room 321
> 2401 11th Avenue
> Kearney, NE 68849-1130
>
> *Research Associate, Field Museum, Chicago*
> *Citizen of the Cherokee Nation*
>
> *From: *Tobin Brown via NEBirds <tobinjbrown...>
> *Date: *Monday, November 2, 2026 at 08:09
> *To: *<NEBirds...> <NEBirds...>
> *Subject: *Re: [NEBirds] AOS updates feat. UNK Ornithology
>
> *Caution:* Non-NU Email
>
> I've been looking at a lot of photos this past week, and I would still
> lean Eastern on this one. Birds of the World says:
>
> "Eastern Marsh Wren is generally darker and more chestnut-colored than
> Western Marsh Wren, with a darker crown, *less conspicuous tail barring*,
> more *reddish-brown on the flanks* and underparts, and darker
> reddish-brown legs."
>
> In your bird I am definitely seeing the deep reddish-brown on the flanks
> that doesn't often seem to be present in Western (which is more dusty
> brown), and the barring on the tail is quite faint (only showing on the
> outer edges). I think it would take a lighter drabber bird with more tail
> barring
> <https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://macaulaylibrary.org/asset/495353651__;!!PvXuogZ4sRB2p-tU!Bn0WJiWR2Clw3kIEZq8ygaqVzJH4jUdm6NnR8VndjC_GyS1AT-EuDVOU-wohrj2n3rSLJx7O-Nc625pQ1kfWJ8yC6zKpcA$> > to consider Western in the Southeast part of the state.
>
> Definitely a new "fun" ID challenge!
>
> ----
> *Tobin Brown*
> Lincoln, NE
> Field Reports Editor, *The Nebraska Bird Review*
> eBird Reviewer, Nebraska
>
> On Sat, Oct 31, 2026 at 12:45 PM flyingcarlini via NEBirds <flyingcarlini=
> <yahoo.com...> wrote:
>
> Thank you Peggy and Jacob for the lifer! And thank you Thane for posting
> this important info! We had a migrant marsh-wren here in Lancaster Co a
> couple days ago that we had assumed was Eastern but after uploading the few
> pics obtained, started leaning Western instead based on Sibley's examples
> and also All About Birds' photos of both species which varied A LOT between
> more and less reddish individuals. Any opinions on our bird and/or advice
> on how to safely differentiate Eastern and Western would be greatly
> appreciated! Photo examples seemed consistent on these points (to our
> amateur eyes so may or may not be accurate):
>
> • solid brown crown and solid brown strip across nape in Western/black
> peppered into crown and center of nape in Eastern
> • richer reddish scapulars contrasting with lighter colored secondaries on
> Western folded wing/equally reddish color on scapulars extending into
> secondaries on Eastern folded wing
>
> Are we headed down the right path? Can we hang our hat on any of these
> points, or are we doomed to report Western/Eastern for non-singing birds?
> Below is the link to our checklist and attached photo:
> https://ebird.org/checklist/S406656056 > <https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://ebird.org/checklist/S406656056__;!!PvXuogZ4sRB2p-tU!Bn0WJiWR2Clw3kIEZq8ygaqVzJH4jUdm6NnR8VndjC_GyS1AT-EuDVOU-wohrj2n3rSLJx7O-Nc625pQ1kfWJ8wy3VyH_g$> >
> -Shari Schwartz & John Carlini, Lincoln
>
>
>
>
