Date: 7/12/25 9:47 am From: Ethan Monk via groups.io <z.querula...> Subject: Re: [EBB-Sightings] Is this an Allen's at Blake Garden?
Hi,
Immature male feels safely supported by the iridescent gorget feathers
coming in at the very side of the gorget (bottom of auricular-ish), and the
more inner rectrices often have more green showing in females. So for
example on the R2 (second rectrix from center) you will often have green
sandwiched between the rufous and black on the females. The green will
often be more extensive on the R1 in females, etc.
When it comes to the finer points of the ID, which is importantly done
based on age/sex, I think Zac's explanation did a good job.
I will say, the width of the outermost rectrix-- R5 --has burned me before.
The apparent width of that tail feather can change a lot based on the angle
of the photo, and I just stay away in cases where it feels even vaguely
ambiguous. But I know people better than me disagree.
As this conversation handily illustrates, non-adult male Rufous and Allen's
Hummingbirds are generally not identifiable under standard field
conditions, which is why Allen's Hummingbird flags as "rare" in eBird for
Contra Costa County in late June. Most adult male Allen's depart earlier in
the month, so it will get really hard to find a "safe" Allen's by the end
of June. Obviously, Allen's are still around, so if you go around
photographing tail feathers you will find plenty of Allen's (females and
immatures) right after they flag in eBird, but it's worth noting Rufous
Hummingbirds start to show up at end of June, too. By second week of July,
Rufous Hummingbirds are very present in the interior parts of the East Bay.
And presumably the more coastal parts too, but harder to say for obvious
reasons!
Ethan
On Fri, Jul 11, 2025 at 6:59 PM Bob Lewis via groups.io <RLewis0727=
<aol.com...> wrote:
> Wow, I just sent Claude a note saying it was a female. Reasoning being
> the tips of R3-R5 are bright white, and immature male is more tan-tipped.
> I do think the R5 is quite narrow, supporting Allen's. If indeed it's a
> male, then I think Zac's comments regarding the absence of a notch (or
> nipple-like tip) is convincing, and it's an Allen's. But obviously I have
> no real clue!!
> Bob
>
> On Friday, July 11, 2025 at 06:48:58 PM PDT, Zac Denning via groups.io
> <zdenning1...> wrote:
>
>
> Hey Claude,
>
> This is a juvenile male, so the ID is a bit more subtle than for adult
> males. Unfortunately, by this time of year, my understanding is that the
> adult males have mostly left the scene, so the tougher birds are what were
> left with ...
>
> Others are more expert, but for what it’s worth, here’s my take:
> The R2 feather (next to innermost tail feather in your 3rd shot) appears
> to be missing the slight notch that juvenile male Rufous would usually
> show. If you happen to also have a shot of the outermost tail feather
> that’s separated enough from the others to see the feather width, that
> might help clarify further.
>
> In terms of whether the 3rd photo (with spread tail) meets the reviewers’
> threshold for listing as Allen’s, I’m not sure. The default right now would
> be listing all these birds as a slash (Allen’s/Rufous Hummingbird).
>
> If you don’t get definitive feedback from a reviewer/expert on this email
> thread, and if you have the reviewer’s contact, you could list as a slash
> on eBird, reach out to them, then wait for confirmation before proceeding
> with a more definitive ID. Otherwise, you could try listing as Allen’s,
> and say in the eBird description that you’re seeking reviewer feedback. If
> your reviewer responds (whatever the outcome), please be sure to thank them
> for their unpaid work to keep eBird data accurate! It’s not an easy job.
>
> Maybe someone has another suggestion, but that’s usually how I’d usually
> handle this type of situation.
>
> I hope that helps.
>
> Zac Denning
> Albany
>
>
> On Fri, Jul 11, 2025 at 5:44 PM Claude Lyneis via groups.io <cmlyneis=
> <gmail.com...> wrote:
>
> After seeing several eBird reports of Allen’s Hummingbirds in U.C. Blake
> Garden I thought I would try again to get some definitive photos that would
> pass expert judgement and not have to be labeled Allen’s/Rufous. A couple
> of these photo show good detail of the tail feathers, but is that enough?
> There were several of these Hummers buzzing around and at least one
> Anna’s. Blake Garden seemed a rather magical place hidden away in
> Kensington.
>
> Here is an album with four photos of the bird.
>
> [image: 54648983475_d4aa3e69a4_c.jpg]
>
> Allen's Hummingbird <https://flic.kr/s/aHBqjCm8Gz> > flic.kr <https://flic.kr/s/aHBqjCm8Gz> > <https://flic.kr/s/aHBqjCm8Gz> >
> Claude Lyneis
> <cmlyneis...>
> https://www.youtube.com/bhsvideodad > Flickr Photos at https://flic.kr/ps/36it5P >
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