Date: 5/10/25 9:33 pm From: Jay Carlisle via groups.io <carlislejay...> Subject: Re: [IBLE] Golden Plover ID (reviving thread from last week)
Very late to the party but I'll just quickly say that most of the reason we went out to Blacks Creek too look for the potential Pacific Golden - present 9-10 days ago - is because people like Cliff (IBLE) & Carter (on Facebook, has been seeing lots of Pacific in Hawaii) helped suggest this bird could be a Pacific in the first place! Thus, I was already pretty convinced it was Pacific, and some of the photos from earlier in the day on May 1 show the fieldmarks really well (i.e., ebird.org/checklist/S231624819 & ebird.org/checklist/S231731944 but others too), so hearing the call was the icing on the cake for me.
Fun to see pics of 2Â American Golden-plovers from eastern Idaho today https://ebird.org/checklist/S236005390Â - notice how much more elongated (longer wings)Â they look than the Pacific.
Thanks Cliff for sharing the detail behind this challenging ID!
Jay
On Saturday, May 3, 2025 at 07:04:44 PM MDT, Louisa Evers via groups.io <elouisa603...> wrote:
Jay Carlisle confirmed the bird as a Pacific based on the call.
Louisa Evers
<elouisa603...> care of the birds and you take care of the world
On Sat, May 3, 2025 at 13:06 Cliff Weisse via groups.io <cliffandlisa...> wrote:
I've looked at more than 20 eBird checklists for the Pacific Golden Plover at Black's Creek. I don't see much mention of the relative length of Primaries/Tertails/Tail that is the only reliable way to separate American and Pacific without calls. It works in any plumage with the only caveat being that it may not work for molting birds.Â
Breeding plumage Americans with no white on the flanks are straight forward but during molt they can look like much like Pacifics, and juveniles are very similar. The long bill and long legs can be helpful but a good look at the Primary/Tertial/Tail relationship can make it easy. Here are the important points taken from this article "Morphometric features of Pacific and American Golden-Plovers with comments on field identification"(https://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/document?repid=rep1&type=pdf&doi=9bc92b3f984f118928e8f292158d19a586cc53ea): - Pacific has 2-3 primaries visible beyond tertials, American has 4-5
- tertials extend to distal third of tail, ending at or near tail tip in most Pacific, from half to distal third of tail on American
- wing tip extends past end of tail more on American than Pacific, with little or no overlap
- tips of outer two primaries are closer together on Pacific, with some overlap.
With a good look at the rear end of the bird these differences create a different overall look, even if you can't see the details clearly. Kent's original photo that was posted to IBLE is a good example - it hints at Pacific with tertials appearing to extend nearly to end of tail and very short primary tips visible. You can't quite see the details but there is enough to suggest the need for a closer look. After reviewing the above linked article I did a Google search for photos and these features are clearly visible in countless examples of both species. If you want to get a better handle on Golden Plovers I'd recommend reading the article and spending some time looking at photos.
Cliff
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Cliff and Lisa Weisse
Island Park, Idaho
<cliffandlisa...>
