Date: 2/14/25 1:52 pm From: Harry LeGrand (via carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> Subject: Re: Conservation Access Pass Proposed by NCWRC
Folks,
I hope all of you in North Carolina have now had a chance to read the NC
Wildlife Resources Commission's webpage on the proposed Conservation Access
Pass (CAP), and especially the questions and answers:
This seems to be a *user fee, *for doing something most of us have been
doing for free; and with paying for a pass, we birders seemingly get
nothing in return. Note the use of "require" and "will need" in the Q and
A section. I wonder if this push for a pass came from hunters, fishermen,
and boaters, who have to pay to use the game lands, whereas currently
hikers, birders, photographers, etc., don't. (Note that hunting and
fishing are consumptive activities, whereby animals are taken from the
wild; and boating typically requires the building and usage of boat ramps.
Birding, photography, hiking, etc., are considered as non-consumptive
activities.) The proposal might have come from within the Wildlife
Commission staff; I don't know whose idea it was. Note the lack of
anything about use of the CAP monies going for conservation uses. That
might be a decision later. But also note:
*Will NCWRC offer new amenities or infrastructure as a result of the access
pass?*
NCWRC offers minimally developed wild spaces for the enjoyment of wildlife
and natural habitat.
--
that WRC is not planning any new amenities or infrastructure, such as
bathrooms or observation decks -- at least not now.
It is important to note that the public is not charged to visit NC State
Parks (other than for swimming or camping), many or most national park
units such as Great Smoky Mountains National Park, and national wildlife
refuges such as Pea Island and Mattamuskeet. (Other states often do have
fees or passes to visit such public lands, however.) And, please note
that many to most of these parks and refuges do have restrooms and also
some have visitor centers. Hardly any NC Game Land has facilities, other
than boat ramps. There would be a bit of double-standard if WRC
establishes a user fee on its lands whereas other public land agencies,
with visitor facilities, have yet to do so.
And, as I mentioned yesterday, the questions and answers do not clarify a
few items, such as whether there will be fines for people on game lands not
carrying a pass. How would the staff patrol large game lands for
passholders where there are often many public roads passing through them,
or adjacent to them? The webpage says that people will be required to have
a pass (or already existing license) to access the game lands, other than
saying that "Individuals aged 16 and under would not be required to have
their own access pass, but must be with an adult who has an access pass or
valid license." Of course, there is no suggestion of the cost of a yearly
CAP, as yet.
So, I don't see this as being anything close to a win-win, especially as
there is nothing on that page saying that such CAP funds would be used for
conservation purposes (such as building observation decks, parking lots, or
bathrooms) or to benefit the Nongame Wildlife Program.
Those of you attending any of the meetings should come prepared to ask many
questions. I will look for an outlet to express these comments, as being in
Raleigh I don't plan to travel to Greensboro or Greenville to ask questions
in person. * I am not opposed to paying for such a pas*s, and would do so
if not a great cost, though a lot of questions and answers will need to be
addressed; I don't want to be fined for simply walking around on a
publicly-owned game land without a pass. (I will add that I have been
paying about $20 extra yearly for my vanity license plate, for about 30
years; these funds go to the Clean Water/Natural Heritage Trust Fund, some
of which goes to WRC to acquire game lands.)
Harry LeGrand
Raleigh
On Thu, Feb 13, 2025 at 7:22 PM Nate Dias <carolinabirds...> wrote:
> Kay,
>
> In addition to Federal Duck Stamps, there are also State Duck Stamps. To
> hunt ducks in South Carolina, one must purchase both. I presume NC is the
> same.
>
> Respectfully, there is a problem with Mae's suggestion of using the
> existing "duck stamp framework" to require duck stamps to enter state
> wildlife management areas / state game lands, etc. The problem is that
> the powers that be would have no way to distinguish between hunters and
> non-consumptive users. It would all look like hunters to them.
>
> Having a separate "Conservation Pass" would show that specific numbers of
> birders, hikers, wildlife photographers, etc. are pulling their own weight
> financially. By demonstrating that numbers of us non-hunters pay to
> maintain (and purchase) these conservation areas, it would give us a seat
> at the table and hopefully get more consideration in decisions on habitat
> management, access, focus of resources and staff time on non-game species,
> etc.
>
> Nathan Dias - Charleston, SC
>
> --
> https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://www.flickr.com/photos/offshorebirder2/__;!!OToaGQ!pHaqrS5OonhEOPTj4cSvybrRcMu-Gyjj1y8g8rJZ_qB2fMDVl21zJy8yQk-FMevXupiX3-iMLupFfkNJnvXFNVw$ > <https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://www.flickr.com/photos/offshorebirder2/__;!!OToaGQ!qUPOdfv2Fttr86Ks-VbPESbl0qHeH5tgga06qbTkNKcYBs_b9Wyc08F96tpKT0sQJzq-qRyGFf3v0PUaGbcS87OfYzzn$> >
> "These days I prefer to hunt with a camera. A good photograph demands
> more skill from the hunter, better nerves and more patience than the rifle
> shot." -- Bror Blixen
>
>
> On Thu, Feb 13, 2025 at 4:35 PM <k.grinnell...> <k.grinnell...>
> wrote:
>
>> I think Duck Stamps go to federal funding thru U.S. Fish & Wildlife.
>> This concept being discussed is about creating a means to contribute to
>> state DNR coffers, I believe.
>>
>> Kay
>> Hilton Head
>>
>> Kay Grinnell
>> <k.grinnell...>
>> 843 597-3633 cell
>>
>>
>> On Thursday, February 13, 2025 at 04:31:17 PM EST, M Howell <
>> <hareboro...> wrote:
>>
>>
>> I have been to states that require fees or a Duck Stamp for entry into
>> wildlife refuges and similar areas. Wouldn't this, an established and
>> known program, work for NC and SC?
>>
>> Mae Howell
>> Goldsboro NC
>>
>> Get Outlook for Android
>> <https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://aka.ms/AAb9ysg__;!!OToaGQ!qUPOdfv2Fttr86Ks-VbPESbl0qHeH5tgga06qbTkNKcYBs_b9Wyc08F96tpKT0sQJzq-qRyGFf3v0PUaGbcS8_UKm2F0$> >> ------------------------------
>> *From:* <carolinabirds-request...> <carolinabirds-request...>
>> on behalf of "<k.grinnell...>" <carolinabirds...>
>> *Sent:* Thursday, February 13, 2025 2:46:47 PM
>> *To:* J. Merrill Lynch <jmerrilllynch...>; Nate Dias <
>> <offshorebirder...>
>> *Cc:* Ann Robertson <annbluebird2730...>; CarolinaBirds <
>> <carolinabirds...>
>> *Subject:* Re: Conservation Access Pass Proposed by NCWRC
>>
>> I agree Nate! I'm sure Dr. Tom Mullikin, SC's new Exec Director of DNR
>> has his hands full. I wonder if he heard from all the bird clubs and
>> Audubons around the state of SC if he might consider putting this kind of
>> action on his agenda.
>>
>> As President of Hilton Head Audubon, I'm ready to stir up some energy for
>> this!
>>
>> Kay
>> Hilton Head
>>
>> Kay Grinnell
>> <k.grinnell...>
>> 843 597-3633 cell
>>
>>
>> On Thursday, February 13, 2025 at 01:47:10 PM EST, Nate Dias" (via
>> carolinabirds Mailing List) <carolinabirds...> wrote:
>>
>>
>> I wish SC DNR would do the same thing.
>>
>> Nathan Dias - Charleston, SC
>>
>> --
>> https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://www.flickr.com/photos/offshorebirder2/__;!!OToaGQ!pHaqrS5OonhEOPTj4cSvybrRcMu-Gyjj1y8g8rJZ_qB2fMDVl21zJy8yQk-FMevXupiX3-iMLupFfkNJnvXFNVw$ >> <https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://www.flickr.com/photos/offshorebirder2/__;!!OToaGQ!qRAhn5Mbo9jXSRGNxUFo7pPOVDK9hIs_bTB0KIL6GOzNURN6HcZQSjz7kPB1TzZRO8ia33VcopX7yqxgxM0PmNn1d-Ce$> >>
>> "These days I prefer to hunt with a camera. A good photograph demands
>> more skill from the hunter, better nerves and more patience than the rifle
>> shot." -- Bror Blixen
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Feb 13, 2025 at 1:11 PM "J. Merrill Lynch" <
>> <carolinabirds...> wrote:
>>
>> I agree this would be a good thing to support. Many other states already
>> have a special permit for access to public gamelands. A requirement to wear
>> blaze orange during hunting season would be a sensible addition.
>>
>> And I also agree it would give the non-hunting community a bigger seat at
>> the table on decisions regarding public lands management.
>>
>> J. Merrill Lynch
>> Echo Valley Farm
>> Watauga County, NC
>> Elevation: 3,400 feet
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Feb 13, 2025 at 11:16 AM Ann Robertson <carolinabirds...>
>> wrote:
>>
>> Dear Carolinabirders,
>>
>> In this morning's Coastal Review, I read about an exciting proposal from
>> the NC Wildlife Resources Commission to offer a "Conservation Access
>> Pass". This would be the birder equivalent of a hunting / fishing license,
>> and would renew annually. The pass would provide entry to 2 million acres
>> of gameland, boating access areas, and more. It is not limited to birders;
>> a range of recreational uses are mentioned
>>
>> There are three public meetings across the state, coming up soon. There's
>> also a VIRTUAL meeting on March 4th, for which you may register.
>>
>> I was told a while back by a politically experienced birder that one
>> reason birders don't carry as much weight with state officials as hunters
>> is that we don't contribute to the public till with special taxes,
>> licenses, etc. Apparently, at one time a "birders' tax" was proposed on
>> items such as binoculars, birdseed, etc., that would have fed into
>> conservation. Our flock apparently did not endorse this, sadly.
>>
>> I may be wrong, and wiser heads may weigh in, but I believe this
>> Conservation Access Pass would be a win-win. It would provide access to
>> wonderful birding areas while funding our under-resourced NCWRC. Here's a
>> link to the article so you may consider this issue:
>> https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://coastalreview.org/2025/02/state-seeks-feedback-on-proposed-conservation-access-pass/__;!!OToaGQ!pHaqrS5OonhEOPTj4cSvybrRcMu-Gyjj1y8g8rJZ_qB2fMDVl21zJy8yQk-FMevXupiX3-iMLupFfkNJcmZQOxI$ >> <https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://coastalreview.org/2025/02/state-seeks-feedback-on-proposed-conservation-access-pass/__;!!OToaGQ!sQbft_AcXNQj8ledwFhYKky5NbZn7hca1wSaI14YgPSug_57wpicBzaStZZ4T4YPmUX3aRzPCYnXvYK17yBxJIbgMXyGXw$> >>
>> Best regards,
>> Ann Blue Robertson
>> Winston-Salem
>>
>>
>>
>
