Date: 7/30/19 7:15 pm
From: Tim Rodenkirk <timrodenkirk...>
Subject: [obol] Re: Titmouse Oak or Juniper?
PS: I am guilty of calling those Adel birds Juniper based on location.
Maybe that works maybe it doesn’t. I know there has been past work done on
distribution but times are a changing and if I read the old research
correctly it could be that Oak can expand into Juniper habitat but not visa
versa? That is all so old now though- who knows what is happening? Maybe
something OBRC should be checking on? What happens on eBird when we get Oak
Titmice reports from K-Falls, all assumed correct? I thought that was
within the hybrid zone originally studied but I think people are just
calling then Oaks and moving on- should these be reviewed, how would we be
able to separate the species???

What a mess- worthy of further discussion on OBOL!

Tim R
In SW OR

On Tue, Jul 30, 2019 at 6:59 PM Tim Rodenkirk <timrodenkirk...>
wrote:

> All the eBird stuff aside Tom I think people assume that their location
> may mean it is one species or the other- period. That means that although
> there may be lots of records of one species or the other in CA or even OR
> (on eBird or wherever) can these observations be based on actually sight
> and sound ID- or do people just assume it is one species or the other and
> record that into eBird as per the old standards (which do not help anyone
> trying to figure out what is where)? So eBird records, at least on the
> Eastside in OR, without good documentation, should really be called
> Titmouse sp. Bet that hasn’t been happening! Such a mess...
>
> Tim R
> way over in Coos County
>
> On Tue, Jul 30, 2019 at 5:27 PM Alan Contreras <acontrer56...>
> wrote:
>
>> Thanks Tom. I have no idea what the hybrid situation is like. As is
>> often the case, Oregon is a Zone of Complications.
>>
>>
>> Alan Contreras
>> <acontrer56...>
>> Eugene, Oregon
>>
>> www.alanlcontreras.com
>>
>>
>>
>> On Jul 30, 2019, at 5:25 PM, Tom Crabtree <tc...> wrote:
>>
>> Alan,
>>
>> Here are two maps for comparison. First is Juniper Titmouse. There are
>> no records in eBird west of what the map shows.
>>
>> <image001.png>
>>
>> The next is of Oak Titmouse. There are no records east of what this
>> shows:
>>
>> <image004.jpg>
>>
>>
>> There are no records for Oak Titmouse in Nevada according to the Nevada
>> Bird Records Committee (or in eBird for that matter). As the map shows,
>> Adel is due north of the Nevada state line.
>>
>> Tom Crabtree
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* <obol-bounce...> [mailto:<obol-bounce...>
>> <obol-bounce...>] *On Behalf Of *Alan Contreras
>> *Sent:* Tuesday, July 30, 2019 3:15 PM
>> *To:* <aslamoreaux...>
>> *Cc:* <obol...>
>> *Subject:* [obol] Re: Titmouse Oak or Juniper?
>>
>> As far as I know there are no known specimens or otherwise proven Oak
>> Titmouse east of California and the s. Klamath River of Oregon and all the
>> ones in Nevada are considered Juniper.
>>
>> I’m not sure if anyone has studied the ones in Lake County Oregon but I’m
>> not sure why they’d be presumed Oak. That said, there is very little
>> Juniper T population in nw Nevada according to the state atlas and I’m not
>> sure where the populations connect.
>>
>> Joel, what’s the status around Sheldon?
>>
>>
>> Alan Contreras
>> <acontrer56...>
>> Eugene, Oregon
>>
>> www.alanlcontreras.com
>>
>>
>>
>> On Jul 30, 2019, at 3:06 PM, Alex Lamoreaux <aslamoreaux...>
>> wrote:
>>
>> Also, is there any real evidence those Adel area birds are actually
>> Juniper... they are almost certainly hybrids or just Oak.
>>
>>
>> Alex
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Mon, Jul 29, 2019 at 8:38 PM Larry S. Goodhew <lsg...>
>> wrote:
>>
>> This is a titmouse I saw 10/21/18 in Klamath Falls It may be to brownish
>> to be a Juniper. Would like some feedback. Thanks. Larry Goodhew
>> Walla walla.
>>
>> You have been sent 1 picture.
>>
>> IMG_4755.JPG
>>
>> These pictures were sent with Picasa, from Google.
>> Try it out here: http://picasa.google.com/
>>
>> --
>> Alex Lamoreaux
>> 717-943-7086
>> Naturalist and Senior Leader/North America Specialist for Wildside Nature
>> Tours
>> https://wildsidenaturetours.com/team-member/alex-lamoreaux/
>>
>>
>>

 
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